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Do Baptists Seek Presence of Holy Spirit in Worship?

Discussion in 'Polls Forum' started by HopefulNChrist, Oct 4, 2018.

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  1. Yes, because you can't put God in a box

    50.0%
  2. No, because then you can't test the spirits at all

    50.0%
  1. HopefulNChrist

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    John 14:16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever; 17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.

    1 John 4:1Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world...… 4 Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

    That is how you test the spirits by knowing that the Holy Spirit is in you, and so the spirit of the antichrist is outside of you seeking to seduce you in seeking their presence to be felt in the worship place. Any believer that feels a spirit coming over you apart from salvation, should know that is NOT the real Holy Spirit when He is already in you as promised at your salvation at the calling of the gospel.
     
  2. Jerome

    Jerome Well-Known Member
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    Southern Baptist pastors' Dallas prayer meeting called Spirit-infused 'epic moment'

    "'There were many who believed this was an epic moment,' Ronnie Floyd, senior pastor of Cross Church in northwest Arkansas, told Baptist Press. 'Some even declared it was the greatest spiritual experience with their peers that they had ever had, anywhere, at any time,' Floyd said....The Holy Spirit moved as men shared from God's Word, worshipped and prayed, Floyd said."

    "One of the most unique and spiritually beneficial meetings I have ever attended" — Kevin Ueckert, chairman of trustees, SWBTS

    "I love the sound of pastors lifting up strong voices in praise to God" — Bart Barber, first vice president of the SBC

    "Fantastic time of prayer and worship" — Matt Carter, council member, The Gospel Coalition

    "The Lord broke out tonight on Dallas." — Les Hughes, senior pastor of Highview Baptist Church, Louisville, Ky.
     
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  3. Reynolds

    Reynolds Well-Known Member
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    The Spirit is omnipresent. I think the proper question would be "Do Baptists seek the manifest presence of The Spirit?". In my opinion, sadly the answer is 99.9% no.
    Your survey questions are extremely flawed.
     
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  4. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    Do we yield to Him?
     
  5. Squire Robertsson

    Squire Robertsson Administrator
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    Your answers are too terse for me to choose from.
    But, yes, I do expect the Holy Spirit to be present during the services of the Church.
     
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  6. JonShaff

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    @Reynolds
    Yes, the manifest presence of the Spirit of God. The Glory filled the Temple of God in the OT. How much more should we expect the manifest presence of God in the New Temple, the gathering of the saints?
     
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  7. HopefulNChrist

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    Same rudiment as the slain in the spirit & holy laughter. They were feeling the "presence of the Holy Spirit" in that place and that is a seducing spirit for why they are hungering for more of that to happen again. Read all the quotes from the attendees there.

    -- Chris Robeson (@chrisrobeson), senior pastor of Friendly Baptist Church in Tyler, Texas: "God was in the room and strengthening hearts of pastors to press forward and go all in for His glory!"

    -- Kevin Ward (@SalemBroKevin), pastor of Salem Springs Baptist Church in Athens, Ala.: "Let us not get over quickly meeting with God. May He stay fresh in our hearts each and every day."

    Michael Catt (@MichaelCatt), senior pastor of Sherwood Baptist Church in Albany, Ga., said afterward he felt encouraged, hungry for more of God, and a longing for others to feel the same.

    "NOW praying for a MOMENT to be a MOVEMENT!" Catt wrote

    It was hard to discern the spirit reading that article until I read the rest of the quotes from the attendees. They were glorifying feeling His Presence in the room for why they were having a "spiritual awakening". They were not referring to any scripture reference or edification for that awakening but feeling God's Presence moving among those praying in that room.

    That is the effect of seducing spirits when tempting believers to seek after that moment again for a sign.

    The focus of the Son in fellowship in word and prayer just went to that visitation of what they assume was the Holy Spirit.

    That is no different between that moment and the moments in the Pentecostals / Charismatics movements like the slain in the spirit and holy laughter. It is just more passive, but still the truth of this discernment is that the Holy Spirit is in you, and the spirit of the antichrist is outside of you to be felt in the worship place and even infilling believers after a sign to seduce believers in chasing after that moment again.

    That was not a spiritual revival. That was an example of falling away from the faith in giving heed to seducing spirits and doctrines of devils, looking for the visitation of the Holy Spirit when He is in you as promised since your salvation.
     
  8. HopefulNChrist

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    Maybe not so flawed now. See second post in this thread in regards to the source of these quotes.

    -- Chris Robeson (@chrisrobeson), senior pastor of Friendly Baptist Church in Tyler, Texas: "God was in the room and strengthening hearts of pastors to press forward and go all in for His glory!"

    -- Kevin Ward (@SalemBroKevin), pastor of Salem Springs Baptist Church in Athens, Ala.: "Let us not get over quickly meeting with God. May He stay fresh in our hearts each and every day."

    Michael Catt (@MichaelCatt), senior pastor of Sherwood Baptist Church in Albany, Ga., said afterward he felt encouraged, hungry for more of God, and a longing for others to feel the same.

    "NOW praying for a MOMENT to be a MOVEMENT!" Catt wrote
     
  9. HopefulNChrist

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    For a visitation of God or the Holy Spirit as in regards to that link to that article in the #2 post in this thread? No, because He is in us and is with us always.

    2 Corinthians 13:5 Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?

    2 Corinthians 11:3 But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ. 4 For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him.

    That is the examination of our faith and they epically failed it as they are seeking that moment again for others and not just themselves. That is very Pentecostal / Charismatic / Catholic of them.

    -- Chris Robeson (@chrisrobeson), senior pastor of Friendly Baptist Church in Tyler, Texas: "God was in the room and strengthening hearts of pastors to press forward and go all in for His glory!"

    -- Kevin Ward (@SalemBroKevin), pastor of Salem Springs Baptist Church in Athens, Ala.: "Let us not get over quickly meeting with God. May He stay fresh in our hearts each and every day."

    Michael Catt (@MichaelCatt), senior pastor of Sherwood Baptist Church in Albany, Ga., said afterward he felt encouraged, hungry for more of God, and a longing for others to feel the same.

    "NOW praying for a MOMENT to be a MOVEMENT!" Catt wrote
     
  10. HopefulNChrist

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    If you acknowledge that the Holy Spirit is in you always, then He is already present at that worship service by being in you.

    The spirit of the antichrist is the spirit seeking to move the spotlight away from the Son in worship to tempting believers to see its presence in the worship place.

    We either worship God IN Spirit & IN Truth or we are worshipping a moment where we seek to feel a presence in the worship place that makes us feel good; hence seducing spirits.
     
  11. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    Not necessarily.

    1 Timothy 4:1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
    2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;
    3 Forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth.
    4 For every creature of God is good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving:
    5 For it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer.


    verses 2 and 3 being the test as well.
     
  12. HopefulNChrist

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    Thank you for sharing, brother, but I hope you do not mean that all those things must be present in regards to testing the spirits.

    Here is what the scripture is speaking against... as I hope the Lord will cause the increase as only He can.

    Matthew 24:23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not. 24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect. 25 Behold, I have told you before. 26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not.

    That is referring to the Spirit of Christ as well. Here is why.

    1 John 4:1Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world. 2 Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:

    The underlined phrase "is come" means presently so Biblical scholars are wrong in applying verse 2 out of context of the topic of testing the spirit to mean refuting the heresy of Christ has never come in the flesh. Testing the spirits IS about testing the spirits.

    Verse 2 is the same thing as saying this below.

    2 Corinthians 13:5 Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?

    That is what 1 John 4:2 means when it is about where the Spirit of Christ is presently... in us. Jesus can make that clearer by the next 2 verses in testing the spirits.

    1 John 4:3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world. 4 Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

    Si by knowing that the Holy Spirit is in you, then any spirit felt outside of you and even coming over you later on in life apart from salvation is NOT the Holy Spirit. To blur that line of discernment makes it impossible to test the spirits.

    This is why believers go astray when that "moment" brings tongues without interpretation for why they are assuming it is for private use when it is not, because the world has that kind of supernatural tongue that is just gibberish.

    1 John 4:5 They are of the world: therefore speak they of the world, and the world heareth them. 6 We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error.

    That is why that kind of tongue is always linked to that apostate calling of seeking a baptism of the Holy Ghost with evidence of tongues apart from salvation.

    But the less passive approach of this apostasy is how a moment of feeling what they believe was His Presence in the worship place leads others to seek after that moment again, not realizing that they are chasing after seducing spirits aka the spirit of the antichrist. They need to repent of this hypocrisy of saying... yeah the Holy Spirit is in me and yet they go chasing after Him to receive Him again, even an infilling of the Holy Spirit.

    That is why in relation to the other thread, there is no need for a continual filling unless by such a mentality, a supernatural phenomenon occurs by which they are chasing after those seducing spirits to receive again for a sign.
     
  13. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    Yes, one should avoid it.
     
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  14. JonShaff

    JonShaff Fellow Servant
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    Should avoid what? Experiencing the Presence of God?
     
  15. JonShaff

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    Are you saying it's evil to desire to experience the Presence of God while worshipping Him? You do realize that the "presence of God" is what was lost in the Garden, right? and God desired to bring us back into fellowship with Him, again to experience His Presence. The Entire OT has a thread that runs all the way through it concerning the "Presence of God"--Think Tabernacle, Temple. You have done a pendulum swing...because there are fringe groups that desire unbiblical experiences with God you have gone to the extreme, entirely kicking out the presence of God altogether.
     
  16. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Baptists seek to ahve the Holy Spirit to be incontrol of the entire church service start to finish, as He wants to glorify Jesus in the praise and worship, in the teaching, and in working in and through people afterwards!
     
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  17. Reynolds

    Reynolds Well-Known Member
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    Really? I have never seen it.
     
  18. HopefulNChrist

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    You cannot refer to where the Presence of God dwells as per the Old Covenant as if that remains the same for the New Covenant.

    I am sure you know the answer to this, but you need to acknowledge it to apply this correction towards what you are saying.

    Remember Jesus answering the woman at the well her question about where to worship God? Jesus said neither in the mountains nor in Jerusalem as those who come to God shall come to Him IN spirit & IN truth. The how is by coming to the Son in coming to God the Father in worshipping Him by. That is why the place of worship is no longer a specific place to go to in order to do that.

    Remember what has changed in according to the new covenant.

    1 Corinthians 6:19 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own? 20 For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's.

    2 Corinthians 13:5 Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?

    That is the new reality for all believers in Jesus Christ whether they acknowledge this or not, but for those in hypocrisy in seeking His Presence in the worship place even though they know He is in them, they blur the line of discernment given by the apostle John in how to test the spirits because if the Holy Spirit would continue to be felt outside the body of believers, then no one can test for the spirit of the antichrist.

    Plus.. the Holy Spirit always indwelling and thus always infilled in the believer, would keep the spotlight on the Son in worship whereas seducing spirits would not. Since seducing spirits visits with signs and lying wonders, why would the indwelling Holy Spirit do the same just to be felt in the worship place? He would not.

    The only way you will know the real Holy Spirit is by Him dwelling in you.

    John 14:16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever; 17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.

    Is the Presence of the Holy Spirit going to be in the third Temple during the great tribulation? Nope. Then why believe He would be outside of you in your place of worship? Him being in you is as close any believer can be.
     
  19. HopefulNChrist

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    Baptists should not act like Pentecostals, Charismatics, and Catholics in seeking the Presence of the Holy Spirit in worship.

    Even my former church began communion when I was going there with "We come into His Presence today.." like what!!!? He is in me and is with me always. I am not coming into His Presence in having communion!! Am I walking away from His Presence after communion? No. Then why say that? It is not in the N.T. for how to begin a service like that, but there is a warning.

    Luke 13:24 Strive to enter in at the strait gate: for many, I say unto you, will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. 25 When once the master of the house is risen up, and hath shut to the door, and ye begin to stand without, and to knock at the door, saying, Lord, Lord, open unto us; and he shall answer and say unto you, I know you not whence ye are: 26 Then shall ye begin to say, We have eaten and drunk in thy presence, and thou hast taught in our streets. 27 But he shall say, I tell you, I know you not whence ye are; depart from me, all ye workers of iniquity. 28 There shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when ye shall see Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, and all the prophets, in the kingdom of God, and you yourselves thrust out. 29 And they shall come from the east, and from the west, and from the north, and from the south, and shall sit down in the kingdom of God. 30 And, behold, there are last which shall be first, and there are first which shall be last.:

    Can the words of our church in how they start communion be grounds for which all believers will be judged by for denying Him?

    Can seeking the Presence of God in the worship place at all be seen as not keeping the faith which is the good fight?

    2 Corinthians 13:5 Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?

    Colossians 1:27 To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory: 28 Whom we preach, warning every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus:

    How does a Baptist apply this warning? By seeking the Presence of the Holy Spirit in the worship place as if He is not in them or by NOT seeking the Presence of the Holy Spirit in the worship place BECAUSE He is in them?
     
  20. JonShaff

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    James 4:8

    8 Draw near to God and He will draw near to you.

    Is this some Abstract idea or philosophy? NO! God will draw close to you, experientially!

    Stop with your foolishness. You are divisive and you spew lies. You have demonstrated your hypocrisy with your visions and dreams and then call me out for speaking on the Presence of God. Repent.
     
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