If there were no textual variants for John 3:16, then there should have never been a problem with the interpretation of 'begotten', yet the NIV changed it to "one and only Son" which obscures the meaning of monogenes.
Even though the NIV followed the Majority text (with the exception of begotten) for verse 16, the text used for John 3 was the Siniaticus, Vaticanus, and the Egyptian Papyri P66 and P75 (the only ones that contain the NIV rendition of John 3:13 that removes "who is in heaven") Since P66 and P75 do not agree with each other, those are variant texts that were used in by the NIV translating committee on John chapter 3.
John 3:16 does not leave room for compare and contrast arguments such as Calvinists attempt to do with Romans 5. There is only one subject in John 3:16 that is the recipient of eternal life and it's whosoever believes.
Does One Size Fit All?
Discussion in 'Bible Versions & Translations' started by Rippon, May 5, 2013.
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The translation "only begotten" presents problems for many readers.
It suggests that there was a time earlier when God the Son was not begotten
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No Problem Here...
Bro.Greg:saint: -
Nevertheless, I was responding to Rippon's contention that there were no variant readings of John 3 which he used as an argument that Mark 16 could not be compared to the John 3 issue because Mark 16 had variant readings. I was showing that that was not true. -
Perhaps this would be better to deal with this in another thread but here we are… I’ll not start another.
On a personal note, in years past I memorized John 3:16 using the phrase “only begotten” and it comes quite naturally to my tongue.
Let me try and communicate your position and let me know if I’ve misrepresented you.
You are most comfortable using an older, traditional translation that uses the phrase “only begotten” to translate the Greek word, μονογενής [monogenēs].
You believe that the possible confusion that results with God the Son being understood as a created being, (someone that was begotten by the Father), isn’t really so important and it doesn’t bother you in the least.
WHERE DO I STAND - I believe that God’s words don’t need correcting, after all they are divinely inspired.
The problem here however lies not with the original words but with the words the translators of older versions chose to represent the Greek Scriptures they were translating.
I’ve had a few problems over the years the way this verse is translated in some versions, particularly in the way it interplays with Colossians 1:15 (“firstborn”).
I find it extremely difficult to communicate the proper meaning of “begotten” to innocents and new believers.
Older commentators believe as we do. The gist of the older commentators is that monogenēs (which they translated as “only begotten”) means “unique”, preeminent, “only one”
Why not translate it that way and avoid the confusion.
So to answer the original question, "Does one version fit all?"
I FEEL that comparing many translations provides a person with a better understanding of the complexities of translation and helps a person to know the meaning of Scripture better.
Rob -
A Literal Translation of John 3:16
Thusly for loved the God the world so that the son only one he gave so that every one the believing into him no perish but have life eternal. -
This is what the text actually says:
Οὕτως γὰρ ἠγάπησεν ὁ θεὸς τὸν κόσμον ὥστε τὸν υἱὸν αὐτοῦ τὸν μονογενῆ ἔδωκεν ἵνα πᾶς ὁ πιστεύων εἰς αὐτὸν μὴ ἀπόληται ἀλλ᾽ ἔχῃ ζωὴν αἰώνιον
(the bold print would be the 'monogenes' for those who can't read Greek) -
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Simply holding to a tradition of using the oblique word begotten is not the way to go.
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But even if one feels the need to explain begotten, if that hangs you up more than explaining the death, burial and resurrection, salvation by grace through faith, and the deity of Christ in verses that are obvious on the subject (I have never used John 3:16 with a Jehovah's Witness), then there may be a need to step back and examine your presentation. I have lead several thousand people to Christ, and I have never been stuck on 'begotten'. A ten second explanation isn't going to ruin or confuse the presentation. There's an easy way to avoid creating hoops: don't.
And if I was unsaved, and you pulled out all 4 of those versions on me, I would be calling 911 or possibly shoot you because you look like you're getting ready to sell me something. Since Peter said to always be ready, I carry a pocket NT with me everywhere I go and sometimes a pocket edition of the whole Bible (when talking to my fellow Jewish friends). I have never used anything other than one KJV and it has worked just fine!
And on the AAS, they label ALL of Christianity into the same lump (such as blaming the entire church for the atrocities committed by Rome during the Dark Ages-Oh, and John Calvin, just had to throw that in there :) ) But they at least do have a valid point that thousands of different Bibles do create confusion. Even a broken clock is right twice a day. (Matthew 23:3). -
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That he can do quite well with Kjv/Nasb/Niv, as all would be the word of God to us in english? -
Regarding John 3:16
I appreciate James White's book :The Potter's Freedom. In it he quotes from John Owen's work The Death of Death in the Death of Christ page 214)
"If this word whosoever be distributive,then it is restrictive of the love of God to some,and not to others,--to one part of the distribution,and not to the other. And if it do not restrain the love of God,intending the salvation of some,then it is not distributive of the forementioned object of it;and if it do restrain it,then all are not intended in the love which moved God to give his Son. Secondly,I deny that the word here is distributive of the object of God's love,but only declarative of his end and aim in giving Christ in the pursuit of that love,-- to wit,that all believers might be saved. So that the sense is,'God so loved his elect throughout the world,that he gave his Son with this intention,that by him believers might be saved.' And this is all that is by any (besides a few worthless cavils)objected from this place to disprove our interpretation..." -
In James White's book :The Potter's Freedom,he takes on Norman Giesler's book called :Chosen But Free.
"John 3:16 is cited by CBF over and over again as indication that there is no particularity to God's work of salvation. The idea that the term 'world' could possibly mean anything other than every single individual (despite the fact that all serious exegetes recognize a wide variety of uses of this term in the New Testament and especially in John's writings ,for example,John 17:9 and 1 John 2:15) is simply dismissed by CBF on numerous occasions. Furthermore,the common misconception that John 3:16 uses an indefinite phrase,'whosoever,' is presented as evidence against the particularity of God's work of redemption. However,anyone familiar with the text as it was written knows that the literal rendering of the passage is 'in order that every one believing in him should not perish but have eternal life.' The verse teaches that the giving of the Son guarantees the salvation of all the believing ones."
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