No, he isn't. You are the one honing in on the trees, Jon. You are missing the forest.
Jon, all humans reject God. If it were not for God choosing to redeem men, no one would be saved.
"But God..."
"Salvation belongs to the Lord."
~ Jonah 2:9
God's desire
Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Van, Aug 11, 2022.
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Silverhair Well-Known Member
Is this a true statement "God hath decreed in himself, from all eternity, by the most wise and holy counsel of
His own will, freely and unchangeably, all things, whatsoever comes to pass"... LBCF 3/1
Let these words sink into your cranium
1Ti 2:3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior,
1Ti 2:4 who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.
Rom 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ, for it is the power of God to salvation for everyone who believes, for the Jew first and also for the Greek.
Eph 1:13 In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise,
You deny scripture and trumpet your Calvinistic philosophy. The sad part is that I do not think you even understand the theology you claim to follow. -
Silverhair Well-Known Member
What you continue to ignore is that if Calvinism were true then all those that reject God do so because He has decreed that they do so. Calvinism destroys the character of God and all Calvinists need to repent of such a vile idea. -
"Salvation belongs to the Lord."
Solely to the Lord, and no one else.
"But God, even while we were still dead..."
What you continue to ignore is that the Bible tells us it is solely God and no one else. You keep living in this mythology that if Calvin hadn't lived, what is observed in the Bible wouldn't have been expressed to us and by us. You keep treating Calvin as though he were a cult leader, when in fact he was an ordinary person just writing down his observation of the Bible...the whole, entire Bible. Calvin simply did a much better job than you do. It seems you are jealous of the gifts God gave him that you don't possess. Is that it? You're jealous and that's why you are obsessed with him? It pangs you to know you are terrible at hermeneutics while Calvin was astute? It seems the mystery is solved. You're jealous. -
"But God..." -
Silverhair Well-Known Member
Look at scripture, God saves and He saves those that trust in His son. That is what galls you the most, the bible refutes your theology.
As far a Calvin goes your the one that follows him not me and I do not care what he said. Sorry to burst your bubble. -
This does not mean it pleases God for the lost to rebel against Him. That is the point of so many passages.
Those who do not come to a knowledge of the truth are disobedient to God's will.
Your view is called "hyper Calvinism". It sees some truths and, to borrow from Spurgeon, misapplies the truth that it sees via inflating those truths out of its proper context. -
Does God desire all people (1 Timothy 2:4) to be saved unconditionally, or only according to His redemption plan?
Since all people are not saved, for example the person headed for swift destruction in 2 Peter 2:1, then God's desire is not unconditionally applied, but conditionally applied, to those whose faith in Christ He credits as righteous faith.
In order to make this possibility of salvation available to all humanity, Christ died as a ransom for all (1 Timothy 2:6. -
Did Christ lay down His life as a ransom for all? Yes 1 Timothy 2:6
Does God desire all people to be saved? Yes 1 Timothy 2:4
Does God choose people for salvation through faith in the truth? Yes 2 Thessalonians 2:13
Did Paul speak as to men of flesh using spiritual milk, the fundamentals of the gospel? Yes 1 Corinthians 3:1-3.
Does "through faith" require that the faith existed and was utilized to accomplish the action in view? Yes. Ephesians 2:8-9
Does John 3:16 say everyone believing rather than everyone of the elect believing? Yes
I could go on, but all Falselogy has to offer is deflection and absurdity. -
Silverhair Well-Known Member
Is this a true statement
"God hath decreed in himself, from all eternity, by the most wise and holy counsel of His own will, freely and unchangeably, all things, whatsoever comes to pass"... LBCF 3/1
I mean it is just a YES or NO answer. -
Silverhair Well-Known Member
"...always bear in mind, that there is no random power, or agency, or motion in the creatures, who are so governed by the secret counsel of God, that nothing happens but what he has knowingly and willingly decreed." Bk 1/ Chp 16/ Sec 3 J. Calvin’s Institutes
"Hence we maintain, that by his providence, not heaven and earth and inanimate creatures only, but also the counsels and wills of men are so governed as to move exactly in the course which he has destined." Bk 1/ Chp 16/ Sec 8 J. Calvin’s Institutes
"God hath decreed in himself, from all eternity, by the most wise and holy counsel of His own will, freely and unchangeably, all things, whatsoever comes to pass"... LBCF 3/1
If as Calvin and the LBCF state, God has decreed all thing to be done exactly and unchangeably as He has decreed then all the sin, violence, corruption etc. is only what God has decreed to happen. All those that reject God do so because He decreed it. Your theology has made God into a moral monster.
You are so blinded by your philosophy that you will not see the truth. So get of your high horse and trust what scripture says. -
Jude 1:10-11 But these speak evil of those things which they know not: but what they know naturally, as brute beasts, in those things they corrupt themselves. Woe unto them! for they have gone in the way of Cain, and ran greedily after the error of Balaam for reward, and perished in the gainsaying of Core.
And, yes, they were destined for it:
1 Peter 2:7-8 Unto you therefore which believe he is precious: but unto them which be disobedient,
The stone which the builders disallowed,
The same is made the head of the corner,
and
A stone of stumbling, and a rock of offence,
even to them which stumble at the word, being disobedient: whereunto also they were appointed.
Romans 8:7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
(emphasis mine) -
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Silverhair Well-Known Member
Do you deny what Calvin and the LBCF stated or are you just going to hope no one notices the inconsistency of your theology.
Remember, under your theology those that were destined for destruction were so because God decreed it, not because of anything they did. Look at your theology with out the Calvi glasses. It is horrible. You destroy the character of God and see this as not a problem. -
Silverhair Well-Known Member
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Silverhair Well-Known Member
I trust the bible but I do not trust the errant interpretation that you place on it. -
Silverhair Well-Known Member
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