That verse says nothing about selecting only a few. In fact it makes it clear it is much more than that.
God's Soveriegnty
Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by Revmitchell, Jan 15, 2013.
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Revmitchell Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
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"Behold! the lamb of God that takes away the sin of the world!" (John 1:29)
"And the bread that I shall give is my flesh, which I shall give for the life of the world." (John 6:51)
(And while we're in John's Gospel, let's not forget John 3:16)
"And He Himself is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the whole world." (1 John 2:2)
"who gave Himself a ransom for all" (1 Tim 2:6)
"who is the Savior of all men, especially of those who believe" (1 Tim 4:10)
"But we see Jesus...that He by the grace of God might taste death for everyone" (Heb 2:9)
Of course, there is plenty more, and there is nothing in the context of any of these verses that restrict the "world", "all men" or "everyone" to mean "only the elect". And the Calvinists err by: (1) reading such a restriction INTO those texts, and by (2) concluding that the passages which speak of Christ dying for His Church, sheep, etc, necessarily imply that He died ONLY for His elect (but of course the word "only" isn't found in such passages).
One might as well conclude, based on that "logic", that Christ only died for PAUL since Paul stated that Christ loved HIM and gave Himself for HIM (see GAL 2:20--no mention of Christ loving, or giving Himself, for the "world", or the "elect" or the sheep in THAT verse, just Paul :smilewinkgrin: ).
So, yeah, it's true that Christ died for His sheep in a special sense, in that His Church actually enjoys the benefits of His atonement by grace through faith, but this in no way rules out the truth (stated the passages quoted above) that Christ made atonement provisionally on the cross for the whole world (in fact, 1 Tim 4:10 teaches both)
"Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts; Let him return to the Lord, and He will have mercy on him, and to our God and He will abundantly pardon." (Isaiah 55:7)
(Hmmm...here God states He will show mercy on those who repent--looks like what we have here is a sovereignly determined condition that man must meet in order to receive mercy) -
Revmitchell Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
It is pretty tough when you have to deny the clear and plain teaching in scripture ie "the world".
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Earth Wind and Fire Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
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Earth Wind and Fire Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
I for one prefer not to veer in that direction. Thanks but NO thanks. -
"...whom God set forth as a propitiation by His blood THROUGH FAITH..." Romans 3:25
For those who don't receive Christ, God's wrath abides on them still (John 3:36). Yet, we were all (elect included) enemies of God (Rom 5:10) and by nature children of wrath before coming to Christ (Eph 2:3)--even those of us born after the Atonement was made. So you see? God's wrath abides on the elect until they are actually IN CHRIST and reconciled to God.
You still haven't answered the fact that in Jeremiah 18:1-11, God clearly proclaims He takes creaturely contingency into consideration in exercising His sovereign judgments. -
Revmitchell Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
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Revmitchell Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
No where in John 3:16 does it say the world of the elect. That is eisegetical at best.
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Are their sinners in hell there even though Jesus paid their full sin debt to the father on the Cross? -
Revmitchell Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
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Revmitchell Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
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Thinkingstuff Active Member
Though sinners in hell before going to hell could have accessed salvation they rejected it and are now in hell. -
that htere is a real chance none could have gotten saved, all could have freely rejected Him? -
Earth Wind and Fire Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
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Revmitchell Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
Another statement based on a false premise. -
Earth Wind and Fire Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
"...in terms of eternal salvation the only ingredients were Christ's obedience, the Father's will, and the Triune God's mercy and grace..." pinoybaptist [Amen pinoy!]
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