Forget about demons. The only thing one needs to know is that they tremble, and if you ain't tremblin' you don't believe. That's James' point.
No one chooses to fear God. One either fears Him or not. And if one fears Him, it's because He believes in Him, and knows Him. And no one chooses to believe in God. He either does, or he doesn't. It's a state of being. One could sooner choose to grow wings and fly before he could choose to believe something that he doesn't.
You have the typical, Pelagian understanding of James. James did not in anyway say that a man could believe and yet not be saved. He was countering their claims. One cannot claim to have faith, and yet have no works, and one cannot claim to believe in one God, and yet not tremble.
One's choices are dictated by what he believes, not vice versa.
I don't recall offering one. You should apologize to God for your sloppy and shallow handling of His Word.
Which is counter-Scriptural. If you had looked up the verses I cited, you wouldn't have attempted an unrevised wording of your position. The fact of the matter is they DON'T know Him. If they did, they would NOT reject God's commandments. (See verses cited in my previous post.) They "knew" Him after a fashion, but not truly. Though the revelation of nature is clear, they cannot see it clearly, and think it foolishness, and accept a lie, thinking it the truth.
Again, if you had looked up the references I cited, you wouldn't persist in this ludicrous deluge of superstitious drivel.
Forget about the demons. You can't comprehend what the Scriptures say about yourself, and you think you can understand it about things you cannot see?
Here is what you need to know about them. They believe and tremble. James' point? If you believe, you'll tremble too. That's it.
I'll let Paul himself counter your false interpretation:
But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned, 1 Cor 2:14
isn't the ULTIMATE Source of salvation In Classic Arminianism Ourselves?
Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by JesusFan, Jun 1, 2011.
Page 4 of 9
-
-
It is true that the natural man cannot understand the things of God without the Spirit. But this cannot be speaking of the gospel, and it is not saying man lacks the ability to believe. Note 1 Cor 2:12.
1 Cor 2:12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.
This verse says we have RECEIVED the Spirit that we MIGHT KNOW the things of God given us. How do we receive the Spirit?
Gal 3:2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?
This question naturally implies men receive the Spirit by faith. So 1 Cor 2:14 cannot be speaking of faith or salvation. These persons have already RECEIVED the Spirit by faith. So these "things of God" cannot mean the gospel. It is speaking of a deeper understanding of God's word.
This is also shown by Pro 1:23.
Pro 1:23 Turn you at my reproof: behold, I will pour out my spirit unto you, I will make known my words unto you.
This verse shows the order of events in salvation.
#1 A man hears the reproof of God and turns in faith and repentance to God.
#2 God pours out his Spirit to this person who has repented/believed.
#3 Through the Spirit God makes man to know his words, gives him spiritual discernment of spiritual matters. -
Aaron...
I certainly trembled before I was born of the Spirit, but not since then.
How can you "tremble"...as a believer...when God says...
-
You: "They don't know him."
Paul: "For although they knew God"
I pick Paul. :thumbsup:
You: "they cannot see it clearly"
Paul: " God's invisible qualities--his eternal power and divine nature--have been clearly seen"
Once again, I think I'll go with Paul. :thumbsup:
Secondly, you need to keep reading because Paul goes on to say that the "brethren" there at the church in Corinth also can't receive these "things of God" because they are too carnal and still taking the milk rather than the meat of the word. Paul is not contradicting himself by saying in one passage, "they clearly see and understand" God's revelation and now saying, "they can't clearly see and understand God's revelation unless they are reborn. Instead, he just saying that "the deep things of God" (vs 10), the things only known by the Spirit of God, must be revealed by God in order for us to understand them and we can't do that if we choose to be carnally minded, even as believers. We must walk in the spirit and listen to his instructions if we are going to grow past the milk and into the meat of his truth. -
Iconoclast Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
Allan,
you said;
[QUOTE1. You also state God does not desire them to be saved nor has He provided a way for their salvation
Allan....I believe God saves all He has planned and purposed to save in the eternal Covenant of Redemption.
We know that God takes no delight in the death of the wicked..as we read in Ezekiel. God has often sent prophets and messengers to people....yet not to all.
All have a God given conscience.....and the light of creation as two witnesses against them and their sin.
I know you do not or would not teach it......but sometimes those who do not hold the calvinistic understanding....almost imply that man has a blank slate,or is sort of neutral....just needing a little more info...or a helping hand.
But scripture declares that the wrath of God is revealed from heaven...not the love of God.
God's love is only in Jesus.....not outside of Him.
If a person is seperated from Christ[spiritual death in adam].....he is seperated from God's love.
Yet...we read that God is good to all men....the goodness of God is meant to lead men to repentance.....we are to preach to all men....
From our side as I have posted previously...we are to earnest and faithfully proclaim
Jesus has died for all men
some believe...some do not
result...... unbelievers in hell...second death
Jesus dies only for the elect but we do not know who the elect are..so we preach to All Men......any who believe will be saved
some believe.....some do not
result...... unbelievers in hell...second death
In your view Jesus dies for all...... but does not save all
In my view Jesus saves all he died for....but does not save all
both ideas have believers and unbelievers
your idea has sinners not really dead, just wounded and still able to choose
my idea has all dead sinners unable to respond.....Jesus saves a multitude of them...the Spirit enabling and saving them.
Arminians list verses and say...see HE Believed
Cals say yes...he did believe...and we know how and why he did,jn3:3-11
the unseen work of the Spirit.....not human will:thumbsup:
Will check later ,but must drive again,lol this job gets in the way of my posting,lol -
Hello Icon good to hear from you again.
I will speak only to a couple of points below regarding your post but noted that you did not actually address my question posed to you.
If there no propitiation has been made for the non-elect and God does not desire to save them.. exactly :
1. How can the gospel be offered to those for whom it has not been supplied
2. How can they "repent and believe the gospel" message which is not for them?
3. How can they be condemned for rejecting a message never intended for them?
4. In light of the above how justify the offer of the gospel to the non-elect is valid?
Iconoclast said: ↑But scripture declares that the wrath of God is revealed from heaven...not the love of God.Click to expand...
God's love is only in Jesus.....not outside of Him.
If a person is seperated from Christ[spiritual death in adam].....he is seperated from God's love.
Yet...we read that God is good to all men....the goodness of God is meant to lead men to repentance.....we are to preach to all men....Click to expand...
Again, you state they have no hope, God does not desire them, nor has any propitiation been made for them... what are they being lead to repent for? Repentance is ONLY part of the gospel message for mercy unto God that He might save them through grace. (mercy and grace being two sides of the same coin and all)
Again, if the goodness of God leads them to repentance, the question is why? Biblically what is the purpose of/for repentance - always for God to turn away His wrath, have mercy upon them, and save them.
your idea has sinners not really dead, just wounded and still able to chooseClick to expand...
However, let me toss another question your way regarding this point.
If the term 'dead' or most specifically referring to 'spiritually dead' has a definition should not that definition be consistent in that usage (regarding spiritual) for all instances whereby it is used as such?
Thus when we read in scripture 'we are dead in sins' and 'dead' means unable or inability at all according to you (completely dead as in not able to do, think or believe), then this same definition must be applied to Romans 6:2, 7 referring to believers in the same spiritual sense - 'we are dead to sin' .. 'he that is dead is freed from sin'. Both refer to a state of being, one of being 'IN' sin, the other of 'TO' sin, however both refer to the exact same spiritual condition of 'ability' regarding 'dead'.
Remember that we are 'dead' in sin, thus our deadness is 'to' something or someone - God (who is alive). The 'in sin' describes why we are considered 'dead' as opposed to that which is alive and thus without sin (Col 2:13). Understanding this we also understand that if we are 'dead in sins' (and yes we are), then God is 'dead' TO us, as we are to Him. This is why Paul states we as believers ARE 'dead TO sin', as we are no longer IN our sins therefore whatever is 'in' sin is 'dead to us' as God is 'dead' to them as well (1 Pet 2:24). Yet with respect to ability we note that while in sin we can not please God and thus all our actions of righteousness are soiled. As such, we have no ability to 'do' good or salvic/meritorious works as all we touch is tainted or imbued with our sin. This is why God states only that which is of faith, not works but faith will and is able to please God. The term is in reality speaking to a relational point and contrasting us in sin to God.. and that which is of God to sin.
If your definition holds true then believers should no longer be 'able' or have the ability to sin as we see here the scriptures declare that we are 'dead' to them.. and the one who is dead is freed from sin. However a small issue crops up a little later in the same chapter where it states not only that we ARE dead but that we are also to 'consider' ourselves dead to sin. So now it appears that our spiritual inability to sin is contrast with the fact that though we are 'dead', we apparently have the 'ability' to do contrary to our nature. -
Iconoclast Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
Allan,
drove all night...need to sleep now,,,but quickly
I believe Romans 1 Paul is describing how men all the way back to the time of adam have been in rebellion and truth suppressors, and it continues after the flood ,up to the present day..
My answer to your question was put forth in two parts
positively from Gods purpose...then the Hebrews 10 passage as well as the last portion.....I will respond later on ...but must sleep now...am burnt like toast right now,lol -
Iconoclast said: ↑Allan,
drove all night...need to sleep now,,,but quickly
I believe Romans 1 Paul is describing how men all the way back to the time of adam have been in rebellion and truth suppressors, and it continues after the flood ,up to the present day..
My answer to your question was put forth in two parts
positively from Gods purpose...then the Hebrews 10 passage as well as the last portion.....I will respond later on ...but must sleep now...am burnt like toast right now,lolClick to expand...
Real quick on the above.. so you hold it was a one time historical event for the chapters 1 - 3 as they actually go together..? -
Iconoclast Well-Known MemberSite SupporterAllan said: ↑Yes.. do get some sleep! I know the feeling.. every Sunday into Monday I go for 32 to 38 hours before I get to sleep.
Real quick on the above.. so you hold it was a one time historical event for the chapters 1 - 3 as they actually go together..?Click to expand...
I believe He is trying to show that all men everywhere are condemned and the only hope for the world, jew/gentile is in the person and work of our Lord Jesus Christ.
The Jew having the oracles of God, THe gentiles having the law in their conscience, and before Abraham there was a time when God had spoken directly with man.....and they turned from it.....God gave them over3x
idolatry,sodomites, reprobate mind, man has devolved...all guilty and condemned.....tower of babel, dividing the languages, nations
Paul uses this dark backround to highlight the pearl of great price.
9What then? are we better than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin;
10As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:
11There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.
12They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one.
13Their throat is an open sepulchre; with their tongues they have used deceit; the poison of asps is under their lips:
14Whose mouth is full of cursing and bitterness:
15Their feet are swift to shed blood:
16Destruction and misery are in their ways:
17And the way of peace have they not known:
18There is no fear of God before their eyes.
19Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.
20Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.
21But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets;
22Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:
23For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;
24Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:
25Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;
26To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.
27Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith.
28Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.Click to expand... -
Skandelon said: ↑No, James' point is that faith without works is dead.Click to expand...
<snip erroneous notions about demons>
But one can choose to trade in what they KNOW to be truth for a lie, which is the point Paul is making. They inherently, by nature, know God . . . blah, blah, blah.Click to expand...
Paul: "For although they knew God"Click to expand...
Paul: " God's invisible qualities--his eternal power and divine nature--have been clearly seen"Click to expand...
Once again, I think I'll go with Paul.Click to expand...
Here is the corner into which you've painted yourself. You assert that unbelief alone is what condemns a man. Sounds good.
But wait, that takes it out of the realm of choice. So to maintain your free will position, you must deny the fact that belief, or faith, is a state of being. You must make it into a concious and willful choice that one makes with the full knowledge and conviction of the truth of the thing he is rejecting, and the falsehood of the thing he is choosing to believe.
In otherwords, you're saying one could simply choose to believe in a Santa Claus, knowing there is no Santa, and he would be believing truly in Santa.
And you get that from Paul?
In every post, you assert that a man saves himself with a righteous act, and the reason one is saved and another is not is not because God is sovereign in salvation, but because one man is a better man than another. -
Aaron said: ↑That's what I said. No works, no faith. No trembling, no belief.Click to expand...
It seems to me you can believe and even tremble, yet still choose not to obey God (i.e. "trade the truth in for a lie."), which would not be saving faith. Paul says, "They perish because they refused to love the truth and so be saved."
You didn't look up the verses I cited.
. . . whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him, 1 John 3:6Click to expand...
I think the distinction is quite clear.
By whom?Click to expand...
You mean the caricature of Paul that you imagine in your fragmented knowledge and incomplete understanding of the things he has written.Click to expand...
You say they don't know God and Paul says, "they knew God." Now, obviously Paul is not saying the have a relationship with God as the quote in 1 John 3:6, but I've never argued that point. I've simply argued they clearly saw and understand the qualities and nature of God by which they could acknowledge him as creator and God, but they "traded" what they KNEW to be truth "for a lie." That is why they are accountable (without excuse.)
Here is the corner into which you've painted yourself. You assert that unbelief alone is what condemns a man. Sounds good.
But wait, that takes it out of the realm of choice.Click to expand...
In otherwords, you're saying one could simply choose to believe in a Santa Claus, knowing there is no Santa, and he would be believing truly in Santa.Click to expand...
My question then would be, how did they know there was no Abe? Did the one who created them make them unable to believe in Abe from birth even if Abe was really there and revealed himself to them through countless means?
In every post, you assert that a man saves himself with a righteous actClick to expand...
and the reason one is saved and another is not is not because God is sovereign in salvationClick to expand... -
Skandelon said: ↑But the demons do tremble thus they do belief, right? So, where are their works by this line of reason?Click to expand...
No trembling, no belief. That's where it ends, Skandy. James not drawing a parallel on God's plan of redemption of men and of demons. As far the Scriptures are concerned, there is no plan of redemption for demons. Jesus did not take on the nature of angels. He took on the nature of the seed of Abraham, the elect. Quit trying to take it further than the Apostle intended.
It seems to me you can believe and even tremble, yet still choose not to obey God (i.e. "trade the truth in for a lie."), which would not be saving faith. Paul says, "They perish because they refused to love the truth and so be saved."Click to expand...
So, what are you attempting to argue in quoting this verse:Click to expand...
The natural knowledge of God is darkened and corrupt, and cannot receive the knowledge of God for who He is, but only as corrupt men can conceive of Him, made after the image of a man, or a bird, or a beast or a bug. The world cannot receive the Spirit of truth, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him.
The spiritual knowledge of God is incorruptible by virtue of its divine nature, a nature that those who are born of the Spirit are partakers, and who worship Him in truth and in spirit. But ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.
I think the distinction is quite clear.Click to expand...
Where do you find the support for that leap? How does defending the concept that man can know God but choose to "trade that truth in for a lie" take it out of the realm of choice?Click to expand...
Uhhh, but there is no Santa and God is real.Click to expand... -
Aaron said: ↑Will you forget about the demons already? Demons are spirits, not men, and you cannot compare their natures.Click to expand...
No trembling, no belief. That's where it ends, Skandy. James not drawing a parallel on God's plan of redemption of men and of demons.Click to expand...
You have many fallacious notions.Click to expand...
Only what I've said in the beginning. There is a carnal knowledge of God, and a spiritual knowledge of God. One is what natural-born men possess by nature, and the other is what those who are born of the Spirit possess.Click to expand...
That's what you say, and yet you make no distinction in the source and the nature of the knowledgeClick to expand...
Nature: enough to make all men to stand in judgement for their rebellion without any excuses.
The only distinction for you is in the act of a man.Click to expand...
I assumed you knew what the knowledge of God was. My badClick to expand...
I'm just repeating you when I say you believe men save themselves by a righteous act.Click to expand... -
JesusFan said: ↑Know both cals/Arms affirm that
Humans are sinners
Christ died for the sins of his saved peoples
Gospel sent forth to lost sinners
Don't Cals see God as Ultimate source of Salvation, As he direct elects his own, while Arms see us as final authority, as we can refuse to accept what God offers unto us in Cross of Jesus?Click to expand... -
JesusFan said: ↑Know both cals/Arms affirm that
Humans are sinners
Christ died for the sins of his saved peoples
Gospel sent forth to lost sinners
Don't Cals see God as Ultimate source of Salvation, As he direct elects his own, while Arms see us as final authority, as we can refuse to accept what God offers unto us in Cross of Jesus?Click to expand...
You know as well as I do no one believes they can save them selves. Why not stop the bull. The idea that man is the final authority is a Calvinist assumption of what others believe.
The Bible insist that men are in rebellion against God.
Deu 31:27 For I know thy rebellion, and thy stiff neck: behold, while I am yet alive with you this day, ye have been rebellious against the LORD; and how much more after my death?
Yet for some reason you don't think it possible.
This is what rebellion means
Rebellion
REBEL'LION, n. [L. rebellio. among the Romans, rebellion was originally a revolt or open resistance to their government by nations that had been subdued in war. It was a renewed war.]
In this case it's against God rather than government. Rebellion is resistance.
Here are a few more proofs that man does indeed rebel or resist God.
Job 34:37 For he addeth rebellion unto his sin, he clappeth his hands among us, and multiplieth his words against God.
1Sa 15:23 For rebellion is as the sin of witchcraft, and stubbornness is as iniquity and idolatry. Because thou hast rejected the word of the LORD, he hath also rejected thee from being king.
Pro 17:11 An evil man seeketh only rebellion: therefore a cruel messenger shall be sent against him.
Now it's your turn prove man cannot resist God with scripture.
MB -
MB said: ↑I know you heard the (You just don't understand our doctrine bit) I'm not Arminian though I do believe in Christ Just as they do but it seems Calvinist keep insisting any non Calvinist here must be Arminian.
You know as well as I do no one believes they can save them selves. Why not stop the bull. The idea that man is the final authority is a Calvinist assumption of what others believe.
The Bible insist that men are in rebellion against God.
Deu 31:27 For I know thy rebellion, and thy stiff neck: behold, while I am yet alive with you this day, ye have been rebellious against the LORD; and how much more after my death?
Yet for some reason you don't think it possible.
This is what rebellion means
Rebellion
REBEL'LION, n. [L. rebellio. among the Romans, rebellion was originally a revolt or open resistance to their government by nations that had been subdued in war. It was a renewed war.]
In this case it's against God rather than government. Rebellion is resistance.
Here are a few more proofs that man does indeed rebel or resist God.
Job 34:37 For he addeth rebellion unto his sin, he clappeth his hands among us, and multiplieth his words against God.
1Sa 15:23 For rebellion is as the sin of witchcraft, and stubbornness is as iniquity and idolatry. Because thou hast rejected the word of the LORD, he hath also rejected thee from being king.
Pro 17:11 An evil man seeketh only rebellion: therefore a cruel messenger shall be sent against him.
Now it's your turn prove man cannot resist God with scripture.
MBClick to expand... -
quantumfaith said: ↑I am so in agreement with you MB, I so often grow weary of the "you can save yourself", and "you do not believe God is sovereign" allegations. The way it is so often trotted out makes it sound as if it is on some kind of reformed list of talking points. God has granted mankind the right to resist him, his love, his mercy, his forgiveness. I am convinced that there are and have been many men and women throughout redemptive history that God specifically and sovereignly purposed to accomplish specific tasks and roles with respect to the plan to offer salvation to all.Click to expand...
Think that when a Cal like me refers to it appearing that man is final determiner in Arms theology is due to the fact that we it strange that God would have Christ die for sinners like you and me, sent the Holy Spirit to convict us of sin, and He then "waits" on us to see if we will make a decision for Christ!
Also, we see God in that system deciding to base election on basis of forknowing we will make the decision to accept Christ by faith... -
JesusFan said: ↑Think that when a Cal like me refers to it appearing that man is final determiner in Arms theology is due to the fact that we it strange that God would have Christ die for sinners like you and me, sent the Holy Spirit to convict us of sin, and He then "waits" on us to see if we will make a decision for Christ!Click to expand...
After all God is Love and Love is and this describes Love;
1Co 13:2 And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing.
1Co 13:3 And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing.
1Co 13:4 Charity suffereth long, and is kind; charity envieth not; charity vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up,
1Co 13:5 Doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil;
1Co 13:6 Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth;
1Co 13:7 Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things.
1Co 13:8 Charity never faileth:
The above is the personality of God and below is His patience;
2Pe 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
JesusFan said: ↑Also, we see God in that system deciding to base election on basis of forknowing we will make the decision to accept Christ by faith...Click to expand...
Rom 2:11 For there is no respect of persons with God.
MB
-
MB said: ↑Don't you think God has the time to be patient?
After all God is Love and Love is and this describes Love;
1Co 13:2 And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing.
1Co 13:3 And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing.
1Co 13:4 Charity suffereth long, and is kind; charity envieth not; charity vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up,
1Co 13:5 Doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil;
1Co 13:6 Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth;
1Co 13:7 Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things.
1Co 13:8 Charity never faileth:
The above is the personality of God and below is His patience;
2Pe 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
Have you ever thought that if God is particular in His electing some men over others then it must not be true that God does not respect certain people.
Rom 2:11 For there is no respect of persons with God.
MB
Click to expand...
God indeed has patience towards people, but even THAT can come to an end, see Judgements in revelation...
And God does seem to have His "favorites" at times even inBible...
See John/Peter among Apostles, and Abraham in OT.... jacob/esau -
MB said: ↑I know you heard the (You just don't understand our doctrine bit) I'm not Arminian though I do believe in Christ Just as they do but it seems Calvinist keep insisting any non Calvinist here must be Arminian.
You know as well as I do no one believes they can save them selves. Why not stop the bull. The idea that man is the final authority is a Calvinist assumption of what others believe.
The Bible insist that men are in rebellion against God.
Deu 31:27 For I know thy rebellion, and thy stiff neck: behold, while I am yet alive with you this day, ye have been rebellious against the LORD; and how much more after my death?
Yet for some reason you don't think it possible.
This is what rebellion means
Rebellion
REBEL'LION, n. [L. rebellio. among the Romans, rebellion was originally a revolt or open resistance to their government by nations that had been subdued in war. It was a renewed war.]
In this case it's against God rather than government. Rebellion is resistance.
Here are a few more proofs that man does indeed rebel or resist God.
Job 34:37 For he addeth rebellion unto his sin, he clappeth his hands among us, and multiplieth his words against God.
1Sa 15:23 For rebellion is as the sin of witchcraft, and stubbornness is as iniquity and idolatry. Because thou hast rejected the word of the LORD, he hath also rejected thee from being king.
Pro 17:11 An evil man seeketh only rebellion: therefore a cruel messenger shall be sent against him.
Now it's your turn prove man cannot resist God with scripture.
MBClick to expand...
It matters not how strait the gate,
How charged with punishments the scroll,
I am the master of my fate:
I am the captain of my soul.
Invictus by William Ernest Henley
Is it the attraction of the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil?
And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil:
Page 4 of 9