Misleading Media Story May Doom Middle East Roadmap

bobfrgsn · May 21, 2003

If you read a roadmap carefully, you can usually tell what's around the next bend in the road. To predict what comes next in Israeli-Palestinian relations, you need a roadmap and the latest news. But it all depends on where you get your news.

If you get all your news from mass circulation media in the U.S., you are being told that there is a fork in the road, coming very soon. One path leads to peace, via a new Palestinian leadership that stops the terrorism. The other path leads to more Palestinian terrorism, more Israeli counter-violence, and seemingly endless conflict. It's up to the Palestinians. They caused the problem, so they must choose which direction the Middle East will take. That's pretty much the way the mainstream press here portrays the story.

If your news comes from more diverse sources, you know the situation is more complicated. You know that there is serious doubt whether any Palestinian leaders can prevent all violent attacks against Israelis. You know that Israel has kept up its state-sponsored violence against the Palestinians, ignoring calls by the Bush administration to abide by the roadmap, which requires restraint from both sides. You know that some Israeli analysts, and some of Prime Minister Sharon's own advisors, see this as a calculated move by Sharon to undermine the roadmap before it can be tested out.

In this broader news context, things around the next bend look somewhat different. The choices that Palestinians make may not matter very much. Some Palestinians will surely continue to resist the roadmap, since it envisions a limited kind of freedom for the Palestinians on a limited amount of their own land. Whatever other Palestinians say or do, this rejectionist minority will continue to be righteously indignant. The more the Palestinian leaders repress the rejectionists (which is what the roadmap requires, according to Israel), the more indignant the rejectionists will become. A small minority among this minority will surely find a way to kill more Jews.

The next step along this road is tragically predictable. Sharon and his government will "discover" that the new Palestinian prime minister, Mahmoud Abas, is no different from Yasir Arafat. All the labels pinned on Arafat will be transferred to Abas: "supporter of terrorism," "no partner for peace," "failed leader," and-that most damning word of all in today's political discourse-"irrelevant." Sharon will continue to insist that he really would make peace, if only there were a relevant leader on the other side who wanted peace.

If your news comes only from the mainstream media, this will sound perfectly plausible. After all, isn't Palestinian terrorism the main roadblock to peace? What's a peace-loving Israeli government to do? That's the way our mass media, and the Israeli government, tell the story.
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Read the whole article (or commentary)to see another side to this scenario.

http://www.commondreams.org/views03/0520-06.htm

LadyEagle · May 21, 2003

Common Dreams - another wonderful "unbiased" "progressive" (code word for socialist) source of information, as touted on their own web site:

'Don't think that big media tells the real story? A must read from the left - CommonDreams.org.'

Don Imus Daily/MSNBC
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bobfrgsn · May 21, 2003

Originally posted by SheEagle9/11:
Common Dreams - another wonderful "unbiased" "progressive" (code word for socialist) source of information, as touted on their own web site:

<blockquote>quote:<hr />'Don't think that big media tells the real story? A must read from the left - CommonDreams.org.'

Don Imus Daily/MSNBC
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[/QUOTE]And of course Sheeagle you are unbiased and progressive in your views as well. Since when did progressive become a code word for socialist? Where do you come up with all of your unbiased stuff? You just reject anything that is contrary to point of view .. out of hand .. with some sort of label. You make the most of the "us or them" mentality and fail miserably at see the real picture. But you mind is "made up" and therefore a waste of cyperspace debating. "My Israel ... right or wrong!"

LadyEagle · May 21, 2003

"Progressive" Democrats are Socialists - I'll get you a link if you have to have one for proof.

I have never claimed to be unbiased or progressive. If you thought that, you were sadly misinformed.

bobfrgsn · May 21, 2003

Originally posted by SheEagle9/11:
"Progressive" Democrats are Socialists - I'll get you a link if you have to have one for proof.

I have never claimed to be unbiased or progressive. If you thought that, you were sadly misinformed.
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No sheeagle I have never thought that you were unbiased or progressive ... your bias is such, IMHO, that much stronger words could be used. Being progressive, well by comparision, IMHO, an ostrich with his/her head in the sand is much more progressive in thought and opinion.

LadyEagle · May 21, 2003

Here BOB, just for your information about code word "progressive" -

From the Socialist web site:

http://www.dsausa.org/about/index.html

Fifty-nine members of the 107th Congress, one-third of the House Democrats, were also members of the Democratic Socialists of America Progressive Caucus before the election.
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LINK

bobfrgsn · May 21, 2003

Originally posted by SheEagle9/11:
Here BOB, just for your information about code word "progressive" -

From the Socialist web site:

http://www.dsausa.org/about/index.html

<blockquote>quote:<hr />
Fifty-nine members of the 107th Congress, one-third of the House Democrats, were also members of the Democratic Socialists of America Progressive Caucus before the election.
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LINK

[/QUOTE]Here Sheeagle for your information. Progressive is not a code word for Socialist ... it may be a code word for Liberal in a political context.

For your further enlightenment your quoted statement Fifty-nine members of the 107th Congress, one-third of the House Democrats, were also members of the Democratic Socialists of America Progressive Caucus before the election ***name calling removed** I called several of the congressional offices listed in DC and while most have been asked this same questions by several callers, none of the Congress persons listed are now or ever have been members of the DSA.

***Attack and name calling deleted***

[ May 21, 2003, 09:53 PM: Message edited by: C.S. Murphy ]

bobfrgsn · May 21, 2003

Opps. She Eagle I should have stated that the members listed are members of the Progressive Democratic Caucus ... a liberal caucus not equal as your quote would imply to the DSA

bobfrgsn · May 21, 2003

Oh yeah I should have mentioned that of all of the congress persons listed one may or may not be a declared socialist ... Bernie Sanders of Vermont. BTW I took a look at all of the links you suggested. WOW what a bunch of JUNK!

Gina B · May 22, 2003

A reader sent a pm asking for the thread to be closed. As the conversation on the thread is between she-eagle and bobf and neither complained of being offended it's not being shut down right now.
I think both have made very valid statements, and I'm interested in seeing each other's responses as long as the thread stays on topic and Murph's advice is followed.
Gina

LadyEagle · May 22, 2003

Very Good, Gina. Bob posted comments about this topic on another unrelated thread which have been deleted. We don't need to have this continuous conversation about this issue scattered throughout all the different threads.

I don't have time to get to my sources at the moment to validate my statements above but will later. Some sources are in the BB archives, as well.

In the meantime, Bob will have to wait with baited breath.

bobfrgsn · May 22, 2003

here are you sources.

I don't have time to get to my sources at the moment to validate my statements above but will later. Some sources are in the BB archives, as well.
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Here BOB, just for your information about code word "progressive" -

From the Socialist web site:

http://www.dsausa.org/about/index.html

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Fifty-nine members of the 107th Congress, one-third of the House Democrats, were also members of the Democratic Socialists of America Progressive Caucus before the election.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

LINK
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I am not aware of posting anywhere but here ... except that Murph (I think)sent a pm stating that he was moving the thread to News affecting Baptist.

I am not waiting with baited breath. I really to not expect you to admit your misstatement.

Squire Robertsson · May 22, 2003

Bob living as I do out here in the neighborhood of the Peoples Republic of Berkley, I have made this observation. With only two major political parties, the US does not parse out her politicians like other countries. So, the membership of the Democratic Party represents what in other countries (Germany comes to mind at the moment) would be a membership spread between the Green and the Left to Center Parties. The Republicans represent a membership that would be spread out between the the Center to Christian Democratic Parties.

So, it is not over the top to refer to given members of Congress a small "s" socialists. Yes, there is only one big "S" one currently in the House. My own Congressman is Tomas Lantos. If we were in Hungary, I place him in the Democratic Socialist Party. This is not necessarily a pejorative term, just an accurate one. In any other country, he and Harry Truman would not be placed in the same party.

bobfrgsn · May 22, 2003

The Democratic Socialists of America (DSA) is the largest socialist organization in the United States, and the principal U.S. affiliate of the Socialist International. DSA's members are building progressive movements for social change while establishing an openly socialist presence in American communities and politics.

At the root of our socialism is a profound commitment to democracy, as means and end. We are activists committed not only to extending political democracy but to demanding democratic empowerment in the economy, in gender relations, and in culture. Democracy is not simply one of our political values but our means of restructuring society. Our vision is of a society in which people have a real voice in the choices and relationships that affect the entirety of our lives. We call this vision democratic socialism — a vision of a more free, democratic and humane society.
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quoted from this link: http://www.dsausa.org/about/index.html

The is a real Socialist Party. On the following link: http://bannerofliberty.com/BOL1-02MQC/11-19-2002.1.html

The article quoted by sheeagle which alledges that the Congressional Progressive Caucus members are all members of the DSA. That is the only point I am making.

Having live in abroad most of my adult I am well aware of naunces of politcal affiliations ... we are even getting a few more her in the US.

LadyEagle · May 22, 2003

Thank you, Squire!

Bob - the article I posted is out in various forms all over the Internet:

http://www.tysknews.com/Depts/gov_philosophy/dsa_members.htm

http://www.newsmax.com/archive/print.shtml?a=2002/10/15/184934

This explains what happened after the original article was published in the Times:

"Some time ago — the date is missing from the descriptions — 58 members of the U.S. House of Representatives formed a subdivision of the Democratic Socialists of America and called it the Progressive Caucus. Their statement of purpose, as well as their membership list, formed an integral part of the dsausa Web site [www.dsausa.org]. The membership list appeared on the screen with the continuous background of the fist holding the rose, should anyone have missed the connection with the Socialist International."

After the Washington Times in November 1998 blew the whistle on the so-called "Progressive" Caucus, "action was taken to hide the true nature of the organization, and its membership list was eventually taken off the dsausa Web site."
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http://www.newsmax.com/showinsidecover.shtml?a=2002/11/13/152258

From the Sierra Times - HARDLY a conservative publication:

59 Socialists in Congress – 2002
By Chuck Morse
Published 09. 6. 02 at 20:00 Sierra Time
xx

On the extreme left wing of the Democratic Party, The Progressive Caucus is affiliated with the Democratic Socialists of America, which, in turn, is the American affiliate of the Socialist International. Congressional Caucus members, I would contend, should actually be called Socialists rather than Democrats. Unlike their European counterparts, these homegrown American Socialist Congressmen try to refrain from showing their true authoritarian colors. Such displays would be too risky in an America that is still steeped in traditional freedoms. There are still enough of us out here who would boot them out of office if they revealed too much of their true stripe.
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http://www.sierratimes.com/02/09/07/morse.htm

FROM GOOGLE SEARCH

Source:

My old GOOGLE search cache from months ago BEFORE THE DSA CHANGED THEIR KEYWORDS & KEY DESCRIPTION FOR GOOGLE SEARCHING:

Democratic Socialists of America - http://www.dsausa.org/dsa.html
The largest socialist organization in the United States, and the principal U.S. affiliate of the Socialist International. DSA's members are active in progressive social movements and are active within the US Democratic Party. DSA's founding chair was Michael Harrington.
DSA Locals Directory - http://www.dsausa.org/about/locals.html
Locals, Organizing Committees, and Youth Section Chapters of the Democratic Socialists of America.
Progressive Challenge Coalition - http://www.netprogress.org/
A coalition of the Congressional Progressive Caucus and various social activist organizations putting forward an agenda for progressive change in the US.The Progressive Caucus and the Progressive Challenge Coalition are associated with the Democratic Socialists of America.
Chicago Democratic Socialists of America - http://www.chicagodsa.org
The Chicago local of the Democratic Socialists of America, home of the Debs - Thomas - Harrington Dinner. Active in anti-corporate globalization issues as well as local, labor support and electoral issues.
House Progressive Caucus - http://www.netprogress.org/legis/index.htm
A group of progressive Democrats and Independents in the U.S. House of Representatives. Affiliated with DSA (Democratic Socialists of America).
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PS: I just googled back then -

I didn't write the original web site descriptions or key words, nor did I change the web site descriptions to what they are in their present form.

The information on their sites may have changed since then but the ideology (and leopard spots) haven't changed one iota.

Hope this clears up the confusion!

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