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Featured Onetime TGC Calvinist Fraternity Insider Is 'Not a Christian'

Discussion in 'Calvinism & Arminianism Debate' started by Jerome, Jul 26, 2019.

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  1. Jerome

    Jerome Well-Known Member
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    Joshua Harris confesses on Instagram:

    "I have undergone a massive shift in regard to my faith in Jesus....the biblical phrase is 'falling away.' By all the measurements that I have for defining a Christian, I am not a Christian."

    9marksharris - Copy.jpg

    tgc - Copy.jpg
     
  2. InTheLight

    InTheLight Well-Known Member
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    Hmm... So a Calvinist used his free will to decide to become an unbeliever. Well, how about that?!

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  3. canadyjd

    canadyjd Well-Known Member

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    The mark of a Christian is indwelling Holy Spirit. That is the promise of God that will not be removed from a Christian.

    Based on his small post, it appears he got divorced. That event triggered the embrace of a host of liberal ideology. He apologized for his past beliefs. He feels free now, hopeful. He is no longer constrained by God and scripture.

    He is intellectually honest enough to acknowledge that what he now believes is inconsistent with being a Christian. If he continues with his intellectual honesty, he will acknowledge that his life can be explained in one of two ways.

    If he is a child of God, indwelling Holy Spirit will convict him of this sin and bring him to repentance. If he is not a child of God, then he never received Holy Spirit indwelling and had only decieved himself into thinking he was saved.

    His public falling away brings shame to the cause of Christ, regardless of his prior stated beliefs.

    Your attempt to use his public falling away to score petty debate points is shameful as well.

    The cause of Christ has been brought to public shame. The Spirit of God is grieved. So should you be.

    Peace to you
     
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  4. InTheLight

    InTheLight Well-Known Member
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    Isn't this an exhibition of his free will?
    Doesn't he identify as a Calvinist?



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  5. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
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    <sigh>...such pettiness....
     
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  6. atpollard

    atpollard Well-Known Member

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    According to Jesus, divorce is always about SIN, not “free will”, so this is a consequence of SIN.
     
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  7. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
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    Quite the gymnastics there.
     
  8. InTheLight

    InTheLight Well-Known Member
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    The 'T' and the 'P' in TULIP was just violated by a well known, prominent Calvinist and it's pretty to point that out.

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  9. canadyjd

    canadyjd Well-Known Member

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    It demonstrates human will rejecting God and His Word in favor of worldly beliefs. All human will is influenced by a variety of things. IMO, no will is free from influence.

    I don't know the man or what he believed in the past. If you say he is a "calvinist" I accept you know more about him than I do.

    From the tone of his post, it might be more accurate to say he used to be a calvinist, since he clearly rejects Christianity now.

    Peace to you
     
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  10. canadyjd

    canadyjd Well-Known Member

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    It is premature to make such a judgment. First, why you believe "total depravity" was violated by his post, I can't understand.

    As far as perseverence is concerned, it is my belief that if he has Holy Spirit indwelling, then Holy Spirit will bring him to conviction and repentance in time, which is my hope.

    Peace to you
     
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  11. Benjamin

    Benjamin Well-Known Member
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    If one believes his faith was forced upon him and that he had no choice, then his love of the truth was not his own if it ever even existed, therefore “his faith” was based in the unrighteousness of holding the truth in unrighteousness. As it is written, “The just shall live by faith.” (Romans 1:16-20) and, “all of His ways are judgment,” (Deuteronomy 32:4) but this Calvinist guy’s claim would logically be that the foundation of his faith began with inability and determination upon him rather than divine influence resulting in the persuasion of his own heart (cause and effect rather than influence and response), to which (Deu 32:4) God will judge the content of his heart in “Truth”.

    (Rom 10:9) If *you* declare with *your* mouth that Jesus is Lord, and believe in *your heart* that God raised him from the dead, *you* will be saved.

    Note: *You* is used 4 times in this verse. *You'll* be surprised by how much *”you"* there is in a book that supposedly says that *we* do nothing.
     
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  12. atpollard

    atpollard Well-Known Member

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    So divorce isn’t about SIN?
     
  13. Jerome

    Jerome Well-Known Member
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    #13 Jerome, Aug 5, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2019
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  14. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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  15. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

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    It's not the first time someone rejected Christ after claiming Him as savior. Peter did this as well though under different circumstances and motives.. We shouldn't judge him. I've seen the same happen in my camp as well. This doesn't just hurt Calvinism it hurts all Christianity. It makes us all look as if we are all pretenders of the faith.
    MB
     
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  16. Dave G

    Dave G Well-Known Member

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    " Hear ye therefore the parable of the sower.
    19 When any one heareth the word of the kingdom, and understandeth [it] not, then cometh the wicked [one], and catcheth away that which was sown in his heart. This is he which received seed by the way side.
    20 But he that received the seed into stony places, the same is he that heareth the word, and anon with joy receiveth it;
    21 yet hath he not root in himself, but dureth for a while: for when tribulation or persecution ariseth because of the word, by and by he is offended.
    22 He also that received seed among the thorns is he that heareth the word; and the care of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, choke the word, and he becometh unfruitful.
    23 But he that received seed into the good ground is he that heareth the word, and understandeth [it]; which also beareth fruit, and bringeth forth, some an hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty."
    ( Matthew 13:18-23 )

    No, a man who thought he believed, later recanted his "faith".
    In other words, he was never "in it" to begin with.

    These last days are filled with people who lack the sealing power of the Holy Spirit...who make professions, but later prove that they were never truly born again.
    I agree, Benjamin.
    His love of the truth appears not to be evident, because he abandoned it in favor of the world and its ways, instead of Christ and His ways.:(
    Amen.:)
     
    #16 Dave G, Aug 18, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 18, 2019
  17. Dave G

    Dave G Well-Known Member

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    It's an exhibition of Matthew 13 and the parables of both the tares and the sower.
    1) I've seen people who were either raised in or came to "Calvinism" as young "believers", later reject it in favor of "Traditionalism" or "Wesleyan Arminianism"... or even reject Christ altogether.
    2) I've also seen people who were raised in "Traditionalism" and "Wesleyan Arminianism" later reject those and become "Calvinists" strictly through their reading of Scripture or the preaching of the word.
    I've never heard of any of those falling away...but I'm also not saying it doesn't happen.

    Regardless, he didn't stick it out, and fell away.
    To me, this is a clear-cut case of #1.

    Christ's sheep have a love of the truth, and they do not fall away.
    They "hear" His voice, and that includes ( eventually ) understanding and believing His every word ( Matthew 4:4, Luke 4:4, John 8:47, John 10:27, Matthew 11:15 ).

    Mr. Harris, it seems, couldn't take the persecution, had no "staying power" ( the preservation of the Holy Spirit and the "Perseverance of the Saints" ) and went back to what he was before ( 2 Peter 2:17-22 ).
    It very much saddens me to watch such things happen.:Sick
     
    #17 Dave G, Aug 18, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 18, 2019
  18. Benjamin

    Benjamin Well-Known Member
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    Yet, you miss understanding the simple logic that love of the truth must come from one's own heart as clearly spelled out in the scripture,(Romans 10:9) also upon which God will judge in truth, (Deuteronomy 32:4) thereby refuting the Determinist's TULIP ideology.
     
  19. Dave G

    Dave G Well-Known Member

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    No, I do not misunderstand it.

    In fact, I fully believe that love of the truth must come from a man's heart.
    Otherwise, he is a robot... programmed to do that which God commands.

    "TULIP" doctrine is in no way refuted, because it is God who changes the heart...from hard, to soft ( Ezekiel 11:19, Ezekiel 36:26 ).
    Election in no way negates Romans 10:9.
    It never has, and it never will.

    Since mankind exhibits a hatred of God ( Romans 1:30 ), of Jesus Christ ( John 3:19-20, John 15:18 ) and of truth from the very outset ( Psalms 58:3, John 8:43-47 ), the new birth is necessary to resolve the heart problem between God and the rebellious sinner.
    After the new birth, the child of God is now different...from a born again heart, the person who God has changed begins to love God and His word, and has received from God a love of the truth.;)

    From the heart, the person can now confess Christ unfeigned, and evidence a genuine love of the truth.

    No unregenerate, non-born again person can ever truly confess Christ from the heart.
    No unregenerate person can ever acquire a love of the truth, because that would require being born again...to go from darkness to light, from dead to alive, spiritually, and from hating Him to loving Him.

    " Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth." ( John 17:17 ).

    To love truth is to love every word of God, which most men hate and reject every day.
    To love Truth is to love Jesus Christ, the Word made flesh.:)
     
    #19 Dave G, Aug 18, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 18, 2019
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  20. Reynolds

    Reynolds Well-Known Member
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    He never was elect.
     
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