Over population

[Bro. Curtis]

Check my math.

I gave a liberal estimate, of the average person being 6' tall, 2' wide & 2' deep.

24 cubic feet.

World population, as of yesterday, 6,544,232,759

Multiplied by 24 cubic feet

We take up 157,061,586,216 cubic feet. (not quite, but at the very most)

Scientists estimate Loch Ness contains 263,000,000,000 cubic feet of water.

So, everyone in the world could drown in Loch Ness, with over 100 billion cubic feet of Ness to spare.

Are we concerned over nothing, surely God could provide for us, and we should trust him more ?

What think ye ?

 

[Daisy]

Check my math.

I gave a liberal estimate, of the average person being 6' tall, 2' wide & 2' deep.

24 cubic feet.

World population, as of yesterday, 6,544,232,759

Multiplied by 24 cubic feet

We take up 157,061,586,216 cubic feet. (not quite, but at the very most)

Scientists estimate Loch Ness contains 263,000,000,000 cubic feet of water.

So, everyone in the world could drown in Loch Ness, with over 100 billion cubic feet of Ness to spare.

Are we concerned over nothing, surely God could provide for us, and we should trust him more ?

What think ye ?

The average person is quite a bit shorter - remember, there are more women than men on average and a lot of kids. Even among men in their prime, Chinese men average about 5'8", Indians tend to be pretty short, except in the North West (two most populous nations), South American indigenous people also average shorter than Europeans. Two X two is awfully rotund for non-Americans.

If you took all the ants of the world and all the people and weighed them against each other, the ants would tip the scale. (Odd fact that is hard to work into conversations).

Each person really only needs a few inches of water to drown, if they are unconcious, face-down in a puddle.

I don't think the problem for most people is avoiding drowning but drinking clean water. Maybe the world doesn't look so crowded in Big Sky country, but land is not evenly distributed among the people of the world.

 

[Magnetic Poles]

It is not just the land we occupy, but how much land we need to support us, e.g. growing food, having potable water, drilling for our oil, etc.

Still, who wants to live toe to toe with other people. Remember also, that population growth isn't linear...it is exponential.

Get too many people on the planet and war and disease will fix the problem, but not a pleasant way to do so.

 

[Bro. Curtis]

It seems that the space animals & vegetation take up are support for human life.

I also believe God commanded us to populate the earth, subdue it, use it for our needs. responsibly, yes, but it is here for us.

And I also agree a lot of land is uninhabitable, but Loch Ness could fit several times in most American cities.

Like global warming, I think it's a lack of faith that makes us panic. Multiply the problem. We don't trust that we will have our needs met.

And I also believe the stavation in most third-world countries is a result of horrible leadership, not lack of resources.

I thought the math was pretty revealing.

 

[Bro. Curtis]

It is not just the land we occupy, but how much land we need to support us, e.g. growing food, having potable water, drilling for our oil, etc.

Still, who wants to live toe to toe with other people. Remember also, that population growth isn't linear...it is exponential.

Get too many people on the planet and war and disease will fix the problem, but not a pleasant way to do so.

Would God command us to do anything that would lead to our collective demise ?

 

[Revmitchell]

http://mucklecart.phpnet.us/

Margaret Sanger and Planned Parenthood- http://www.radioliberty.com/pca.htm

George Grant chronicles the life and writings of Margaret Sanger, and painstakingly documents Sanger's plans for the genetic engineering of the human race. George Grant noted that in the 1920s Margaret Sanger wrote "The Pivot of Civilization" in which she called for:
"The 'elimination of 'human weeds,' for the 'cessation of charity' because it prolonged the lives of the unfit, for the segregation of 'morons, misfits, and the maladjusted,' and for the sterilization of genetically inferior races.'"5

David Graber, a research biologist with the National Park Service, was quoted in the Los Angeles Times Book Review Section, October 22, 1989, as saying: "Human happiness and certainly human fecundity are not as important as a wild and healthy planet. I know social scientists who remind me that people are part of nature, but it isn't true ... We have become a plague upon ourselves and upon the Earth ...Until such time as homo sapiens should decide to rejoin nature, some of us can only hope for the right virus to come along." 14

http://www.impactpress.com/articles/febmar99/population2399.html

Population control, Abortion, euthensasia and environmental issues are all related and intertwined to many folks. It is all about worshipping the creation rather than the creator.

 

[Bro. Curtis]

That's what I believe. Very strongly, I might add.:thumbsup:

 

[Revmitchell]

The latest exhibit, of course, is the recent Conference on Population, to be followed next year by an equally ominously entitled "Conference on Women." The television propaganda by the UN for this year's conference anticipates next year's as well, best encapsulated in one of the most idiotically true statements made by anyone in decades: "Raising the standard of living for women will raise the standard of living for everyone." Substitute "men" for "women" in this sentence, and the absurd banality of this statement becomes evident.

The underlying major problem and fallacy with the Population Conference has been lost in the fury over the abortion question. In the process, few people question the underlying premise of the conference: the widely held proposition that the major cause of poverty throughout the world, and at the very least in the undeveloped countries, is an excess of population.

The solution, then, is the euphemistically named "population control," which in essence is the use of government power to encourage, or compel, restrictions on the growth, or on the numbers, of people in existence. Logically, of course, the anti-hu-man-being fanatics (for what is "the population" but an array of humans?) should advocate the murder by government planners of large numbers of existing people, especially in the allegedly overpopulated developing world (or, to use older term, Third World) countries. But something seems to hold them back; perhaps the charge of "racism" that might ensue. Their concentra tion, then, is on restricting the number of future births

http://www.mises.org/econsense/ch41.asp

 

[Hope of Glory]

The thing about it is, at the current rate of population growth (which is very low) worldwide, if we continue at this rate, there will be one person for every two square feet of land on earth (including mountaintops and under icefields) in about 600 years. If you assume that there are 100,000 planets just like Earth, and we could get to them, and continue at the same rate of growth, it would take about 600 more years to have them all filled to the same level.

Population growth is a fairly recent problem, because of increased food supplies, better health, fewer war deaths, etc.

I personally think that Jesus will return before it's a problem, but since we are to be good stewards of the Earth, should we continue increasing willy-nilly?

 

[Bro. Curtis]

As soon as you find the verse that says stop. I don't believe it's in there. Also, I used math to prove my point. Can you prove, that in 600 years there will be no room ?

 

[Revmitchell]

The thing about it is, at the current rate of population growth (which is very low) worldwide, if we continue at this rate, there will be one person for every two square feet of land on earth (including mountaintops and under icefields) in about 600 years. If you assume that there are 100,000 planets just like Earth, and we could get to them, and continue at the same rate of growth, it would take about 600 more years to have them all filled to the same level.

Population growth is a fairly recent problem, because of increased food supplies, better health, fewer war deaths, etc.

I personally think that Jesus will return before it's a problem, but since we are to be good stewards of the Earth, should we continue increasing willy-nilly?

The better question is should we force people to not reproduce? I shutter at the response I anticipate.

This mentality is tragic, ungodly, and disgusting.

 

[Revmitchell]

Infanticide and Population Control

The Oxford English Dictionary defines infanticide as the custom of killing newborn infants, perpetrated by or with the consent of its parents, especially the mother. This act prevailed in primitive societies and was common in the ancient world. Some have said that infanticide is a form of adaptation, the only method available to control the size of any given population. Across species, except for the rare pathologies, infanticide is found under specific ecological and social circumstances, and its impact in these circumstances is an increased lineage success for the killer, even when the killer is a parent. For example, human offspring require a considerable amount of parental effort, therefore a deformed offspring or a mother’s poor health could be reasons for terminating an “investment”.

http://fubini.swarthmore.edu/~ENVS2/sindaco1/Infanticide.html

 

[Magnetic Poles]

For those so inclined, there is always another alternative:

http://www.vhemt.org/

The Voluntary Human Extinction Movement

Phasing out the human race by voluntarily ceasing to breed will allow Earth's biosphere to return to good health. Crowded conditions and resource shortages will improve as we become less dense.

 

[Bro. Curtis]

Yeah. Let's start with those bible-thumpers, always clouding every scientific issue with what "God" says........

 

[Bro. Curtis]

OK. I'm better now.

I find this "voluntary extermination" pretty offensive.

God says to be fruitful & multiply. Alarmists tell us to stop. Which one to do ? Hmmmm.........

 

[billwald]

You all forget to factor in wars and the new STDs which God is creating.

 

[Hope of Glory]

You all forget to factor in wars and the new STDs which God is creating.

I didn't. Even with the wars and STDs, the population is still growing, albeit at a lower rate than the last few years.

 

[Hope of Glory]

As soon as you find the verse that says stop. I don't believe it's in there. Also, I used math to prove my point. Can you prove, that in 600 years there will be no room ?

Yes, I can. I don't really have the time right now, but it really gets on my nerves when people want to turn a blind ear (Algorism intentional) to a problem and just pretend that it doesn't exist. Please keep in mind that I am making no kind of proposal to correct the problem whatsoever, beyond voluntarily reducing the population growth on a personal level. (i.e. Don't have so many kids.) The only reasonable solution that I can see is... Well, there's not a reasonable solution, on the part of man. Short of the Lord coming back before it's a problem, what are we going to do?

Just the condensed version, without going into how the population remained fairly steady until the last few hundred years, with the increase in food production ability, better health care, etc., permitted the population to explode and double every few years until we've reached the numbers that we currently have. This also doesn't take into account problems of increased food usage, waste disposal, natural resources, etc.

Square miles on planed earth (including mountaintops, under ice sheets, etc.; we'll assume it's all inhabitable to give us a little longer): 57,268,900

This translates into square feet: 1.5965653 × 10^15 (That's 10 to the 15th, but I can't figure out how to make superscript here.)

At 2 square feet per person, which would literally be standing room only on the entire face of the planet (land area only), there is room for 798,282,650,000,000.

Current world population: We are going to use 7 billion to make an easy number to deal with. Currently, there are officially 6.65 billion, but with .3 billion uncounted Chinese, that makes it 6.95 billion. Besides, for your side of the argument, I'm giving you a bunch of unusable land.

If you double the current population, at 16 doublings, there would be 917,504,000,000,000 people, which is more than standing room only, but 15 doublings only leaves us with 458,752,000,000,000 people, which isn't quite standing room only.

How long does it take to double the population at the current rate of growth? Well, the current rate of growth is down to 1.3%, so this gives a bit more time than. At 1.3%, the population will double every 53.8 years or so. So, I'll give you a little more time and round it up to 54 years. (This also makes it easier to calculate.) But, since the growth rate is down to 1.3% (The last time I did the math, it was 1.8%, and by some estimations, it still is; but, due to the inability to calculate much of the growth that is occurring in the third world, I'll give your arguemnt the extra benefit of the doubt.), the population will double 16 times in 864 years.

So, by reducing the population growth from 1.8% down to 1.3%, you have gained about 250 years before everyone has to stand shoulder to shoulder on the entire face of the planet.

 

[annsni]

So, by reducing the population growth from 1.8% down to 1.3%, you have gained about 250 years before everyone has to stand shoulder to shoulder on the entire face of the planet.

But isn't Jesus going to return sometime? Isn't that a way to take care of overpopulation??

Ann

 

[hillclimber1]

Check my math.

I gave a liberal estimate, of the average person being 6' tall, 2' wide & 2' deep.

24 cubic feet.

World population, as of yesterday, 6,544,232,759

Multiplied by 24 cubic feet

We take up 157,061,586,216 cubic feet. (not quite, but at the very most)

Scientists estimate Loch Ness contains 263,000,000,000 cubic feet of water.

So, everyone in the world could drown in Loch Ness, with over 100 billion cubic feet of Ness to spare.

Are we concerned over nothing, surely God could provide for us, and we should trust him more ?

What think ye ?

It's gonna overflow