1. Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Featured The Elect, The Sheep, and the Like

Discussion in 'Calvinism & Arminianism Debate' started by Reformed1689, Nov 19, 2020.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2009
    Messages:
    15,233
    Likes Received:
    1,849
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Election is defined in v 11, 'not of works good or bad but of God who calls'.

    V 11:
    for the children being not yet born, neither having done anything good or bad, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth,

    V 24:
    even us, whom he also called, not from the Jews only, but also from the Gentiles
     
    • Winner Winner x 4
  2. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    47,729
    Likes Received:
    2,439
    Faith:
    Baptist
    I agree with you, but my point was that salvation confirms and proves that our election was sure! So both Jews and Gentiles had to be elect in order to be saved!
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  3. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2006
    Messages:
    5,775
    Likes Received:
    232
    Faith:
    Baptist
    So the elect Jews who do not believe were never elect. This is your twisted idea of what scripture says.
    MB
     
  4. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2009
    Messages:
    15,233
    Likes Received:
    1,849
    Faith:
    Baptist
    MB, are you Jewish?
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  5. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2006
    Messages:
    5,775
    Likes Received:
    232
    Faith:
    Baptist
    No are you?
     
  6. Reformed1689

    Reformed1689 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2019
    Messages:
    5,418
    Likes Received:
    1,185
    Faith:
    Baptist
    No, it means that in Him, in what He would do on the cross, we were chosen. He died for the sheep. We were bought. But our salvation still must be activated by faith.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  7. Reformed1689

    Reformed1689 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2019
    Messages:
    5,418
    Likes Received:
    1,185
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Sure I can. The book of John is rife with proof of this talking about those who belong to him hear him. The elect know his voice and they come to him.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
    • Funny Funny x 1
  8. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2009
    Messages:
    15,233
    Likes Received:
    1,849
    Faith:
    Baptist
    I hope so.
     
  9. SGO

    SGO Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2020
    Messages:
    1,058
    Likes Received:
    227
    Faith:
    Non Baptist Christian
    Wow! What a beehive of activity. In an election year yet.
    I guess you did not want to even touch 1 Corinthians 10:4 where they drank of the Rock and the Rock was Christ yet most of them died in the desert. (That is not dessert, fellows.)
    All written to teach us something, I guess than in an election year not everyone wins the prize.

    For whatsoever things were written aforetime were written for our learning,
    that we through patience and comfort of the scriptures might have hope.
    Romans 15:4

    For many years I thought I would die in the desert, as a Christian, but now I have hope, only through Him, and certainly not by me.
     
  10. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2010
    Messages:
    18,413
    Likes Received:
    1,870
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Game ,set ,and match. Well played Kyred
     
    • Winner Winner x 2
    • Like Like x 1
  11. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2006
    Messages:
    5,775
    Likes Received:
    232
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Yeah sure it is but you just can't find it
    MB
     
  12. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    47,729
    Likes Received:
    2,439
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Not all of the Jews were elected, just the saved out faithful Remnant!
     
  13. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    47,729
    Likes Received:
    2,439
    Faith:
    Baptist
    That is what Peter meant by making sure that our election was true and sure...
     
  14. SGO

    SGO Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2020
    Messages:
    1,058
    Likes Received:
    227
    Faith:
    Non Baptist Christian
    Where is your proof? Please take some time to give foundation to your points.
     
  15. Barry Johnson

    Barry Johnson Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2020
    Messages:
    2,336
    Likes Received:
    171
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Its not chosen to be saved . How silly is it to believe that people were chosen to be saved before Adam and Eve existed , then sinned..Before the fall , before Moses , before the law , before Jesus was born , before the apostles, before Jesus is crucified, before the giving of the Holy Spirit, before Paul before the completion of the bible, before your parents gave birth to you , before you sinned , before you believed the Gospel. And you think you were chosen in Christ to be converted ? No where in the bible says this . You imagine Eph 1 .4 says this . Not because of any context, but because of the doctrines of men. We become In Him Chosen to be holy and blameless. THIS is the spiritual blessings that we get once we are in Him . This was what was chosen before . Eph 2.11-12 completely refutes the western ' me ' centred doctrines of Augustine..
     
    • Like Like x 1
  16. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2006
    Messages:
    5,775
    Likes Received:
    232
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Hoping will never make you a Jew.
    MB
     
  17. Barry Johnson

    Barry Johnson Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2020
    Messages:
    2,336
    Likes Received:
    171
    Faith:
    Baptist
    To both Calvinists and Arminians, the identity of “the elect” is widely accepted as “the saved ones”. Even if the sides disagree how one becomes saved the usual consensus is that new covenant believers are “the elect”. To see if that definition fits, let’s take a look at one passage in the New Testament where the term “the elect” is used as well as the term’s Old Testament roots .

    2 Timothy 2:10 (NKJV), “Therefore I endure all things for the sake of the elect, that they also may obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory.”

    Who were/are “the elect” for whom Paul was willing to suffer with much hardship?

    The two most widely accepted interpretations are the unconditional elect and/or the conditional elect. According to Calvinism, the former, the elect are those predestined and predetermined by God for salvation from eternity past. This group is certain and locked in. The elect will be saved and the non-elect will be lost. Period. According to Arminianism the elect are those foreseen by God who will accept Jesus Christ as their personal Savior by their own free will; ie. conditional elect. Those who are “in Christ” are the elect of God. In short, one becomes elect when he or she elects to believe. However, neither of these widely accepted interpretations fit the content and grammar of the text.

    WHO ARE THE “THEY ALSO”?
    Look, again, at the text….

    “Therefore I endure all things for the sake of the elect, that they also may obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory.”
     
    • Winner Winner x 1
  18. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2006
    Messages:
    5,775
    Likes Received:
    232
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Rev_2:9 I have known thy works, and tribulation, and poverty—yet thou art rich—and the evil-speaking of those saying themselves to be Jews, and are not, but are a synagogue of the Adversary.
    Still hoping?
    MB
     
  19. Barry Johnson

    Barry Johnson Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2020
    Messages:
    2,336
    Likes Received:
    171
    Faith:
    Baptist
    ' Activated ' ? Like the Winter Soildier from Avengers? lol
     
    • Like Like x 1
  20. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2009
    Messages:
    15,233
    Likes Received:
    1,849
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Don't you hope that you belong to the Israel of God?

    28 For he is not a Jew who is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision which is outward in the flesh:
    29 but he is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God. Ro 2
    6 But it is not as though the word of God hath come to nought. For they are not all Israel, that are of Israel:
    8 That is, it is not the children of the flesh that are children of God; but the children of the promise are reckoned for a seed. Ro 9

    3 for we are the circumcision, who worship by the Spirit of God, and glory in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh: Phil 3

    15 For neither is circumcision anything, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature.
    16 And as many as shall walk by this rule, peace be upon them, and mercy, and upon the Israel of God. Gal 6
     
    • Like Like x 1
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
Loading...