1. Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Featured The Equality of Jesus to The Father

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by SavedByGrace, Apr 20, 2021.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
Top Posters
Page 2 of 8
  1. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2006
    Messages:
    6,890
    Likes Received:
    262
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Unless I misunderstood you it seems you said;
    Christ said He and the Father are one.
    I read the same from you
    MB
     
    #21 MB, Apr 22, 2021
  2. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Jesus and the Father are one in essence, as whatever makes one God, they both have it equally!
     
    #22 Yeshua1, Apr 22, 2021
    • Agree Agree x 1
  3. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2020
    Messages:
    10,152
    Likes Received:
    441
    Faith:
    Baptist
    I have to give the Greek again, as the English is not clear, "εγω και ο πατηρ εν εσμεν", Here we have Jesus Christ as the Speaker, "I", in the 1st Person singular; and "The Father", in the 3rd Person singular. The Jesus says literally "WE Are", which is in the masculine, and plural in number. TWO Persons. Then we have "εν", which is the neuter, "One Being". It is impossible from this to conclude that Jesus Christ and the Father are One and the same "Person". One and the same "Being", as "God", yes.
     
    #23 SavedByGrace, Apr 22, 2021
  4. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Jesus was stating that he and the Father are both God, not that he is also the Father!
     
    #24 Yeshua1, Apr 22, 2021
  5. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2020
    Messages:
    10,152
    Likes Received:
    441
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Indeed, as the use of the masculine plural "εσμεν", is clear to show distinction. Had Jesus used the masculine "εἶς" (one), instead of the netuer "εν", He could well have meant "we are One Person"! But He carefully avoids doing this.
     
    #25 SavedByGrace, Apr 22, 2021
  6. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2006
    Messages:
    6,890
    Likes Received:
    262
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Not true at all Jesus and the Father are one God And the Holy Spirit is there Soirit

    Show me where i indicated there is not a trinity. God the Father Jesus His son and the holy Spirit are altogether one God. If you believe you can explain this any better by all means do so
    MB
     
    #26 MB, Apr 22, 2021
  7. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2006
    Messages:
    6,890
    Likes Received:
    262
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Even above you describ God as essence which means;
    "1. That which constitutes the particular nature of a being or substance, or of a genus, and which distinguishes it from all others."
    This describes "one being"
    MB
     
    #27 MB, Apr 22, 2021
  8. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2006
    Messages:
    6,890
    Likes Received:
    262
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Complicating isn't it.
    MB
     
    #28 MB, Apr 22, 2021
  9. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    This entire discussion shows why knowing the original languages will be useful, as they can highlight to us certain things not really fully clear in the English translations!
     
    #29 Yeshua1, Apr 22, 2021
    • Agree Agree x 1
  10. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Who is the Holy Spirit to you?
     
    #30 Yeshua1, Apr 22, 2021
  11. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Yes, One Being, and yet 3 persons!
     
    #31 Yeshua1, Apr 22, 2021
  12. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2020
    Messages:
    10,152
    Likes Received:
    441
    Faith:
    Baptist
    What do you find complicating? It is very clear to me
     
    #32 SavedByGrace, Apr 22, 2021
  13. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Just wonder why so complicated to him in the English translation then?
     
    #33 Yeshua1, Apr 22, 2021
  14. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2020
    Messages:
    10,152
    Likes Received:
    441
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Yes could be his theology?
     
    #34 SavedByGrace, Apr 22, 2021
  15. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2006
    Messages:
    6,890
    Likes Received:
    262
    Faith:
    Baptist
    It is complicating because of understanding each other. Both of you seem to me to be saying there is no trinity. And from what I read from each of you. You seem to be saying the same of me. I'm trying to explain the trininty as I understand it. This is all three being the same God.The Father ,The Son and The holy Spirit are one God. Sort of like God has three Offices and is still just one God. This is hard to wrap your mind around. Never the less it is true.
    MB
     
    #35 MB, Apr 22, 2021
  16. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2020
    Messages:
    10,152
    Likes Received:
    441
    Faith:
    Baptist
    then you have failed to grasp what I have written.
     
    #36 SavedByGrace, Apr 22, 2021
  17. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2006
    Messages:
    6,890
    Likes Received:
    262
    Faith:
    Baptist
    The word "person" indicates a separate being. And you say you understand it.
    MB
     
    #37 MB, Apr 22, 2021
  18. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2020
    Messages:
    10,152
    Likes Received:
    441
    Faith:
    Baptist
    The Father, Son and Holy Spirit are ONE BEING, but THREE DISTINCT PERSONS. Not to be confused with our human understanding.
     
    #38 SavedByGrace, Apr 22, 2021
  19. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2006
    Messages:
    6,890
    Likes Received:
    262
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Trying to put me in my place at the bottom I see.. This is why I question what you claim. I wonder how anyone can believe what you claim
    Maybe you should have written it in Greek. If you are a Greek expert Then what professor ship do you hold? Do you have a degree in Biblical Greek? You act as if you know Biblical Greek as well as a translator of the scriptures. Why do other translators disagree with you In what the scriptures actually say? You certainly disagree with the KJV. Just what is it that makes your interpretation so accurate?.
    You said in post 9

    This tells me you do not believe in the trinity Did I fail to understand what you clearly said?
    Actually you failed to explain what you are trying to say
    MB
     
    #39 MB, Apr 22, 2021
  20. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2020
    Messages:
    10,152
    Likes Received:
    441
    Faith:
    Baptist
    You are very confused in what you are trying to prove
     
    #40 SavedByGrace, Apr 22, 2021
Page 2 of 8
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
Loading...