So, salamander, let me see if I understand you correctly:
If my pastor dresses like the rest of the men around here, in jeans and western shirts, that is equal to transvestite behavior?
If I use the NIV in witnessing to my oil field worker neighbor, that is equal to behaving like a homosexual?
So you are saying all manner of dress save 1955 middle class white american is sinful?
If using modern language copies of the scripture is sinful, would that not mean the reformers were wrong to translate it into their language for the common man? So isn't the KJV wrong to use by that reasoning?
The hidden danger of legalism
Discussion in 'Fundamental Baptist Forum' started by stilllearning, Jul 8, 2008.
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Citing Deut. 22:5 as a Biblical principle, concering the distinction to be made, is not "legalism."
Citing Ex. 28:42, which refers to specific garments for priests, and using that verse to argue against "women wearing pants" is "legalism."
Are you with me so far?
An inability to distinguish women's button-up style tops and slacks, at least most of them that I have ever seen, and the KEY® and Dickies® brands of work clothes that I normally wear, considering that I'm a farmer, is a good reason to suggest spending some considerable time with an eye-doctor, be they either a physical or a spiritual eye doctor, as the case may be. :rolleyes:
BTW, I suggest that Ex. 28:42 is a good Biblical reason for everyone wearing 'trousers' (NKJV), or for all Baptists, anyway, since all believers are priests. (Rev. 1:6; 5:10) (BTW, the NKJV is the most 'Baptist' of all Bibles, even moreso that is the HCSB.) And since we are all now priests, in the dispensation of grace, we should all be wearing priest's attire!
Ed -
BTW, I did notice you like to see things through as with blinders on. -
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Crabtownboy said:Legalism places too much importance on rules making them the foundation of faith. Legalism says that morality is defined by the conformity to rules that are absolute, universal and without exception. Legalism results in people becoming rigid, arbitary, unloving and irrational.
The opposite of legalism is antinomianism which teaches that there are no absolute, objective or binding rules. This understanding can lead to moral relativism or moral license. Existentialism, nihilism, emotivism, situationism and hedonism result from antinomianism.Click to expand...
Attire and sensuality go with one another when desire is revealed contrary to godliness.
Attire and godliness go together when God is desired and is then revealed by the wish to not be sensual to a general audience. -
Joe said:"Accept him whose faith is weak, without passing judgment on disputable matters" Romans 14:1Click to expand...
Strengthen his faith!
Imho, even legalists deserve this.
Although when legalism goes so far as teaching heresay despite the fact the Preacher/Teacher knows better, then imo, they are probably not a Christian.Click to expand...
Wide is the path to destruction, narrow is the gate to eternal life and few will find it.
One example: Churches who preach against dancing. Some may teach dancing is sin while full well knowing David danced for the Lord (2 Samuel 6:14) and the Lord was pleased. In fact, it may be dangerous to be legalistic and criticize people serving the lord as David's wife did. She despised his dancing the for the Lord and was never able to have children after that.Click to expand...
David's dance was as a young lamb who frolicked in the pasture filled with zeal and excitement. This is a perfect example against the sensual way most like to dance.
David was rejoicing over the return of the Ark of the Covenant, not performing before an audience or exhibiting his bodily reaction to music.
Perversion of judgement makes the same mistakes you have just verbalized. -
Mexdeaf said:I am amazed that God even allows me near himself, much less that he should allow me to have a tiny part in his work. I let Him answer for me for the fruit is His regardless of how they may come to Him- humanly speaking.Click to expand...
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nodak said:So, salamander, let me see if I understand you correctly:
If my pastor dresses like the rest of the men around here, in jeans and western shirts, that is equal to transvestite behavior?Click to expand...
If I use the NIV in witnessing to my oil field worker neighbor, that is equal to behaving like a homosexual?Click to expand...
So you are saying all manner of dress save 1955 middle class white american is sinful?Click to expand...
If using modern language copies of the scripture is sinful, would that not mean the reformers were wrong to translate it into their language for the common man? So isn't the KJV wrong to use by that reasoning?Click to expand... -
superwoman8977 said:I love people that try and say being legalistic is ok and then they justify the 2000 "rules" saying everyone lives by rules. HAHAHAHAHA..okay my apologies for being in a weird mood and having hormones today. Anyway there is a thing as living by rules and then going way overboard. I love the Lord I have a relationship with Him, however I dont think I should have to justify what I wear or how I wear my hair or even what version of the bible I should use. I love the Lord I attend church, teach my children how much the Lord loves us the rest of the "rules" then happen or dont happen as God wills. JMHOClick to expand...
Standards are to incite self-control. I would have to say then that they are guidelines and not mandates. Mandates would make it legalism, but then high standards are preventative measures. -
Totally off topic comment deleted
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Okay, enough one sided barrage posting.
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Thread reopened after an explanation by the poster.
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Salamander said:I would have to say then that they are guidelines and not mandates. Mandates would make it legalism, but then high standards are preventative measures.Click to expand...
There is a catch all phrase for non-Bible based guidelines -"Abstain from all appearance of evil." Those who use "abstain from all appearance of evil" for this purpose err in two ways, IMHO.
One, the idea in the verse is that we abstain every time evil appears.
Secondly, even if this meant to "abstain every time anything that appears like it might be evil appears" we cannot use our opinion of what appears to be evil as the plumb line. We would have to use Bible principles. -
Galatians speaks about legalism and warns us not to put ourselves under the Law once again. Another word for legalism would be "Judaizer", but there are many other words used to describe legalism as well.
In this instance, some of the Jews were teaching that Christians should not only be saved by faith alone, but that it was also necessary to keep or observe the Law of Moses in order to be saved which equates to faith + good works. -
Legit question?? I don't Think so!
Salamander said:Are you a communist?Click to expand...
about something that is, in no way, germane to anything I posted in this, now re-opened, thread.
Not to mention the implied aspersions cast, by the question.
Ed -
Hi everyone
I am back from vacation, and found that a lot has been said in my absence.
And I am learning a lot.
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The main point of this post, was to point out....
“the hidden dangers of legalism”
One of which is: the Christian who adopts the extra-Biblical standards of others, may not be actually doing anything wrong;
-But they will simply stop growing spiritually!-
And 10 years later, will be at the same stage of spiritual growth, that they were at before.
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Here is another hidden danger.........
A while back, we had a missionary on deputation, come to our Church, who had been born in Soma, and came to the states, and the LORD had called him back to Soma, as a missionary.
He really loved the Lord, and did a good job behind the pulpit;
And later at lunch, we were talking, and the subject of “lava lava’s” came up. And he shared how some pastors/Churches, had refused to support him, when they learned that he was going to be wearing one, on the field.
We thought that this was ridicules.
In Soma, if a man wears pants, he is calling those who don’t, “less than men”!
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This is a good example of how legalism, can get out of hand.
Note: “Lava lava” (A Polynesian, especially Samoan, garment consisting of a rectangular piece of printed cotton tied loosely around the waist.) -
Crabtownboy Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
On the lava lava. It is like the early missionaries insisting that the Hawaiians put on wool clothing in the winter. You know how terrible those winters are in Hawaii, right?
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EdSutton said:FTR, I have absolutely no intention of ' "answering" any "'so-called' question" " ' :rolleyes:
about something that is, in no way, germane to anything I posted in this, now re-opened, thread.
Not to mention the implied aspersions cast, by the question.
EdClick to expand... -
stilllearning said:Hi everyone
I am back from vacation, and found that a lot has been said in my absence.
And I am learning a lot.
--------------------------------------------------Click to expand...The main point of this post, was to point out....
“the hidden dangers of legalism”
One of which is: the Christian who adopts the extra-Biblical standards of others, may not be actually doing anything wrong;
-But they will simply stop growing spiritually!-Click to expand...
And 10 years later, will be at the same stage of spiritual growth, that they were at before.
--------------------------------------------------Click to expand...
Here is another hidden danger.........
A while back, we had a missionary on deputation, come to our Church, who had been born in Soma, and came to the states, and the LORD had called him back to Soma, as a missionary.
He really loved the Lord, and did a good job behind the pulpit;
And later at lunch, we were talking, and the subject of “lava lava’s” came up. And he shared how some pastors/Churches, had refused to support him, when they learned that he was going to be wearing one, on the field.
We thought that this was ridicules.
In Soma, if a man wears pants, he is calling those who don’t, “less than men”!
--------------------------------------------------Click to expand...This is a good example of how legalism, can get out of hand.
Note: “Lava lava” (A Polynesian, especially Samoan, garment consisting of a rectangular piece of printed cotton tied loosely around the waist.)Click to expand...
I would have to conlcude that wearing a lava lava would be subjecting to the leaglist attitude of the native culture and embarrassing if the wind hit just right for me and them!:laugh:
That which is hidden under the lava lava would best be hidden by my pants.:sleeping_2:
Some good friends of mine were missionaries to US Somoa, the Shifletts. The natives tried to sone their children to death and they had to run for protection of the US Consulate. Talking about the hidden dangers opf legalism!
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