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Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by OldRegular, Jul 24, 2012.

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  1. DHK

    DHK <b>Moderator</b>

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    OK, So I reread it. You posted a misrepresentation of dispensationalism, a biased quote, an inaccurate description, a refutation that wasn't refuting dispensationalism at all, for no accurate picture of dispensationalism was given.
     
    #281 DHK, Aug 9, 2012
  2. OldRegular

    OldRegular Well-Known Member

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    Whatever! This forum is for posting "opinion" and you are entitled to post yours!:thumbsup::wavey:
     
    #282 OldRegular, Aug 9, 2012
  3. InTheLight

    InTheLight Well-Known Member
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    Slam dunk! Nailed it! Spot on!
     
    #283 InTheLight, Aug 9, 2012
  4. thomas15

    thomas15 Well-Known Member

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    You did? Where, in this thread or another? How did I miss that?
     
    #284 thomas15, Aug 9, 2012
  5. OldRegular

    OldRegular Well-Known Member

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    There has not been a single serious attempt on this thread to refute the classic dispensational concept that the Church is an "interruption" in God's plan for Israel. Instead there have been an endless series of "childish" comments. I must assume they are from those who belong to the Rapture Ready crowd.

    AresMan, a former dispensationalist who apparently lives amongst them as I do, has corroborated much of what I have posted yet the Rapture Ready dispensationalists still post childish comments void of any substance.

    My apologies AresMan for invoking your name.
     
    #285 OldRegular, Aug 9, 2012
  6. Bronconagurski

    Bronconagurski New Member

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    Well, then, I guess you win. Not surprising since the game was rigged.
     
    #286 Bronconagurski, Aug 9, 2012
  7. Allan

    Allan Active Member

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    Hold on now, it isn't meaningless you are decrying there will be no such thing.
    It has GREAT meaning as
    1. "Jesus" will restore again a Kingdom to Israel
    2. The Kingdom must be restored as it is no more or as if it is no more
    3. It is being restored TO Israel

    Everything you are saying will not happen we have the disciple asking Jesus about when the very thing you are say won't happen will - they ask this question because it directly pertains to the promises give TO Israel as a Nation.

    Well, much more than that but.. you make my point. You illustrate that the Kingdom of Israel is not the Kingdom of God but with the scripture in question illustrates that at some point the Kingdom of Israel operates in the Kingdom of God.

    Ok. but were not talking about the Apostle Paul but the disciples (apostles) in direct conversation with Jesus about restoring again the Kingdom TO Isreal.

    I know you have never made such a declaration.. my point is that if the Kingdom restored was speaking of Kingdom of God, and Israel was speaking of the Church... then there is a biblical problem here, as the Kingdom of God had to have been removed OR corrupted to the point it needed to be brought back to its original power and status. Therefore if that is the case the Kingdom of God has not always been or if it has, it had lost its power and authority and thus it's King was gone or lame.

    Again, we are talking about the Kingdom being restored TO Israel by Jesus because they asked - are YOU going to restore the Kingdom TO Israel at this time?

    Again, you are picking and pulling from places and events that do not speak to what I am. Yes the Kingdom OF GOD was taken from Israel and I agree with Gill and Clarke, in so far as you have stated - The Spiritual purpose(s) of Israel was taken from them and given to another, not as a second plan but in fact as part of the His full plan.

    However, my contention is this - regarding the Kingdom of God, it does in fact include the Kingdom being restored TO Israel at some point because we have the disciples asking if Jesus was going to restore again the Kingdom TO Israel. The implication is it apparently was a part of Jesus teaching of the Kingdom of God and therefore led to the very question being looked at.
    Your off on another subject again. Please stay with what I'm asking you regarding the Jesus teaching the Kingdom of God and directly following the next thing the Holy Spirit records is the disciples asking when Jesus will restore the Kingdom again to Israel.

    Many scholars (even many reformed scholars) will disagree you view and in fact, it appears the Disciples did as well when they asked Jesus when the Jesus will restore again the Kingdom to Israel.
     
    #287 Allan, Aug 9, 2012
  8. Allan

    Allan Active Member

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    That is because no one who is dispensational agrees with what you present as their argument. You have been told this MANY time over the years here, proven this, and yet you still taught to same baggage.

    Like Covenant Theology, which is ever changing and modifying (whether fast or slow) from it's inceptional form, so to is Dispensationalism.
    There are, just as with Covenant theology, many branches of Dispensaitional theology. I know of very few how even hold to classical dispensationalism (if by this you an early form) and know of none personally.
     
    #288 Allan, Aug 9, 2012
  9. OldRegular

    OldRegular Well-Known Member

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    Allan I cannot agree that there is anything left for Israel as a nation in God's plan, other than the elect. We will just have to agree to disagree.

    In the OpP I presented quotations from prominent dispensationalists. All I got in response was snide remarks!
     
    #289 OldRegular, Aug 9, 2012
  10. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    Well any change is welcome, because what OldREG has posted was what was taught absolutely. As a matter of fact look up Baptist Bible College of Clark Summit Pennsylvania.
    i think they have not changed much since the 70's

    From BBC-
     
    #290 Iconoclast, Aug 9, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 9, 2012
  11. thomas15

    thomas15 Well-Known Member

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    Call me whatever makes you happy but I'm still waiting for you to show me where you correctly used Hoyt in the three views book. My opinion is that you structured the discourse in a way to make any serious attempt to refute impossible. You might think that is productive, I don't.
     
    #291 thomas15, Aug 9, 2012
  12. DHK

    DHK <b>Moderator</b>

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    You quoted from Hoyt, who was quoted in Close. When quotes are made from others they often become skewed. Here is what is said about Close's Book, "The Meaning of The Millennium: Four Views," the book you actually took your quote from:
    http://www.ivpress.com/cgi-ivpress/book.pl/code=794


    The quote you gave does not seem very accurate, or rather does not reflect traditional "dispensational premillennialism," which would lead me to ask, in what context was it quoted?
     
    #292 DHK, Aug 9, 2012
  13. thomas15

    thomas15 Well-Known Member

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    DHK, the problem is OldRegular didn't quote Hoyt at all. Unless he used an invisable type font.
     
    #293 thomas15, Aug 9, 2012
  14. OldRegular

    OldRegular Well-Known Member

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    Read Clouse!
     
    #294 OldRegular, Aug 9, 2012
  15. DHK

    DHK <b>Moderator</b>

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    Well, I don't have the book. I have a few others on my reading list that take priority. And finally, this thread needs to be closed at 30 pages.
     
    #295 DHK, Aug 9, 2012
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