Hay all,
Who is the bride of Christ? Can they be recognized if you meet them? How?
JOEL 2 [11] And the LORD shall utter his voice before his army: for his camp is very great: for he is strong that executeth his word: for the day of the LORD is great and very terrible; and who can abide it?[12] Therefore also now, saith the LORD, turn ye even to me with all your heart, and with fasting, and with weeping, and with mourning:[13] And rend your heart, and not your garments, and turn unto the LORD your God: for he is gracious and merciful, slow to anger, and of great kindness, and repenteth him of the evil.[14] Who knoweth if he will return and repent, and leave a blessing behind him; even a meat offering and a drink offering unto the LORD your God?[15] Blow the trumpet in Zion, sanctify a fast, call a solemn assembly:[16] Gather the people, sanctify the congregation, assemble the elders, gather the children, and those that suck the breasts: let the bridegroom go forth of his chamber, and the bride out of her closet.
JOEL 2 for the day of the LORD is great and very terrible,let the bridegroom go forth of his chamber. I guess the rapture people will have to say Joel 2 is a mistake since this scripture says its the DAY OF THE LORD.
PSALM 19 [5] Which is as a bridegroom coming out of his chamber, and rejoiceth as a strong man to run a race.[6] His going forth is from the end of the heaven, and his circuit unto the ends of it: and there is nothing hid from the heat thereof.[7] The law of the LORD is perfect, converting the soul: the testimony of the LORD is sure, making wise the simple.[8] The statutes of the LORD are right, rejoicing the heart: the commandment of the LORD is pure, enlightening the eyes.
bridegroom coming out of his chamber. To recognize the "bride" you would have to find a people who believe in the testimony(Jesus)and keep the 10 commandments(Gods law)
MATT.9 [14] Then came to him the disciples of John, saying, Why do we and the Pharisees fast oft, but thy disciples fast not?[15] And Jesus said unto them, Can the children of the bridechamber mourn, as long as the bridegroom is with them? but the days will come, when the bridegroom shall be taken from them, and then shall they fast.
Can the children of the bridechamber mourn
His children(bride)WILL fast.
JER.16 [9] For thus saith the LORD of hosts, the God of Israel; Behold, I will cause to cease out of this place in your eyes, and in your days, the voice of mirth, and the voice of gladness, the voice of the bridegroom, and the voice of the bride.[10] And it shall come to pass, when thou shalt shew this people all these words, and they shall say unto thee, Wherefore hath the LORD pronounced all this great evil against us? or what is our iniquity? or what is our sin that we have committed against the LORD our God?[11] Then shalt thou say unto them, Because your fathers have forsaken me, saith the LORD, and have walked after other gods, and have served them, and have worshipped them, and have forsaken me, and have not kept my law;
The bride of Christ will be keeping the law of GOD.
They will not be practicing iniquity(lawlessness)!
Hmm..
The Rapsure?
Discussion in 'Free-For-All Archives' started by Downsville, Sep 12, 2003.
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WHEN WILL DEATH BE SWALLOWED UP IN VICTORY
1COR.15 [50] Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.[51] Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,[52] In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.[53] For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.[54] So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.
So according to the scripture in COR.15 “death will be swallowed up in victory”.
ISAIAH 25 [4] For thou hast been a strength to the poor, a strength to the needy in his distress, a refuge from the storm, a shadow from the heat, when the blast of the terrible ones is as a storm against the wall.[5] Thou shalt bring down the noise of strangers, as the heat in a dry place; even the heat with the shadow of a cloud: the branch of the terrible ones shall be brought low.[6] And in this mountain shall the LORD of hosts make unto all people a feast of fat things, a feast of wines on the lees, of fat things full of marrow, of wines on the lees well refined.[7] And he will destroy in this mountain the face of the covering cast over all people, and the vail that is spread over
all nations.[8] He will swallow up death in victory; and the Lord GOD will wipe away tears from off all faces; and
the rebuke of his people shall he take away from off all the earth: for the LORD hath spoken it.[9] And it shall be said in that day, Lo, this is our God; we have waited for him, and he will save us: this is the LORD; we have waited for him, we will be glad and rejoice in his salvation.
Well, as you can plainly read in verse 8, it is at this time death will be swallowed up in victory. Verse 4 shows that the people of God will be protected, not raptured. Verse 9 also proves this “we have waited for him, and he will save us: this is the LORD; we have waited for him, we will be glad and rejoice in his salvation.”
I know why im being shunned. The rapturist cant deny what the scriptures say. They can deny my words but the WORDs of God will come to pass as written. -
Because the payment was made, Paradise, the area where the righteous dead resided in anticipation of glory, and Hades, the realm of the wicked dead, were both opened, the souls came forth, and the Day of Judgement began. Death (which is SEPARATION FROM GOD) no longer existed because the work of Christ, finished on the Cross and accepted in Heaven, had torn down that barrier which Adam's sin erected. The great gulf was crossed.
There is no more death now (separation from God). All who die now go immediately into the presence of Christ/God for Judgment (Rom 2: 5 - 10). The righteous no longer have to wait in a "holding room" called Paradise. They can be judged, rewarded, and stand before the Beatific Vision in joy. The wicked no longer are kept from the wrath of God in a holding room called Hades. They are judged and brought into the eternal fires of His wrath.
Yes, it is glorious!! -
lol downsville, I have enjoyed reading your commentary, where are the rapturist rebuttals?
It's a shame in these end times craze what extremes some people will go to, some people need to realize the "Left Behind" books and others aren't the Word of God. -
Let's say that the one morning you and other non-believers of the "rapture of the church" wake up and find millions missing?
Now keep in mind that there will be some folks left that were very dedicated to their "church" and they are still here...remember God knows the heart of man. ;)
What would be your opinion as to what had happened to the missing people?
Just curious,
MEE -
I don't know. What if I woke up and pigs were flying?
Another problem with the rapture, if you don't believe in it you aren't Christian. I guess the gates to heaven didn't start opening till the 1800s. -
down by removing the absurb, we end up with:
"I don't know".
We tend to agree with your statement
Pigs do not Fly.
You do NOT have to believe in "the rapture"
to be a Christian. Jesus Saves, not
the Rapture Saves. The doctrine of the
Rapture existed the first 1800 years
of the Christian era. The very name of
the event comes from the Latin, in
English it is "caught up" (1 Thessalonians 4:17).
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Catholic Convert "This is EXACTLY what happened in AD70
when the Lord returned."
[scarasm]Yes, i see it in the face of the lamb
lying with the lion. Yes, i see it in the whole
world going up to Mount Zion (in Jerusalem)
to worship. Yes, i see it in the when i let
my toddler grandchild play on the asp hole.
Yes, Praise Jesus that none of us ever
have troubles as Jesus said in John 16:33b
(KJV1769): " ... In the world ye shall have
tribualtion, but be of good cheer, I
have overcome the world.[/scarasm]
:eek: -
The problem is that 1 Thessalonians 4:17 has nothing to do with the doctrine of the secret rapture that snatches believers away from tribulation. Don't kid yourself though, with some evidence of its concept in the 1700s, the secret rapture doctrine was singly-handedly invented in the 1800s as it is taught today. I thought revelation ended with the apostles, guess not.
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in 90AD) the pretribulation rapture. Takes
no "revelation" (but does take the book of
Revelation).
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I don't recall saying that anyone had to believe in the rapture of the church to go to heaven...but it sure gives one something to look forward to when He returns.
MEE -
Bro. Curtis <img src =/curtis.gif>Site Supporter
Since it's not a salvation issue, it don't pay to get all worked up about it. That's why I don't debate it.I'm a pre-tribber, some ain't.
Now how about some works-based salvationists answer my thread HERE -
that i have known are works-based salvationists. :confused: -
Justified Saint,
You said, 'It's a shame in these end times craze what extremes some people will go to, some people need to realize the "Left Behind" books and others aren't the Word of God.'
Ray is saying, From your perspective and church tradition the concept of Christ taking His people into Heaven seems foreign to you. I have never read the "Left Behind" series of books, because they are not theological books; I think they are more along the lines of the way it might be when the rapture takes place.
You are correct that these series of books are not the Word of God.
The taking of the church to Heaven [I Thess. 4:17] was believed by Christians during the apostolic times and for a few hundred years afterward, until Augustine came up with his theory of the Kingdom of God now taking place on the earth right now and even up into this 21st. century. This twisted view of theology has Catholicism by the throat as well as some Protestant church, like the Reformed Baptists. The concept of the church being taken to Heaven before the Great Tribulation and before the Second Coming of Christ after said Tribulation period of time, was lost or buried because of Roman Catholic teaching and tradition since the time of St. Augustine. Thank the Lord it has re-surfaced during our times and is taught in major Bible Colleges and renowned seminaries throughout our nation and world.
There will be no secret rapture because when He comes it will be with the shout of the Lord, plus the voice of the archangel and his trumpet blast. I hope you are ready to meet Him in the air. [I Thessalonians 4:17] -
Hi Justified Saint,
Yea, they cant come out with a rebuttal against what is written. What i dont understand is after they read whats written they still hold on to their beliefs even if it contrary to whats written. That doesnt make much sense to me. Maybe its out of fear of the tribulation hour. Anyways....God will protect HIS people at that time, according to whats written.
JOHN 17 [14] I have given them thy word; and the world hath hated them, because they are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.[15] I pray not that thou shouldest take them out of the world, but that thou shouldest keep them from the evil.[16] They are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.[17] Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.
ISAIAH 26 [20] Come, my people, enter thou into thy chambers, and shut thy doors about thee: hide thyself as it were for a little moment, until the indignation be overpast.[21] For, behold, the LORD cometh out of his place to punish the inhabitants of the earth for their iniquity: the earth also shall disclose her blood, and shall no more cover her slain.
ZEPH.2 [2] Before the decree bring forth, before the day pass as the chaff, before the fierce anger of the LORD come upon you, before the day of the LORD's anger come upon you.[3] Seek ye the LORD, all ye meek of the earth,which have wrought his judgment; seek righteousness, seek meekness: it may be ye shall be hid in the day of the LORD's anger.
PROVERBS 3 [25] Be not afraid of sudden fear, neither of the desolation of the wicked, when it cometh.[26] For the LORD shall be thy confidence, and shall keep thy foot from being taken.
PSALM 9 [7] But the LORD shall endure for ever: he hath prepared his throne for judgment.[8] And he shall judge the world in righteousness, he shall minister judgment to the people in uprightness.[9] The LORD also will be a refuge for the oppressed, a refuge in times of trouble.
[10] And they that know thy name will put their trust in thee: for thou, LORD, hast not forsaken them that seek thee.
Gods people are not appointed to wrath -
In the back of my Bible I found this. Maybe it will shed some understanding about the Books of I & II Thessalonians.
First Thessalonians . . . I will jot down the parts about eschatology. 'Many Thessalonians were disconsolate over departed love ones 4:13-17 . . . . and to assure them of their deliverance from the coming judgment of the Day of the Lord {5:1-5}; to exhort them to watchfulness (5:6-11) and orderly conduct in the assembly and in daily life [5:12-23].
Second Thessalonians . . . 'Some held that the tribulations and persecutions they were enduring were the tribulations of the Day of the Lord and consequently that they had either missed the translation {now Ray's words-Christ coming for His church/the rapture} or Paul had been wrong in his teaching (I Thess. 4:13-5:10). Paul writes the Second Epistle to commend them for their spiritual growth (1:3,4), to comfort them in their persecutions (1:5-10); to correct their misinformation and misapprehension concerning the Day of the Lord. (2:1-12); and to correct disorderliness in the church. (3:6-15).
AUTHOR . . . From the similarity of the conditions reflected by the two epistles, it is concluded that Paul wrote the second letter shortly after the first, probably within a few months. It was written from Corinth in A.D. 51.
Explanation by J. Dwight Pentecost, Th.D. -
Hey Ray
J. Dwight Pentecost,
Was that his real name? -
Ray, along with the rapture, sola scriptura, sola fide, osas, altar calls, prayers that save you, symoblic prescence of Christ in communion, symbolic baptism etc., all these teachings were burned very early on by the Catholic Church so that they could make up their own doctrines, for whatever reason.
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Just because they burned many of those faithful saints that taught those truths - does not mean they "burned" the teachings themselves.
The RCC has been very slow to learn that lesson. As Dr Carroll points out - they would have burned Dr. Billy Graham at the stake, but we observe "the gospel would have continued anyway".
Praise God!
In Christ,
Bob -
I can't trust you at all when you do things like this. If you have a case, make it, don't misquote over and over again.
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