Well, woe be unto me to goad my favorite BB hillbilly.
As far as your final response goes, it's exactly as a heller sees it: hellfire damnation where there's absolutely no mention of it.
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Unreached People Groups
- Thread starter Ascetic X
- Start date
Well, woe be unto me to goad my favorite BB hillbilly.
As far as your final response goes, it's exactly as a heller sees it: hellfire damnation where there's absolutely no mention of it.
Armchair Apologist
Active Member
It is important to understand who is speaking here. This is an unbelieving Pharisee trying to justify his own disbelief by condemning the "crowd that follows Jesus" as not knowing the law!
Is there anyone who can truly say they do not know the law? Romans 2:12-15 makes it quite clear that all INSTINCTIVELY know and understand the law whether they have the written law of Moses or not.
Therefore, I would agree that one does not have to reject the Gospel in order to be accursed. They simply have to be lawbreakers and their conscience thus renders them without excuse.
In order to become wise unto salvation, one must hear and understand the gospel of Christ so ABSOLUTELY, we need to be diligent wherever God has placed us and we need to go wherever God is leading us. Woe unto us if we preach not the gospel of Christ!
Perhaps I misunderstood your point? I feel almost certain I am talking like "Captain Obvious" here!
Ascetic X
Well-Known Member
We share our faith with others so they can have eternal life in heaven and so they can avoid eternal punishment in the lake of fire.
Revelation 20:12-15
12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
15 And whosoever was not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire.
Revelation 21
8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
Revelation 20:12-15
12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
15 And whosoever was not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire.
Revelation 21
8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
K. But the fact remains that many if not most 'evangelicals' today believe just that (or think they believe it).
John Chapter 7
49 | But this multitude that knoweth not the |
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Then why waste so much valuable time on the Baptistboard amongst all these 'saved folk' with your obsessive mission to stamp out evil Calvinism and promote Zionism when you could be out doing some serious 'soul-winning'? How many are going to hell because of your lolly-gagging on this board?
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Armchair Apologist
Active Member
Sorry, I'm just not understanding your point! What am I missing here?
This "Texas Redneck" is not ashamed to admit when a "Kentucky Redneck" say something that goes right over his head!
Anybody? Anybody? Anybody? Bueller?
Ascetic X
Well-Known Member
Calm down. No one here is trying to hurt your feelings. Everything will turn out just fine. You can bet your pink headband on it.
Sorry, I'm just not understanding your point! What am I missing here?
This "Texas Redneck" is not ashamed to admit when a "Kentucky Redneck" say something that goes right over his head!
Anybody? Anybody? Anybody? Bueller?
Ok Tex, true or false:
Millions are going to hell because they don't know/never heard the gospel.
Armchair Apologist
Active Member
Yes.
Mark 16:15. "Go into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature."
There are plenty of people who haven't heard the gospel in your town, if not in your street. And if the fate of people in closed Muslim countries troubles you, send some cash to M.E.R.F. or to organizations that beam the Good News into dark places.
There are plenty of people who haven't heard the gospel in your town, if not in your street. And if the fate of people in closed Muslim countries troubles you, send some cash to M.E.R.F. or to organizations that beam the Good News into dark places.
(Rom 1:18 KJV) For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;
(Rom 1:19 KJV) Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed [it] unto them.
(Rom 1:20 KJV) For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, [even] his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
(Rom 1:21 KJV) Because that, when they knew God, they glorified [him] not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
(Eph 1:3 KJV) Blessed [be] the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly [places] in Christ:
(Eph 1:4 KJV) According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
(Eph 1:5 KJV) Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,
Is the command "Go into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature." still valid are does "Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will," supersede it?
All of God's children will be with Him for eternity!
(Rom 1:19 KJV) Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed [it] unto them.
(Rom 1:20 KJV) For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, [even] his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
(Rom 1:21 KJV) Because that, when they knew God, they glorified [him] not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
(Eph 1:3 KJV) Blessed [be] the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly [places] in Christ:
(Eph 1:4 KJV) According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
(Eph 1:5 KJV) Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,
Is the command "Go into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature." still valid are does "Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will," supersede it?
All of God's children will be with Him for eternity!
Ascetic X
Well-Known Member
If no one preached the gospel to you, you would not be a child of God.
Armchair Apologist
Active Member
This is somewhat of a "head scratcher" here. Perhaps you may want to re-word this? You are quoting two Bible verses here almost suggesting that we need to choose one or the other! Are you suggesting that these two scriptures contradict each other?
And herein is the absolute bottom line of which all may agree (Calvinist or Arminian). Nothing to argue about here, let's get busy!
The council at Jerusalem ten years later, Peter called onto the carpet:
Acts Chapter 11
3 | saying, Thou wentest in to men uncircumcised, and didst eat with them. |
Some people take longer to get the message than others.
Matthew 24:14. "And this Gospel of the kingdom will be preached in all the world as a witness to all the nations, and then the end will come."
Amos 6:1. Woe to you who are at ease in Zion.'
(1Co 14:33 ESV)" For God is not a God of confusion ...."
*(Mar 16:15 KJV) And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
**(Rom 1:20 KJV) For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, [even] his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
(Eph 1:5 KJV) Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,
* Pre-resurrection
** Post-resurrection
I am trying to reconcile these scriptures.
Some people take longer to get the message than others.
Hmm, wonder how many Gentiles died and went to hell from not hearing the gospel during those ten years because "Some people take longer to get the message than others".
Fulfilled before the NT was even completed. Before THAT GENERATION had passed away:
14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in the whole world for a testimony unto all the nations; and then shall the end come.
34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass away, till all these things be accomplished. Mt 24
So belief cometh of hearing, and hearing by the word of Christ. But I say, Did they not hear? Yea, verily, Their sound went out into all the earth, And their words unto the ends of the world. Ro 10:17-18
5 because of the hope which is laid up for you in the heavens, whereof ye heard before in the word of the truth of the gospel,
6 which is come unto you; even as it is also in all the world bearing fruit and increasing, as it doth in you also, since the day ye heard and knew the grace of God in truth;
23 if so be that ye continue in the faith, grounded and stedfast, and not moved away from the hope of the gospel which ye heard, which was preached in all creation under heaven; whereof I Paul was made a minister. Col 1
25 Now to him that is able to establish you according to my gospel and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery which hath been kept in silence through times eternal,
26 but now is manifested, and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the eternal God, is made known unto all the nations unto obedience of faith: Ro 16
It was actually fulfilled at Pentecost, 'the gospel bomb':
5 Now there were dwelling at Jerusalem Jews, devout men, from every nation under heaven.
8 And how hear we, every man in our own language wherein we were born? Acts 2
Imagine this:
11 so shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it. Isa 55
...yea, hell's going to be full of folks on account of slacking soul-winners taking their ease, right Martin?
Ascetic X
Well-Known Member
Just because God predestines people unto the adoption of children does not mean God Himself does all the evangelism work involved.
Nature testifies to the existence of God, but nature does not preach the gospel.
Western civilization is trapped in either/or thinking, but Eastern minds are comfortable with both/and thinking.
We must be able to hold two seemingly paradoxical statements without trying to reconcile them.
Light is both a particle and a wave, simultaneously.
Water can be solid, gas, or liquid.
God is love, but God has wrath.
Ascetic X
Well-Known Member
Totally wrong.
Your view would indicate that missionary work and evangelism are not needed anymore, because the gospel went to the whole world.
That is good news for lazy and fearful people, and hyper-Calvinists, but it is not true.
The gospel went out to the known world at the time of the apostles, but God wants all men to be saved, so there is a lot more people to reach.
It is estimated that of the 8.08 billion people alive in the world today, 3.42 billion of them live in unreached people groups with little or no access to the Gospel of Jesus Christ.
According to Joshua Project, there are approximately 17,269 unique people groups in the world with 7,188 of them considered unreached (over 42% of the world’s population)! The vast majority (85%) of these least reached groups exist in the 10/40 window and less than 3% of missionary work is done among these people.
The gospel has not yet gone to the uttermost part of the earth.
Acts 1:8
But ye shall receive power after the Holy Ghost is come upon you; and ye shall be witnesses unto Me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth.
Yeah! Maybe God doesn't really care about His Gospel.
I had forgotten that you are the world's first and only Hyper-Calvinist, Dispensationalist, Hyper-Preterist.
Dunno! I was just quoting Scripture to you.
Maybe Esther 4:14 applies.