Was it worth it?

[kyredneck]

Good reply to righteousdude2 C4K, and kudos to you for the restraint/civility you've shown.

Ike was spot on when he warned us of the quagmire within the military–industrial–congressional system. I pray the Lord will help us to find a way out of it.

 

[RLBosley]

Could someone help me see the connection between being non-interventionist iin places like Iraq and being a Marxist/Leninist?

I was wondering that myself. :tonofbricks:

Not all are who hold to a non-interventionist ideology are Marxist/Leninist, and I did not say, for example, that you are. However, when blatantly false statements are made about the U.S. having imperialist aspirations, and falsely defining a hegemony, and doing so over and over and over again without intervention by staff -- as I believe the repetitive posting of non-Christian agendas are against BB rules -- then someone needs to say something.

Did you not notice the loud cries of anguish and vitriolic responses, while continuing the false characterizations of certain political ideologies they hate?

Cause daring to question US policy is un-Christian don't ya know?
America=Church to some.

I am growing more sure everyday that idolatrous nationalism is the most prevalent sin in American evangelicalism. I'm not quite ready to make the jump that nationalism is idolatry, but dang it nonsense like the above really shoves me in that direction!

 

[church mouse guy]

...We are in a state of perpetual war because politicians in both parties like their donations from the companies that get rich on war and the companies like their profits. It is not un-American to question their decisions.

A lot of people got rich on the civil war, too. Why the Hoosier poet James Whitcomb Riley lived in the house of a man who made a lot of money selling some sort of biscuit to the union army. It is like saying that preachers make a lot of money in their perpetual war against sin.

The Democrats have forgotten that they supported the war in Iraq and Clinton himself called for it. Even the loony John Kerry voted for it before he voted against it.

We all know that the Democrat Party is now a sort of pacifist party and the Libertarians have no complaint about Democrat foreign policy under Obama.

The Democrats are the party of wealth and they could care less about the sufferings of the poor. But mostly the Democrats and Libertarians are desperately searching for an issue so that Obama can hold on to the US Senate this November. The Democrats presided over World War I, World War II, Korea, and Vietnam. The Democrats abandoned Iraq and disavow that the chemical weapons now in Syria came from Iraq. They just don't know about that in spite of a letter from an Iraqi general telling them that that is what happened. And the Democrats have spilled more blood in Afghanistan than the Republicans did.

 

[NaasPreacher (C4K)]

I don't think anyone has tried to give the Democrats an out on this issue.

 

[thisnumbersdisconnected]

I am growing more sure everyday that idolatrous nationalism is the most prevalent sin in American evangelicalism. I'm not quite ready to make the jump that nationalism is idolatry, but dang it nonsense like the above really shoves me in that direction!

You didn't read what I was saying very carefully.

Is Marxist/Leninist policy "Christian"? I don't believe so. Yet those two posters repeatedly put it up on virtually every subject that comes along on this segment of the board with impunity. They are repeatedly allowed to pretend to be "patriots," among other things they say about themselves that are obviously untrue, and lie about facts over and over and over again. Concern yourself with that sin, please.

 

[church mouse guy]

The Democrats have been running against war for half a century now. Undoubtedly, they will use it as an issue in November because they still want to blame Bush for 2014. As the war against terror goes on, we will see how this one theater of the war relates to the others. One thing for sure is that Obama has removed the Arabs who were our allies and tried to install the Muslim Brotherhood, which is also active in the USA domestically.

 

[kyredneck]

You didn't read what I was saying very carefully.

Is Marxist/Leninist policy "Christian"? I don't believe so.....

No. It's distinctly Jewish.

 

[ShagNappy]

II am growing more sure everyday that idolatrous nationalism is the most prevalent sin in American evangelicalism. I'm not quite ready to make the jump that nationalism is idolatry, but dang it nonsense like the above really shoves me in that direction!

:thumbsup:

 

[InTheLight]

We are in a state of perpetual war because politicians in both parties like their donations from the companies that get rich on war and the companies like their profits.

Nonsense. If there were no wars these companies would still donate money to candidates.

 

[RLBosley]

You didn't read what I was saying very carefully.

Is Marxist/Leninist policy "Christian"? I don't believe so. Yet those two posters repeatedly put it up on virtually every subject that comes along on this segment of the board with impunity. They are repeatedly allowed to pretend to be "patriots," among other things they say about themselves that are obviously untrue, and lie about facts over and over and over again. Concern yourself with that sin, please.

If that was your point it was as clear as mud IMO. I am unfamiliar with any socialist/Marxist bent in any posters here. Mainly because I don't care. Yes there can be and are socialist Christians. Whether that is consistent or not is another matter entirely.

 

[poncho]

I really do not like personalisation of topics, but will play along on this one since my view here seems to have me labelled as a Marxist, Leninist, socialist, anti-American, anti-military, leftist peacenik.

I think I have answered that above. My family has always been military and my son-in-law (two tours in Iraq) and one of my sons are serving today. My dad was retired army (serving in both the Korean and Vietnam conflicts) My brothers and brothers-in-law all served. In 1973-1976 I was in ROTC preparing for a military career. I think that shows my willingness to serve. In 1976 while preparing for Ranger Camp the army made the decision that the broken neck I suffered in 1973 disqualified me from service.

During that time we faced a demonstration at the ROTC facility from those supposed peaceniks. I was spat at and shouted at. While I recognise it was not combat, I was ready to serve in whatever capacity my nation called on me to serve.

While you may disagree with my views, please don't try to fabricate the notion that I am in any way against the military.

My non-interventionist views come because I do care and I don't think we should lie down and let military personnel suffer and die at the hands of politicians and their corporate donors.

We are in a state of perpetual war because politicians in both parties like their donations from the companies that get rich on war and the companies like their profits. It is not un-American to question their decisions.

Exactly. Great post!

It's not un American to be anti fascist.

 

[poncho]

You didn't read what I was saying very carefully.

Is Marxist/Leninist policy "Christian"? I don't believe so. Yet those two posters repeatedly put it up on virtually every subject that comes along on this segment of the board with impunity. They are repeatedly allowed to pretend to be "patriots," among other things they say about themselves that are obviously untrue, and lie about facts over and over and over again. Concern yourself with that sin, please.

Is fascist policy Christian? I don't think so.

What lies? Just because you refuse to look at the mountain of evidence of how the neocons were planning to invade Iraq (and several other nations) for years even to the point of trying to talk Bill Clinton into it does make what I say a lie.

It makes you willfully ignorant.

And another thing just because CMG keeps trying to turn everything into a leftie vs rightie debate to avoid the central issue does not mean republicans are more "justified" than democrats for being fascists. It only means CMG is desperate to avoid the truth.

And that truth is . . .

The government has been co opted by the corporations and neither side has any qualms about sending our kids to suffer and die so some fat cat banker or highfalutin CEO can live high on the hog.

Patriotism has nothing to do with defending the criminals from either side of government when they commit such crimes against Americans and the world.

 

[NaasPreacher (C4K)]

This thread is beyond the ten page limit. I don't close threads where I am involved in a major way, but will not be posting in the thread any further.

 

[poncho]

After this post I won't be either.

Evidently after failing to get me banned for my outspoken stand against fascism in this thread (and others) TND and his two BFFs ITL and the Rev skipped over to a thread I started and true to their hypocritical selves acted in the same manner they constantly accuse me of.

http://www.baptistboard.com/showthread.php?t=93214

I'm not really complaining I mean I understand hypocrites will be hypocrites but man it's just getting old.

What else can it be but hypocrisy when these three are always showing up in any thread I am involved in and say "attempt to derail thread noted" then turn right around and attempt to derail the threads that I start?

I don't think it's worthy of being banned but gee golly wow I don't think this show of blatant hypocrisy is a policy Christians should be following anymore than the policies of authoritarianism and fascism.

ITL worries that "my influence" will corrupt the thinking of "newbies" but apparently he doesn't think he and his two amigo's three ring circus of hypocrisy will have any influence on newbies. Imagine how terrible it would be if Baptist Board were to suddenly experience an influx of anti fascists and independent thought free of the corporate induced group think we've all become so comfortable with. The heavens would fall for sure!

You know the country is in trouble when "fine upstanding Christian gentlemen" such as these three will resort to such a level of hypocrisy unashamedly in their attempts to censor and silence a person that is calling them out over their hypocrisy and willingness to go along with and defend an authoritarian fascist style of government.

It's people like these three that have made the move "from freedom to fascism" possible in the first place.

I don't know about the rest of you but I won't be bullied or coerced into going along with this style of government just because a few folks don't like to hear what I (or others) have to say about it.

 

[carpro]

Was it worth it?

IMO Absolutely.

Compared to other conflicts we have been involved in since WWII, the cost vs. gain was miniscule.

Will the people of Iraq seize the opportunity they have been offered? Time will tell us for sure, but the jury is still out.

 

[FollowTheWay]

Was it worth losing 38,000 lives in Korea?

N. Korea is still a threat in the region, but S. Korea is definitely better off.


Was it worth losing 58,000 lives in Vietnam? South Vietnam was still taken over by the North and communists killed 3,000,000 SE Asians after they took S. Vietnam.

None were military losses, but the most clearcut military victory of the 3 is Iraq.

None were political victories but the most clearcut political loss was obviously Vietnam.

Arguably, Iraq may have been most worth the cost. A murderous tyrant is gone.

The reason for the question is obvious.

Leftists and Bush haters are still trying to turn Iraq into a loss, both militarily and politically.

You're kidding, right? We definitely lost the war in Viet Nam. We gained nothing and therefore lost in both Afghanistan and Iraq.

 

[carpro]

You're kidding, right? We definitely lost the war in Viet Nam. We gained nothing and therefore lost in both Afghanistan and Iraq.

:laugh: Yeah. Right.

 

[Aaron]

Please stop feeding the trolls.