Women in the Ministry

[Briguy]

Joseph, The Bible is clear on the woman in ministry issue and you told Pam that she should do what the Holy Spirit is leading her to do. The Holy Spirit can not lead her to do that which is contrary to the Bible. You know what she is doing and it aches my heart to see you encourage what Pam is doing.

Pam, You have eluded to Paul's use of the word Law. He said it and it is God's word so it doesn't matter if you don't see it in the Law
If you fight with Paul then you fight with God as Paul wrote God's words. Instead of humbling yourself on this issue, which is so very biblically clear, you keep wanting to fight. Serve Jesus the best you can within the roles God has precribed for us. Good luck as you continue to seek the truth.
KOMH, Great points!!

 

[Joy]

One verse? Well maybe one sums it up, but the entire Bible has instructions on the roles of men and of women. I gave several already.

What about the qualifications for a pastors and deacons in Titus? How can a woman be the HUSBAND of one wife??????

 

[Joy]

Woman who are in roles of leadership over men are products of Women's lib movement.

Women are equal in value to men, but their roles in life were designed to be different by God. Just look at our different bodies. They were designed that way for a purpose. The way we think was designed for a purpose.

The Apostle Paul even uses the body as a way to describe how the church works. There can be only one head. Christ designed it to be that the man is the head of the home, and of the church.

 

[Karen]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Joy2:
...

What about the qualifications for a pastors and deacons in Titus? How can a woman be the HUSBAND of one wife??????<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

She can't, that would be a requirement for a man entering such a role, as presumably, Junia the apostle,Phoebe the deacon, the elect lady, and Priscilla fulfilled corresponding requirements.
Karen

 

[KeeperOfMyHome]

Actually, the word used to describe Phebe's ministry in the church is simply servant.

If you search for the word deacon in the NT, it comes with qualifications similar to those of an bishop.

(1 Tim 3:12 KJV) Let the deacons be the husbands of one wife, ruling their children and their own houses well.

And while the term servant and deacon are given the same meaning in Strong's Concordance, I have difficulty agreeing that both men and women are called to be deacons given the underlying qualification of a deacon in 1 Timothy. Namely, husband of one wife.

 

[SaggyWoman]

SERVANT=DIAKONO=DEACON=PHOEBE.


I am called to a leadership position in my church--non "pastoral", non "deacon", but I in no way usurp authority over men.

 

[Jette]

Hi Joy,

"The Apostle Paul even uses the body as a way to describe how the church works. There can be only one head. Christ designed it to be that the man is the head of the home, and of the church."

Man is not the head of the church, Christ is. The word head, &lt;i&gt;kephale&lt;i/&gt; in the Greek means, "source, origin, sustainer." If you look at it that way, instead of a chain of command, it makes more sense.

Take care,
Jette

 

[Joy]

Jette, thanks for that good clarification. I have tried to say before that one sex is not more important than the other in a marriage or in a church. They are equal in value, but different in function. Your analogy made that even more clear.

Saggy, I too have a leadership position in my church. I am the director of the ladies fellowship. I often end up with a lot of the scheduling tasks as well. I too have no authority over any man in our church. I don't even really have any authority over the ladies. Even though occasionally there must be an "executive" decision made, we remind each other that we are to be submissive one to another. Mostly, my job is to delegate, so that all of the required tasks get done by someone.

 

[Sue82]

Since the topic is about positions in the church, what are your opinions about a woman song director? Does anyone see that as having authority over man and if so, why?

 

[Joseph_Botwinick]

No problems here....as long as God is calling, go for it. He is our ultimate authority.

Joseph

 

[Sue82]

It's easier said than done when a few men disagree with the position. A couple of the men have pulled out from the church because of it. I want to do what God wants me to do but it's difficult when obstacles are in your way. I know only time will tell but with these barriors it confuses me on what is right.

 

[firedome]

To Pam Madore,
You wrote than Eve was deceived but, Adam deliberately chose to disobey God. This is true to a certain point. Eve disobeyed Adam did she not? Read in Ge. 2:16 and you will see that God tells Adam the consequences of eating of that particular tree before Eve is created. So, how did she come to the conclusion that you could die from just touching it? Did God tell Adam this? No. So, someone had to pass along the information and that being Adam considered to help God out by telling his wife not to even touch it let alone eat it or she would die. Does this not point to rebellion on the womans part? I am not discounting Adam's role in this play. He stands convicted right alongside Eve.
From all this we see the sentence in verses 16 and 17. Quite fitting don't you think?

 

[Joseph_Botwinick]

Sue,

I just noticed you are from Arkansas. I live in Jacksonville. What church do you attend?

Joseph

 

[Joy]

IMHO, that is on a very thin line with teaching and usurping authority. I was trained in music and could lead a choir if I chose to. I turned it down, because I wasn't comfortable with having to be the teacher of men. It's not preaching or teaching of doctrine, but my conscience wouldn't let me ride that line, so I don't do it.

 

[Joy]

Oh, and by the way, there is a reason why I moderate the Baptist Women's forum and not the Pastor's Forum!!

 

[SaggyWoman]

That is interesting, Joy, because men come to the women's forum. In a sense, isn't that taking authority from a man when he should be doing it??

 

[KeeperOfMyHome]

Originally posted by JBotwinick:
[QB]No problems here....as long as God is calling, go for it. He is our ultimate authority.

Uh-huh . . . and He would never call someone to do something that goes against His word. The Bible is our guide for living our lives (2 Tim. 3:16, 17).

 

[Joy]

I guess I asked for that one! Actually, this is the Webmaster's Board, and he has final say in everything. There are a few men who dare to come to a mostly women's domain, but I am not in authority over them. I don't teach them directly, (although I might argue with a few of them.) This is also not a church!

As a moderator, my job is to "trim" when necessary. I can delete double posts and bad language, etc. I don't think that is usurping authority. Most of the threads started here are geared to women, even though the male perspective is welcome.

 

[KeeperOfMyHome]

Sue ~ One thing I would consider is this . . . sometimes what we do is offensive to others. It might be that for the time being you might have to give it up. I would really pray about it and seek God's wisdom in the matter.

 

[SaggyWoman]

That is how I view the music person. You still have authority in that you can cut a man's opinion out of the board. . . .

The same at church. . . I am under my pastor's authority .. . . . ..

[ May 28, 2001: Message edited by: SaggyWoman ]

[ May 28, 2001: Message edited by: SaggyWoman ]