Death Penalty - Is it Biblical?

[5 point Gillinist]

Jesus changed the requirement for implementing the DP under OT Law. Instead of two or three witnesses it is “the One without sin”. Only God is without sin. Only God should implement the DP. God does need our help to do that.

peace to you

Brother, you are grievously misusing that text.

 

[kyredneck]

I think you need to move to a country with regular public hangings then.

It matters not a whit to me what you judgmental types think. You're a dime a dozen.

 

[JesusFan]

Well, I have acknowledged scripture does give governments the authority of DP.

I just don’t believe Christians should support it.

peace to you

God permits it for the state, so should we not support what he does then?

 

[canadyjd]

God permits it for the state, so should we not support what he does then?

God has often used ungodly people to accomplish His will. We, as Christians, are called to be different. We don’t repay evil for evil but trust God to bring His will.

The Apostle Paul says in 1 Timothy that God showed mercy toward him as an example for future Christians to follow.

He considered himself the worst of sinners, persecuting Christians to the death. Paul was a murderer of innocents.

And yet, God showed mercy toward him as an example for us to follow. We are to show mercy toward the worst of sinners, even murderers like Paul, just as our God in heaven did.

It is often hard to follow scripture when it rattles our beliefs. We cannot support the death penalty and at the same time show mercy toward the worst of sinners as God showed mercy toward Paul.

peace to you

 

[canadyjd]

Brother, you are grievously misusing that text.

How so?

Jesus is speaking directly concerning the implementation of the death penalty. He references the OT standard of one or two witnesses for implementing the death penalty. He clearly changes that standard from one or two witnesses to “the One without sin”.

This is God, Himself speaking. It is similar to the sermon on the mount where he changes the standards for murder, (don’t hate) adultery (don’t lust) etc.

thanks for the comment.

Peace to you

 

[tyndale1946]

The reality of it is that it was done so for centuries for that very effect, deterrence. Deal with it, grasp it, accept it, cope with it. Don't consider yourself a better Christian than those who have dealt with the reality of it.

K. That's your prerogative. Stay, and keep your children at home away from the public hangings. I'll take mine to witness the public executions. They need to see it.

OK...Kentucky we know your favorite game growing up was Hangman... Brother Glen

Ya know I love you brother

 

[tyndale1946]

The reality of it is that it was done so for centuries for that very effect, deterrence. Deal with it, grasp it, accept it, cope with it. Don't consider yourself a better Christian than those who have dealt with the reality of it.

K. That's your prerogative. Stay, and keep your children at home away from the public hangings. I'll take mine to witness the public executions. They need to see it.

Acts 1:17 For he was numbered with us, and had obtained part of this ministry.

18 Now this man purchased a field with the reward of iniquity; and falling headlong, he burst asunder in the midst, and all his bowels gushed out.

19 And it was known unto all the dwellers at Jerusalem; insomuch as that field is called in their proper tongue, Aceldama, that is to say, The field of blood.

Brother Glen

 

[canadyjd]

It matters not a whit to me what you judgmental types think. You're a dime a dozen.

Just to be clear, this is what you said.

…

K. That's your prerogative. Stay, and keep your children at home away from the public hangings. I'll take mine to witness the public executions. They need to see it.

I responded you should move to a country with public hangings since you believe your kids “need to see it”.

I apologize, I realize that is too strong.

There is no need to move to another country, just take your kids on a public hanging vacation. Just find a country with an upcoming public hanging and book the trip.

Make sure you get the kids real close so they can really see the twitching and smell the urine and poop, just like you said they needed.

All the while raise your hands and shout to heaven “I praise you Lord Jesus, thank you Lord that my children get to witness a public hanging. We glorify your name, we praise you!!!!!”

Personally, it never occurred to me that I should expose my children to a public hanging to teach them killing was wrong, but hey, you raise your kids according to your values. No judgement from me.

Peace to you

 

[SavedByGrace]

Murder in The Bible

 

[Salty]

May I step in for a moment
Looks like this is a very excellent thread -
Lots of different views
but no backbiting, ect
the way ALL threads should be done

and now back to the arguments - opps, I mean discussion

 

[5 point Gillinist]

How so?

Jesus is speaking directly concerning the implementation of the death penalty. He references the OT standard of one or two witnesses for implementing the death penalty. He clearly changes that standard from one or two witnesses to “the One without sin”.

This is God, Himself speaking. It is similar to the sermon on the mount where he changes the standards for murder, (don’t hate) adultery (don’t lust) etc.

thanks for the comment.

Peace to you

The context is key. Adultery was a very hard crime to prove, and the death penalty for such rarely occurred as it required two witnesses. Secondly, the Pharisees were in violation by not also bringing the man, in addition to the fact that they very likely set it up. Jesus also didn't say not to stone the woman in question - he was openly rebuking the religious leaders for their breaking of the law, and willingness to potentially kill this woman so as to try and entrap Jesus by either getting Him to violate God's law or Roman law, not out of a true desire for justice. Jesus never says the death penalty is abolished.

 

[Aaron]

The death penalty (DP) was often used the OT but rarely in the NT
1) Does the NT prohibit the DP

No.

2) Does the NT permit the DP

Yes.

3) Does the NT remain silent of the DP

No. Civil magistrates bear the sword, and not in vain.

A) is the DP effective in stopping murders and other major crimes

Administered justly, it is a deterrent.

B) Is Life without parole effective in stopping murders .....

A life sentence isn't a just sentence.

C) What Crimes deserve the DP

Murder, Rape, Robbery, Abduction, treason and some forms of larceny.

D) Do political parties take a strong stand on the DP - Pro or con?

They should be pro.[/QUOTE]

 

[JesusFan]

God has often used ungodly people to accomplish His will. We, as Christians, are called to be different. We don’t repay evil for evil but trust God to bring His will.

The Apostle Paul says in 1 Timothy that God showed mercy toward him as an example for future Christians to follow.

He considered himself the worst of sinners, persecuting Christians to the death. Paul was a murderer of innocents.

And yet, God showed mercy toward him as an example for us to follow. We are to show mercy toward the worst of sinners, even murderers like Paul, just as our God in heaven did.

It is often hard to follow scripture when it rattles our beliefs. We cannot support the death penalty and at the same time show mercy toward the worst of sinners as God showed mercy toward Paul.

peace to you

there is NO conflict between showing mercy towards those who have committed willful murder, and them getting executed for that crime, as they are reaping what they have been sowing!

 

[canadyjd]

there is NO conflict between showing mercy towards those who have committed willful murder, and them getting executed for that crime, as they are reaping what they have been sowing!

And yet, Paul was not executed for his part in the willful murder of Christians, and specifically says God showed mercy toward him as an example for future Christians to follow..

If we are going to obey the command of God and show mercy toward the worst of sinners, even murderers like Paul, then we shouldn’t support their execution.. that is the example we are suppose to follow.

peace to you

 

[canadyjd]

The context is key. Adultery was a very hard crime to prove, and the death penalty for such rarely occurred as it required two witnesses. Secondly, the Pharisees were in violation by not also bringing the man, in addition to the fact that they very likely set it up. Jesus also didn't say not to stone the woman in question - he was openly rebuking the religious leaders for their breaking of the law, and willingness to potentially kill this woman so as to try and entrap Jesus by either getting Him to violate God's law or Roman law, not out of a true desire for justice. Jesus never says the death penalty is abolished.

I absolutely agree the context is key. All that you said is likely true. What you are missing is the fact “men” will rarely, if ever, judge impartially. That is the point. On the issue of taking a life, mankind has proven repeatedly they cannot keep the standard of impartiality. Our sinfulness always interferes with Justice.

Jesu could have demanded they bring the man and have them both stoned to death. That would have been consistent with OT Law. He didn’t.

Instead, He gave a different standard. Instead of two or three witnesses throwing the first stone, it is the “One without sin”.

I understand you disagree with the scope of His words. Jesus is God. When God says “the one without sin be the first to throw a stone” that is a direct reference to implementing the death penalty and I take God at His word. We are not capable to making the decision to execute people with impartiality.

Thus, I do not believe Christians should support the death penalty.

peace to you

 

[Salty]

It is often hard to follow scripture when it rattles our beliefs. We cannot support the death penalty and at the same time show mercy toward the worst of sinners as God showed mercy toward Paul.

Then why not apply that to any crime -- so instead of putting people in prison or jail - show mercy towards all sinners - regardless??????

 

[canadyjd]

Then why not apply that to any crime -- so instead of putting people in prison or jail - show mercy towards all sinners - regardless??????

Good question. Christians are commanded by God to show mercy to the worst of sinners, even murderers like Paul. Governments are not. They retain the power of the sword.

Given the finality of execution, and the history of problems associated with its impartial implementation around the world and in this country, I am conflicted about whether it should continue in the US.

I do know I could never sentence someone to die (if on a jury), and I don’t think other Christians should either.

peace to you

 

[canadyjd]

Then why not apply that to any crime -- so instead of putting people in prison or jail - show mercy towards all sinners - regardless??????

I just realized I didn’t directly answer your question about showing mercy instead of putting people in jail.

It is not Christians putting people in jail, it is governments at various levels and they rightly do so for a civil society. Christians can, and do, show mercy, with many prison ministries and after prison ministries.

peace to you

 

[canadyjd]

….

A life sentence isn't a just sentence….

Murder, Rape, Robbery, Abduction, treason and some forms of larceny…...

I notice your list expands far beyond murder.

Please keep in mind the reality that in the past and, at some point in the future, according to scripture, Christians will be put to death for their beliefs. This will be done “according to the laws” in place.

By supporting the death penalty today, we are laying the foundation for the death penalty to be used against Christians in the future.

peace to you

 

[Reynolds]

The death penalty (DP) was often used the OT but rarely in the NT
1) Does the NT prohibit the DP
2) Does the NT permit the DP
3) Does the NT remain silent of the DP

A) is the DP effective in stopping murders and other major crimes
B) Is Life without parole effective in stopping murders .....
C) What Crimes deserve the DP
D) Do political parties take a strong stand on the DP - Pro or con?

Other comments?


Opinion Polls: Death Penalty Support and Religion | Death Penalty Information Center

I think it could be Biblical but the way we do it is not. The Biblical standard is quick execution. 30 years on death row prior to execution makes the execution not fulfil it's Biblical purpose.
We should also execute adulterers, homosexuals, and perverts. Why pick murder as the only offense we execute for?