Featured 2 Cor. 5:18-19

I have read your opinion. It makes no biblical sense.
Every way I look at your proposition it ultimately comes up as merit-based salvation, like Van teaches. It's interesting then that both you two teach a merit-based system, yet your system is still at odds with one another.

 

"Quantrill,

So you say All were reconciled,they would not be reconciled,they did'nt want to be reconciled.
Is that the same as being saved and lost? light and dark?wet and dry?alive and dead?

 

This thread I made a couple months back explains why I am confident my faith is not a good work in any way deserving anything, God in His grace credits me righteousness in a way I cannot boast be for Him of in anyway.

A Biblical Defense of Synergism #2

 

Why does God credit...YOU... righteous?
If it's YOUR faith, not a gift of God, how is it that YOUR faith is not merit-based?

 

I'll be blunt, because His Word says so. Not everything is logical from our limited human perspective. God's Word says it is so, I conform to His Word.

 

Sir, that is not his position. His position is that God has already, in the past reconciled the world to Himself.

 

On and on Quantrill regurgitates the same falsehoods. No verse says God has reconciled the world, only that He has reconciled individuals of the world, and is continuing to reconcile individuals to this day, thus reconciling the world. Any other view is obviously false and agenda driven.

 

I remember when I was persuaded of this some years ago, Quantrill.
I also remember how that, in my studies, the Lord gradually resolved this for me.

He showed me what happened at the cross, and the context for whom it all happened:

1) Romans 5:10, with the context established from Romans 5:1.
2) Colossians 2:13-14, with the context established from Colossians 2:6-12.
3) 2 Corinthians 5:15-19, with the context being established within itself by significant statements regarding who does not have their trespasses imputed to them and who does, as well as being established from other passages like Romans 4:3-8.
4) Galatians 2:20, all believers were legally crucified with Christ. See Colossians 2:13-14.
5) Ephesians 5:1-2, with the context being stated within the passage.
6) Ephesians 5:25-27, with the context being established in item 5, as well as with the word "it" in verse 25.
7) Matthew 1:21.
8) John 10:11.
9) Isaiah 53:8.

Those are just some of them.


It was then that I began looking at passages like 1 John 2:2 and 1 Timothy 2:4 in a different light, and taking "world" in 1 John 2:2 and questioning who it was describing...
Those that were saved out of every tongue, tribe and nation ( Revelation 5:9, Revelation 7:9 ) and those that are "called" both Jew and Gentile ( Romans 9:24, 1 Corinthians 1:24 ), instead of all men indiscriminately.

Back then I didn't understand the ramifications of it all, and I certainly didn't see all the contradictions, apparent or otherwise...
Now I see many or even most of them.
I also think that the others who are pointing things out to you, should be taking this into account.


May God bless you richly in your daily walk, and in your continuing studies of His word.

 

Van, believers should be less accusatory and more gracious in their conduct toward others ( Romans 12, etc. ).
Shouldn't we?

As I've pointed out in past threads, Van,

The tone of many of your posts doesn't seem to come across in the loving manner that a teacher or brother in the Lord should be exhibiting ( 2 Timothy 2:24 ) towards others, and they certainly aren't being deferential.
Were you trying to correct Quantrill out of a genuine love and concern for him as a brother, or just to come off sounding hurtful to him?
Because that's the way it looks to me, like you really don't care if you hammer him or not.

Honestly, sir, have you stepped back and read what you post before you post it?
I realize that I have had my moments, but to me, you really are unable to see how you come across to others.

It's one thing to disagree with someone,
and quite another to accuse them of being malicious and of purposefully lying.

 

Q, the light came on for me when I read the Bible. I once believed as you teach, but the Bible speaks and told me I was wrong to hold the position you hold. Merit-based salvation is not presented in the Bible.

 

I'll be blunt back. No, the Bible does not say so. You interpret the Bible and add merit-based faith by your interpretation, not by what the Bible says.
You are young in Christ and you zealously search, which is good. You remind me of Keith Green, who started out with a legalist belief, yet over time, as he read scripture, turned from legalism to grace. May God keep guiding you away from works and into his amazing grace. Pay attention to Dave, he is speaking truth to you.

 

Van, I tend to agree with you here. It seems (and I admit Q's teaching is a bit puzzling) that Q teaches the whole world as being reconciled, but the reconciled can destroy (or rebuild) that reconciliation on a moment by moment basis. It seems to be a hybrid wesleyan or nazarene theology, but I confess it is puzzling.

You, on the other hand, teach human faith, which causes God to either declare it righteous or unrighteous, depending on God's feelings about you on that day.

Both are merit-based means of salvation, apart from grace.

 

God Just Goes ahead and Tells it, Right Straight Out, on account of the weakness of men's minds and the tricks of Supernatural Evil.

"For by Grace are ye Saved through Faith;
and that not of yourselves:
it is The Gift of God:"

Epesians 2:8.

 

This is 'some homework'.

 

" Wherefore laying aside all malice, and all guile, and hypocrisies, and envies, and all evil speakings,
2 as newborn babes, desire the sincere milk of the word, that ye may grow thereby:
3 if so be ye have tasted that the Lord is gracious." ( 1 Peter 2:1-3 ).

" Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth." ( 2 Timothy 2:15 ).


Psalms 119:105.