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239 Experts: Coronavirus May Linger in Air, Airborne Transmission Possible

Discussion in 'News & Current Events' started by InTheLight, Jul 6, 2020.

  1. InTheLight

    InTheLight Well-Known Member
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    The World Health Organization has long held that the coronavirus is spread primarily by large respiratory droplets that, once expelled by infected people in coughs and sneezes, fall quickly to the floor.

    But in an open letter to the WHO, 239 scientists in 32 countries have outlined the evidence showing that smaller particles can infect people and are calling for the agency to revise its recommendations. The researchers plan to publish their letter in a scientific journal.

    Even in its latest update on the coronavirus, released June 29, the WHO said airborne transmission of the virus is possible only after medical procedures that produce aerosols, or droplets smaller than 5 microns. (A micron is equal to 1 millionth of a meter.)

    Proper ventilation and N95 masks are of concern only in those circumstances, according to the WHO. Instead, its infection control guidance, before and during this pandemic, has heavily promoted the importance of hand-washing as a primary prevention strategy, even though there is limited evidence for transmission of the virus from surfaces. (The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention now says surfaces are likely to play only a minor role.)

    But interviews with nearly 20 scientists — including a dozen WHO consultants and several members of the committee that crafted the guidance — and internal e-mails paint a picture of an organization that, despite good intentions, is out of step with science.

    Whether carried aloft by large droplets that zoom through the air after a sneeze, or by much smaller exhaled droplets that may glide the length of a room, these experts said, the coronavirus is borne through air and can infect people when inhaled.


    239 experts with 1 big claim: The coronavirus is airborne

    If true, this could possibly explain a lot of confounding things that are occurring. Things like ten times the infection rate as has been confirmed. People getting "mild" cases of the Covid-19 or not showing symptoms at all. People with antibodies present in their blood but had never exhibited symptoms.
     
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  2. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    [​IMG]
     
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  3. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    Businesses, including sports, and schools are going to have to come to grips with employees and athletes catching this virus and learn how to plow on without shutting down again and again and again. There is always gonna be a risk that there will be cases as long as people leave their houses; and now with this next big scare with this claim that this virus is airborne, not just droplets, it sort of sounds to me like they are saying one human being can never be in the same room with another human being, at least until there is a vaccine. I seriously doubt the powers that be will be able to get people to go along with that idea, although I guess there could be a few cases of some people going into full hermit mode.
     
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  4. InTheLight

    InTheLight Well-Known Member
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    I don't think it will become policy that two humans can't be in the same room together! I think it will lead to greater wearing of masks mandates. Look at Trump's upcoming New Hampshire rally. It will be an outdoor event at an airport but masks will be strongly encouraged and will be available at the door. VP Pence has been wearing masks to public events; previously he has not. Texas and Arizona have upped the mask wearing protocol in those areas where there have been outbreaks. This is sensible.

    I agree, we can't go back to shutting down the economy again. We need to clamp down wherever infection spikes occur but get back to normal everywhere else.
     
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  5. Calminian

    Calminian Well-Known Member
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    Curious if these are the same experts that approved the "protests."

    Trump OTOH:

    "Why does the Lamestream Fake News Media REFUSE to say that China Virus deaths are down 39%, and that we now have the lowest Fatality (Mortality) Rate in the World. They just can’t stand that we are doing so well for our Country!"​

    I think it's time to count our blessings and even celebrate. Illnesses are a part of life.

    BTW, Herman Cain seems to be doing well. Tweeting up a storm, including tweets about HCQ (something else to celebrate).

    Also from Trump:

    “Treatment with hydroxychloroquine cut the death rate significantly in sick patients hospitalized with COVID-19 – and without heart-related side-effects, according to a new study published by Henry Ford Health System. In a large-scale retrospective analysis...

    ...of 2,541 patients hospitalized between March 10 and May 2, 2020 across the system’s six hospitals, the study found 13% of those treated with hydroxychloroquine alone died compared to 26.4% not treated with hydroxychloroquine.”
    @HenryFordNews

    Time to removes the ma....... oh I see you already did. :Thumbsup
     
    #5 Calminian, Jul 6, 2020
    Last edited: Jul 6, 2020
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  6. Scott Downey

    Scott Downey Well-Known Member

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    Corona can infect people by just thinking about it...look at the fallout from what the experts thinking about it has done to our economy. Corona not only makes you physically sick, it can infect you mind.
     
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  7. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    Absolutely, this whole mess goes beyond just the physical. This situation is probably weighing down most people mentally and emotionally.
     
  8. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
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    ...it's a corrupt media that's done this. Thank God for Trump.
     
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  9. carpro

    carpro Well-Known Member
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    It may look like Texas has upped the mask wearing protocol, but in truth, a careful reading of the Governor's mandate will tell you it's mostly smoke and mirrors. Local governments all over the state are refusing to enforce it. They say it's unenforceable and they won't answer 911 calls for a mask complaint..

    The problem...back in February and March, Dr Fauci, the WHO, the CDC, and the Surgeon general all said masks were ineffective and not necessary. People remember it. Now, they're having a real problem unringing that bell. Their credibility is shot

    A report like the one above underscores the credibility problem. Once again, the scientific community is changing course, and if it really is true what they say about the smaller particles, that underscores once again the ineffectiveness of wearing a mask.
     
  10. Scott Downey

    Scott Downey Well-Known Member

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    It was and is total incompetence on their part.
    He said they did that original recommendation for the public not to wear masks was to prevent the public from buying up all the supply and preventing the medical industrial complex from running out of masks. So nothing to do with public safety concerns as it hurt public safety and they did not care.
    Then they wanted people to wear home made masks even though they dont work, and they still dont care about our lives, look at how fauci handles the hydroxychloroquine issue. If anyone listens to these guys, they are fools, as foolish as the ones pronouncing all these regulations. And many people are idiots. As the world is full of evil sinners who dont know left from right, God is right and just in throwing most of them into the fire of hell while having mercy on some to know the truth. And the truth is this life is temporary, James describes it as a vapor.

    And a vapor has no power or authority, just blown away by the wind
    James 4:14 [Full Chapter]
    whereas you do not know what will happen tomorrow. For what is your life? It is even a vapor that appears for a little time and then vanishes away.
     
    #10 Scott Downey, Jul 7, 2020
    Last edited: Jul 7, 2020
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  11. carpro

    carpro Well-Known Member
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    So they deliberately lied.

    Which always leaves us with the obvious question>>>what else are they lying about... for the good of the ignorant masses , of course.??
     
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  12. Earth Wind and Fire

    Earth Wind and Fire Well-Known Member
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    You didn’t live thru the carnage then. I lost 4 very good family friends... two that were surrogate mothers to my wife growing up. It was hell! Couldn’t even go visit them in the hospitals... but then again we were loosing approx 300 per day and you loose that many, only the under taker benefits.

    Now my son down in Florida is having some anxious moments. His car dealership may have to shut down do to the lack of clients and his wife was just layer off from her food service job... we just sent them money to by food.​
     
  13. InTheLight

    InTheLight Well-Known Member
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    Scientific knowledge evolves. We know more now than we did then.

    From the article:

    Many experts said the WHO should embrace what some called a “precautionary principle” and others called “needs and values” — the idea that even without definitive evidence, the agency should assume the worst of the virus, apply common sense and recommend the best protection possible.

    “There is no incontrovertible proof that SARS-CoV-2 travels or is transmitted significantly by aerosols, but there is absolutely no evidence that it’s not,” said Dr. Trish Greenhalgh, a primary care doctor at the University of Oxford in Britain.

    “So at the moment we have to make a decision in the face of uncertainty, and my goodness, it’s going to be a disastrous decision if we get it wrong,” she said. “So why not just mask up for a few weeks, just in case?
     
    #13 InTheLight, Jul 7, 2020
    Last edited: Jul 7, 2020
  14. Earth Wind and Fire

    Earth Wind and Fire Well-Known Member
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    Ok what’s the timetable on a vaccine?
     
  15. Scott Downey

    Scott Downey Well-Known Member

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    Likely late fall 2020 at the earliest.
     
  16. InTheLight

    InTheLight Well-Known Member
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    Reserving masks for the medical community during a mask shortage and keeping people at home until the supply chain catches up seems like a sensible strategy. The medical workers are the front line in the battle against this virus. You don't protect them, you get a shortage of doctors, nurses, ER workers, the whole system collapses. Prioritizing the distribution of masks in a shortage was the correct strategy. What would you have done differently?

    Nice blanket statement there about the medical community--"they don't care about our lives".

    Exhibit A in why it would be better off if non-Christians never discover this site.
     
  17. InTheLight

    InTheLight Well-Known Member
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    So, Thanksgiving, or thereabouts, Dr. Downey?
     
  18. carpro

    carpro Well-Known Member
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    That doesn't explain why they deliberately lied and admitted it. And now the science is coming right back to their original position, making what they thought were deliberate lies actually the truth.

    That also doesn't explain the constant back and forth. Maybe some of them should consider just shutting up until they actually KNOW what they are talking about.

    I just can't avoid the feeling that what we are dealing with here is either a political agenda or a mind boggling level of incompetence.
     
  19. StefanM

    StefanM Well-Known Member
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    I understand the strategy. I think the possible flaw was in the messaging, and some of the confusion in the messaging was simply because we simply didn't know as much then as we do now. I think some of the messaging came across as entirely denying the efficacy of masks, when the actual message was, as you indicated, more about PPE availability for healthcare workers.

    Ideally, if we all knew then what we know now, the message could have been, "Reserve the medical-grade PPE for those in the medical field. We don't want to run into shortages for those on the front lines. However, if you can make or acquire a non-medical grade face covering, using that covering will help to prevent you from inadvertently infecting others." I think the health experts at the time were doing the best they could, though, and I definitely don't fault them for adjusting advice as data comes in.
     
  20. StefanM

    StefanM Well-Known Member
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    One point, I'm not so sure that the initial advice was totally incorrect.

    Mask wearing (in non-medical contexts) doesn't do much for asymptomatic cases if only a few people are wearing masks. The benefit of mask wearing is evident primarily when the majority of people wear masks. With a shortage of PPE, having a handful of people buying up masks, thinking the masks (other than N95) will protect them from contracting Covid-19, is counter-productive because the shortage would ensure that not that many people would be able to wear the masks. If only a handful of people wore masks, that might help a little, but it's quite likely that asymptomatic cases would still be prevalent among those not wearing masks.

    The option for non-medical grade masks changes the strategy because it doesn't consume PPE needed by medical providers. IIRC, it wasn't clear initially that non-medical grade masks were helpful.
     
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