A fundamental premise of the big lie is extraterrestrial aliens exist apart from God

It is the fundamental point of my exposition, that ufo aliens do not exist...that they do is the premise of the great delusion, while in reality the "aliens" are fallen angels, satan's angels who are masquerading as angels of light...disguised as ufo aliens wanting to help mankind.

Evidently God will allow they enter our realm of existence, like unfallen angels can, physically:

8 So he took butter and milk and the calf which he had prepared, and set it before them; and he stood by them under the tree as they ate. (Gen 18:8 NKJ)

10 And while they looked steadfastly toward heaven as He went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel,
11 who also said, "Men of Galilee, why do you stand gazing up into heaven? This same Jesus, who was taken up from you into heaven, will so come in like manner as you saw Him go into heaven."
(Act 1:10-11 NKJ)

As for "alternate realities," I mean that in the sense Paul does, when he contrasts our "partial" (MEROS) with the coming "complete" (TELEIOS) in 1 Cor 13:10.

Its important to remember, God doesn't live in either reality although He certainly is omnipresent in both:

27 "But will God indeed dwell on the earth? Behold, heaven and the heaven of heavens cannot contain You. How much less this temple which I have built! (1Ki 8:27 NKJ)

Both the MEROS and TELEIOS cohere and have their being, in God:

17 And He is before all things, and in Him all things consist. (Col 1:17 NKJ)

28 "for in Him we live and move and have our being, (Act 17:28 NKJ)

God alone is infinite, all finite creatures live in the realities He constructed for them.

Until New Jerusalem descends, a game changer:

2 Then I, John, saw the holy city, New Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
3 And I heard a loud voice from heaven saying, "Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and He will dwell with them, and they shall be His people. God Himself will be with them and be their God. (Rev 21:2-3 NKJ)

As Paul said, when the COMPLETE comes, the Partial "will be done away":

10 But when that which is perfect has come, then that which is in part will be done away. (1Co 13:10 NKJ)

That fits, when the "more substantial" enters the space occupied by the less substantial, the latter is done way.

 

Anonymity encourages such brain dead comments, I've learned to ignore them.

I admit to dishonoring myself with like comments about others in the past, but posting under my real name makes me careful not to bring shame upon myself ridiculing others.

I'm in the process of building my own site, and I won't allow posting under avatars...then its likely I won't need to moderate either, folks likely will moderate themselves...being that stupid comments could follow them for life, just like it does in real life.

Why should people be allowed to bear false witness, anonymously?

While some would argue folks won't post if they have to use their real names, I reply: What will be lost? Brain dead insults, ridicule of others? "Don't feed the troll" comments? Good riddance.

AND this way they get the credit for the wise things they say.

I could be wrong, but message boards never achieved the greatness I thought they would, they ALL seem very small, folks post for a time, and then move on...I suspect people get tired of being ridiculed, unfairly, by anonymous trolls.

When a person is behaving as a Christian, they respond to absurd or wrong statements, in love, with the truth, in all patience....if one surveys Christian boards...a loving attitude of helping others seems to be a rarity, and I blame anonymity, people just don't act properly, when they don't have the self restraint that comes from not wanting to make a fool of oneself.

 

I thought this was the non Baptist thread...that means the entire thread should be moved over.

The identification "Baptist" doesn't convey the orthodoxy it once did...but being non denominational doesn't really make me non baptist, not if you mean "believing in full immersion baptism into the historic trinitarian Christian faith."

 

If I can't post in this thread because I'm not a baptist, and you won't move it to a non baptist forum, then...what?

 

What space aliens...they don't exist.

 

Excellent.

 

The locusts of Rev 9

The locusts of Rev 9

As it is impossible humans see the "seal of God" on the foreheads of His people, the following cannot refer to human armament.


1 Then the fifth angel sounded: And I saw a star fallen from heaven to the earth. To him was given the key to the bottomless pit.
2 And he opened the bottomless pit, and smoke arose out of the pit like the smoke of a great furnace. So the sun and the air were darkened because of the smoke of the pit.
3 Then out of the smoke locusts came upon the earth. And to them was given power, as the scorpions of the earth have power.
4 They were commanded not to harm the grass of the earth, or any green thing, or any tree, but only those men who do not have the seal of God on their foreheads.
5 And they were not given authority to kill them, but to torment them for five months. Their torment was like the torment of a scorpion when it strikes a man.
6 In those days men will seek death and will not find it; they will desire to die, and death will flee from them.
7 The shape of the locusts was like horses prepared for battle. On their heads were crowns of something like gold, and their faces were like the faces of men.
8 They had hair like women's hair, and their teeth were like lions' teeth.
9 And they had breastplates like breastplates of iron, and the sound of their wings was like the sound of chariots with many horses running into battle.
10 They had tails like scorpions, and there were stings in their tails. Their power was to hurt men five months.
11 And they had as king over them the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in Hebrew is Abaddon, but in Greek he has the name Apollyon. (Rev 9:1-11 NKJ)

6 And the angels who did not keep their proper domain, but left their own abode, He has reserved in everlasting chains under darkness for the judgment of the great day;
(Jud 1:6 NKJ)

These fallen angels released from the Abyss (ἄβυσσος) of Torment (Luk 8:31) are still bound (Jude 1:6) by God's will, that is the meaning of Locusts prohibited from eating the vegetation they voraciously crave (9:4), they are compelled to torment their own followers rather than the children of God they despise (cp 1 Sa 16:14; Acts 5:16; Isa 50:11).

The crowns indicate these fallen angels "Nephilim; fallen ones" (Gen 6:4) once reigned as kings in the antediluvian world and were contemporaries of the "sons of God" who were seduced by the women of men, effectively joining the satanic plot to produce a hybrid human-angel seed to war against the seed of the woman (Gen 3:15).. The long hair and lions teeth indicate they are extremely vicious and blood thirsty warriors who once feasted on human and animal blood (cp Gen 9:4-6). Their breastplates of iron symbolizes imperviousness, the sound of chariots and many horses their power to rip into and shred infantry. They stung their victims like scorpions, who hold their prey while their tail administers the tormenting poison.

Their ruler is the Devil "who would be The King"---incarnate in the hybrid human "son of perdition" (John 13:27; 17:12l 2 Th 2:3), that is the meaning of the Hebrew "Abaddon"---Destruction, the angel who Destroyed many only to be destroyed himself (Dan 9:27; Rev 20:10),. The symbolic name Apollyon confirms, it being a cryptic reference to emperors who claimed to be the Greek god Apollos incarnate.

These locust demons are bound to do God's will, while their king Satan helplessly watches, for five months. The limit implies these return to their torments in the Abyss after they have accomplished all God has commanded they do. No doubt this entire experience was additional torment to what they already suffer.

To sum up, this is not a reference to angelic or human technology, nor ufo aliens as their existence is only a strong delusion.


The horrible punishment of these spiritists should have compelled others to repentance, but it did not:

20 But the rest of mankind, who were not killed by these plagues, did not repent of the works of their hands, that they should not worship demons, and idols of gold, silver, brass, stone, and wood, which can neither see nor hear nor walk.
21 And they did not repent of their murders or their sorceries1 or their sexual immorality or their thefts. (Rev 9:20-21 NKJ)

 

Rev 9:13 Then the sixth angel sounded: And I heard a voice from the four horns of the golden altar which is before God,

"Horns" represent kingship (Dan 7-8), power to save (Ex 29:12) or destroy (Ex 21:14), "four" completeness (Rev 4:6-8), hence the voice sounding from the four horns of the altar before God symbolizes it has God's authority and everything in this vision is by God's decree, not the independent action of its actors.


14 saying to the sixth angel who had the trumpet, "Release the four angels who are bound at the great river Euphrates."

Compare:

6 And now you know what is restraining, that he may be revealed in his own time.
7 For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only He who now restrains will do so until He is taken out of the way.
8 And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming.
(2Th 2:6-8 NKJ)


God unleashes the lying spirits that cause Babylon the Great to apostatize (fall) from all that is called God, to a new spiritistic religion of the antichrist. This kills them spiritually and physically.

NKJ Jeremiah 51:1 Thus says the LORD: "Behold, I will raise up against Babylon, Against those who dwell in Leb Kamai, A destroying wind. (Jer 51:1 NKJ)

The "Athbash" "Leb Kamai" is a cipher that reverses the order of spelling to indicate something more than Chaldea is meant, namely, "Babylon the Great."

The four angels are symbolic, not actual angels just as the four horses of the apocalypse are not actual horses, they symbolize what is being released will go out in every direction (Rev 6).

All not having God's name on their forehead (Rev 9:4; Mat 24:24; 2 Thess 2:13f) in Leb Kami Babylon the Great are the targets.

2 And I will send winnowers to Babylon, Who shall winnow her and empty her land. For in the day of doom They shall be against her all around.
3 Against her let the archer bend his bow, And lift himself up against her in his armor. Do not spare her young men; Utterly destroy all her army.
4 Thus the slain shall fall in the land of the Chaldeans, And those thrust through in her streets.
5 For Israel is not forsaken, nor Judah, By his God, the LORD of hosts, Though their land was filled with sin against the Holy One of Israel."
6 Flee from the midst of Babylon, And every one save his life! Do not be cut off in her iniquity, For this is the time of the LORD'S vengeance; He shall recompense her. (Jer 51:2-6 NKJ)


Verse 6 shows this occurs when God commands His people come out of Babylon:

4 And I heard another voice from heaven saying, "Come out of her, my people, lest you share in her sins, and lest you receive of her plagues.
5 "For her sins have reached to heaven, and God has remembered her iniquities.
6 "Render to her just as she rendered to you, and repay her double according to her works; in the cup which she has mixed, mix double for her.
7 "In the measure that she glorified herself and lived luxuriously, in the same measure give her torment and sorrow; for she says in her heart,`I sit as queen, and am no widow, and will not see sorrow.'
8 "Therefore her plagues will come in one day-- death and mourning and famine. And she will be utterly burned with fire, for strong is the Lord God who judges her. (Rev 18:4-8 NKJ)


15 So the four angels, who had been prepared for the hour and day and month and year, were released to kill a third of mankind.

God's decree is for this precise time, no more...no less, the scope of its destruction is limited "a third of mankind" is killed, not all.


16 Now the number of the army of the horsemen was two hundred million; I heard the number of them.


"Two hundred million" (δισμυριάδες μυριάδων) understates their number, μυριάς (“ten thousand”) designates an incalculable immensity, figurative of an innumerable, indefinite host (Gen. 24:60; Lev. 26:8; Num. 10:35[36]; Deut. 32:30; 33:2, 17; 1 Kgs. 18:7–8; 21:12[11]; Ps. 3:7[6]; Cant. 5:10; Sir. 47:6; Mic. 6:7; Dan. 7:10; in Ps. 90(91):7 LXX.


17 And thus I saw the horses in the vision: those who sat on them had breastplates of fiery red, hyacinth blue, and sulfur yellow; and the heads of the horses were like the heads of lions; and out of their mouths came fire, smoke, and brimstone.

This is a vision (ὅρασις) like Daniel's (4, 5, 8 etc), therefore these are symbols, not descriptions of actual objects. The horses are not technology, human or angelic...they symbolize an army.

These demon spirits are God's army of unholy myriads He sends to consume children of the Devil.

τοὺς καθημένους ἐπ᾽ αὐτῶν "those sitting (middle voice) on them" indicates the riders are affected by the action, not initiating it. God is in complete control, the demons are His helpless victims, they are now being forced to destroy their own followers.


All three colors of the breastplates and their phenomena occur in a volcano; hence, this is symbolic of hell. While breastplates of righteousness (Is 59:17; Eph 6:14) faith and love (1 Th 5:8) exist, these are breastplates of destruction...all killed by this demonic army are cast into the lowest hell to await judgment day.

Just as the heads of the tails injure (vs. 19), these "heads of lions" are ruthlessly efficient killing, "eager to tear...ambush" (Ps 17:12) to devour (1 Pet 5:8),

The "fire, smoke and brimstone" out of their mouths is the judgment of God against the slain (Rev 14:10)



18 By these three plagues a third of mankind was killed-- by the fire and the smoke and the brimstone which came out of their mouths.


Given the symbolic nature of this vision, "a third" symbolizes God's restraint, it could have been much worse.

19 For their power is in their mouth and in their tails; for their tails are like serpents, having heads; and with them they do harm.

This symbolizes all not consumed by the fire from their mouths, are killed by venom. This demonic killing horde is terrifyingly efficient, it kills those in front, and any it missed, as it passes through the ranks.


This isn't merely physical death, its spiritual also. These rise up in the Day of Christ only to be cast head long into the lake which burns with fire and sulphur.


20 But the rest of mankind, who were not killed by these plagues, did not repent of the works of their hands, that they should not worship demons, and idols of gold, silver, brass, stone, and wood, which can neither see nor hear nor walk.
21 And they did not repent of their murders or their sorceries or their sexual immorality or their thefts. (Rev 9:13-21 NKJ)

This confirms the connection is to Babylon the Great and its great spiritistic falling away from all previous beliefs in God, to follow the "god of forces" (Dan 11:38f) the demon spirits preached:

And he cried mightily with a loud voice, saying, "Babylon the great is fallen, is fallen, and has become a dwelling place of demons, a prison for every foul spirit, and a cage for every unclean and hated bird! (Rev 18:2 NKJ)

 

That the demons symbolized by the horse and rider are the mystery of lawlessness, that secret power inciting rebellion against God's Law, is seen in the symbol of the mouth and serpent tail having a head:

For their power is in their mouth and in their tails; for their tails are like serpents, having heads; and with them they do harm.
(Rev 9:19 NKJ)

Compare:

The elder and honorable, he is the head; The prophet who teaches lies, he is the tail.
(Isa 9:15 NKJ)

Out of their mouths come the lies of hell that destroy all who believe their message. While some suppose the "harm" is not unto death, that is contradicted giving both the same "power" which in this context, is the power to kill: "For their power [to kill] is in their mouth and in their tails."

Hence those not killed directly by their mouths, will die from the venomous lies they were injected with.

 

13 And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs coming out of the mouth of the dragon, out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet.
14 For they are spirits of demons, performing signs, which go out to the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty. (Rev 16:13-14 NKJ)

This is a vision (ὅρασις Rev 9:17; Dan 8:16 cp 8:20), the unclean spirits are "like frogs", they aren't frogs nor will they look precisely like them. The likely frog meant here is was common in Egypt during Exodus (8:1-15), the Ptychadena mascareniensis, also known in English as the Mascarene rocket frog--- when disturbed, they leap into or away from the water, simultaneously expelling a jet of water from the bladder. Satanic power enabled Pharaoh's magicians to command these frogs (Ex 8:7).

http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fichier:Ptychadena_mascareniensis.jpg

These unclean spirits like frogs are Fallen Angels pretending to be UFO aliens, performing great signs to mislead the kings of the earth into waging a war against God Himself just as they did to Pharaoh (Ex 7:22). This war is described in Rev. 19:11-21.

 

I agree the rapture already happened, before the bowls began to be poured out.

The parenthetical is not a corruption:
"Behold, I am coming as a thief. Blessed is he who watches, and keeps his garments, lest he walk naked and they see his shame."
(Rev 16:15 NKJ)

Its meant to show (in this book of symbols) that some see through the lie and don't follow the UFO delusion.

These weren't believers before, they became believers because it was proved to them these things were all predicted in scripture, before they happened...and they saw the proof God's Word is True, with their own eyes...

And He opened their understanding, that they might comprehend the Scriptures. (Luk 24:45 NKJ)

And believe.