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A simple fact

Discussion in 'Calvinism & Arminianism Debate' started by glad4mercy, May 8, 2018.

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  1. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    As I understand, only the born again, from Abel to Abraham, to Peter worshipped YHWH by divine revelation. And Jesus as YHWH when he arrived physically as the Son of Man. So it was always the New Birth, given by God, that enabled faith in him.
     
  2. JonShaff

    JonShaff Fellow Servant
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    I would urge you to reconsider that school of thought. Scripture is clear that believing God at His Word will bring about the New Birth.

    Christ coming to earth is a unique situation in that Jews who were already born again would get a chance to See their God in the Flesh and follow Him as well--and truly born again people WOULD have followed Jesus (if you followed my Father you will also follow me). I've addressed this in my posts. Unbelieving-non born again Jews would not come to Jesus because they would not come to Yahweh--this is the point Jesus was making. He was having a conversation with a specific audience at a specific time in His ministry.

    We as gentiles are called to believe on the Lord Jesus Christ--who have NO clue who Yahweh is--and from there we receive the New birth.
     
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  3. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    But we must remember, faith is a fruit of the Holy Spirit. This means, one must first have the New Birth before any true understanding of scripture is possible. “But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,” (Galatians 5:22) (KJV 1900)

    We already pointed out how nasty the flesh is, and it would never receive Christ on its own.
     
  4. JonShaff

    JonShaff Fellow Servant
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    What does Scripture say?

    Ephesians 1
    13 In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise, 14 who is the guarantee of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, to the praise of His glory.

    It's always the Same--Heard the Word of Truth, Believed on the Lord Jesus, New Birth. The Gospel has the Power to bring Salvation.
     
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  5. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
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    Wrong, the power to salvation is found in the gospel romans 1:16 and faith comes from hearing the word of God Romans 10:17
     
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  6. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    But without first having the Holy Spirit it yields no fruit. “For by grace you are saved through faith, and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God; it is not from works, so that no one can boast.For we are his workmanship, having been created in Christ Jesus for good works that God prepared beforehand so we may do them.” (Ephesians 2:8–10) (NET)
     
  7. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
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    The gift is grace not faith
     
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  8. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    What good is grace that does not save? If it only allows you to save yourself it is not grace.
     
  9. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
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    Please show me what passage that question comes from.
     
  10. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    “Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.” (Hebrews 12:2) (KJV 1900)
     
  11. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Its both, as sinners have no faith in themselves....
     
  12. glad4mercy

    glad4mercy Active Member

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    Believing is not a work.
     
  13. glad4mercy

    glad4mercy Active Member

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    Yes, Jesus is the author and finisher of my faith. If you don't think I believe that, you are not reading my posts with understanding. Read my sig.
     
  14. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    If it is a condition for salvation you must choose to meet - it is.
     
  15. Reynolds

    Reynolds Well-Known Member
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    No, its a choice.
     
  16. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    I don't recall our conversation you refer to....
     
  17. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    If you must choose to believe, it is because you do not. I need not choose to believe the chair exists that I'm sitting in while typing this.
     
  18. Reynolds

    Reynolds Well-Known Member
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    Believing it exists is not a "work." Could you type if you didn't believe the keyboard was there?
     
  19. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    If it is a choice, it is a work. Moreover, if you must choose to believe, it is because you do not believe. I need not choose to believe in Jesus, he is in my heart.
     
  20. glad4mercy

    glad4mercy Active Member

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    You all don't even try to understand one's view. Your reply demonstrates that you are not listening.

    Quote- Can all men repent (and by inference believe)?

    If the Gospel is preached and the Spirit convicts, man can repent and believe by the Grace of God.

    quote- Will all men repent and believe?

    No.

    Quote- Ephesians 1:4 4 just as He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we would be holy and blameless before Him.

    Yes, God took and takes the INITIATIVE in salvation. Always.

    Quote- God the Father chose the Elect for salvation from eternity past.

    Elect according to the foreknowledge of God, says Peter and Paul, (in Romans 8)

    quote- He did not choose them based on any merit they possessed.

    Repentance and faith merit nothing. Christ's work is our only merit.

    quote- No one who comes to faith in Jesus Christ is worthy of that faith. Salvation – all of it – is the gift of God (Ephesians 2:9).

    If you receive a gift by faith, it is still a gift. Nothing we do changes the fact that salvation is all of God.

    quote- If only the Elect will come to faith in Christ, why preach the gospel?

    Please see Romans 10:14

    quote- The preaching of the gospel is as much a proclamation of judgment to those who reject Christ as it is a message of hope to the Elect.

    How can someone reject Jesus if He did not die for them?
     
    #100 glad4mercy, May 12, 2018
    Last edited: May 12, 2018
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