Anyone who believes that the age of glaciers cannot be accurately determined has probably never set foot on a university campus, let alone earned a Ph.D. from one.
And we all know that the story of Noah’s Ark cannot be a literal, historical account because even the U.S.S. Ronald Reagan could not hold a pair of all the unclean animals and seven pairs of all the clean animals alive on the earth 6,000 years ago. And when one adds the weight of the necessary food and cages, we know that the ship would have to be close to the size of the state of Rhode Island. And of course very few kinds of fresh water fish can tolerate more than a trace of salt in the water, and very few salt water fish can survive can survive in brackish water, so of course four men and four women built aquariums for thousands of kinds of fish, filled them with water containing the appropriate amount of salt, scooped up the fish in a net, and the ship didn’t sink! Even a ship the size of the state of Texas could not hold that about of weight. This is a simple fact! And for any Baptist to say that facts are irrelevant to Biblical truth desecrates the Baptist faith, and does not say a whole lot for the Bible!
Can an Evolutionist be Saved?
Discussion in '2005 Archive' started by Mike Gascoigne, Dec 13, 2004.
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I don't understand why you even call yourself a Christian if the entire bible is a big fairy tale to you. If this is representative of the state of the baptist church on the left-behind coast, then I would start looking out for the big one.
2Pe 3:3 Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,
2Pe 3:4 And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.
2Pe 3:5 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:
2Pe 3:6 Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished:
2Pe 3:7 But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.
According to my God, the flood is a fact. You get your facts from who? An omnipotent, holy God taught me about the creation. Who was your science teacher? Do his credentials hold a candle to the creator of the universe's? -
However, the description of the Ark and Noah's family and the construction of the Ark and the bringing of the animals into it does NOT include the slightest hint of a miracle. We simply have the account of physically impossible acts which obviously did not literally occur as portrayed.
I believe in all the miracles in the Bible that are described as miracles. I do not, however, hold to a literal interpretation of accounts of things that were not described as being miracles and yet were impossible. These are NOT two peas in the same pod, but more like a pea and a monkey wrench.
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Craigbythesea, I am profoundly dissapointed that you cling to human reasoning at the expence of Biblical truth.
Did the flood happen? Jesus testified to it in Matthew 24. There he said all were taken away; you could not have the death of ALL if it were some localized flood.
Could everything fit into the ark? I'll answer with a question: Is anything impossible with God?
If we believe that He is God, He not only did not need the Ronald Reagan, He could have done the same with something no bigger than a rowboat.
As for fresh water fish in salt water and visa-versa, God made the fish, He could make them to survive anything. Did three Hebrews survive a night in a firery furnace?
As for the earth being a very old age, a lot older than when man appeared; while the Genesis account does have that curiosity in saying, "And the earth was void and without form..." One MUST look at every scripture that speaks on a subject. The problem with the old earth theory is the fourth commandment in Exodus 20:11:
"For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them..."
Who wrote that? God Himself.
I have great fear for you and everyone who wants to reduce to allegory great portions of God's Word. I say that like the Apostle Paul said of the Galatians who had fallen into legalism..."I fear for you." Not judgemental, fearful for you. I sincerely fear for you. -
Mike -
Mike -
CBTS,
As one of my professors at SEBTS was fond of saying, "You, my friend, are a bleeding heart liberal."
It is absolutely heartbreaking that you are teaching your pseudotheology in a church setting. According to your beliefs, Christ's sacrificial death on the cross is up for debate beacause it is not stated as miraculous or supernatural- just detailed as history. CBTS, the greatest miracle in human history was God incarnate on a cruel cross for the sin of humanity. His subsequent, SUPERNATURAL, MIRACULOUS RESURRECTION, validating His power to be Savior and Lord.
May the scales that Satan (if you believe in such a grade school character)has blinded you with be removed quickly. -
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Matt Black Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
Mike </font>[/QUOTE]But that's pure extra-Biblical speculation! You can't have it both ways: either you argue that everything in the Bible is literally true, in which case you have a six-day creation and an absolutely massive Ark containing ALL species - two or in some cases seven of EVERY KIND - or you don't. The moment you start picking and choosing which species went into the Ark, you depart from the literal reading of Scripture and throw similar doubt on the literal reading of the Genesis 1 & 2 creation accounts.
Oh, and to answer the OP question - yes of course!
Yours in Christ
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Perhaps you're under the assumption, in the ancient earth timeline, that mammoths are dinosaur-era animals. They are not. They are contemporary animals, as are the sabre-tooth cat and giant sloth, all of which became extinct rather recently. Again, this is, for the sake of arguement, presuming an ancient earth timeline.
[ December 14, 2004, 12:41 PM: Message edited by: Johnv ] -
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the question was can an evolutionsist be saved?
Here is my question after seeing comments from people that believe that the new birth is aprocess with several steps.. and it isn't a "creation" but a process. When Christ called Lazurus by name, Lazurus came out. dead now alive. that is type of the new birth...
So many christians state that they deny natural evolution then they state spritural evolution.
just a thought.
Brother larry -
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Mike </font>[/QUOTE]But that's pure extra-Biblical speculation! You can't have it both ways: either you argue that everything in the Bible is literally true, in which case you have a six-day creation and an absolutely massive Ark containing ALL species - two or in some cases seven of EVERY KIND - or you don't. The moment you start picking and choosing which species went into the Ark, you depart from the literal reading of Scripture and throw similar doubt on the literal reading of the Genesis 1 & 2 creation accounts.
</font>[/QUOTE]Matt,
This has got nothing to do with the age of the earth or the size of the ark. I'm just trying to answer Craig's question about what would happen if Adam stepped on an ant before the fall.
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Mike </font>[/QUOTE]A very interesting and scary thought, Mike. Thank you! -
Apparently, craig has not been listening to very much news lately. News that many, many evolutionary scientists are starting to back away from the theory in just the last few months.
News that says there HAS to be intelligent design behind our universe and therefore without the theory of evolution the billions of years are NOT a requirement.
You see, if you brain-wash everybody in the world that evolution is fact instead of theory, and work backwards, you have to say that the earth is very, very old, because evolution theory will not work without an old, old earth. Therefore, the two are tied hand in hand.
I guess Job didn't really know what he saw either, did he?
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