church of Christ

Ponder away brother! :wavey:

 

HP: I agree that belief is no mental assent. It is the placing of ones trust in obedience to God’s commands. Obedience and trust go hand in hand. Trust and obedience take intents of the will formed voluntarily in conformance to His Word. Man must do something to place trust in Christ as well as to form intents in obedience to His initial call to repentance and then to active obedience. Man has to do something to voluntarily submit his will to God. As I have stated numerous times, that which man is called on to do is not meritorious in nature, but rather is always thought of in the sense of ‘not without which.’ We are NOT saved ‘for the sake of our repentance’ or ‘for the sake of our trust,’ or ‘for the sake of our obedience,’ but neither will any be saved apart from those things.

If I told you that I ‘should not’ do something, does that mean ‘I cannot’ or ‘I will not’ do it? ‘Should not’ does not mean or imply ‘cannot’ or ‘will not.’ Try re-reading John 3:16 as it actually reads, not how one might desire for it to read or tries to make it read.:thumbsup:

 

This essay does not concern me, as it is a second-hand source at best. It also seems to assume the same historical errors that many make, namely that Alexander Campbell was a founder of the Churches of Christ, and that the Restoration Movement = the Churches of Christ.

The first item:
I spent a total of over two years in the Churches of Christ. I still participate in one congregation thereof.

I have personal firsthand knowledge of what they are like.

I also have the most important work ever written by Alexander Campbell in my personal library. It is a 2001 reprint of his 1830's classic The Christian System.

I have a firsthand knowledge of his views.

I can assure you that some of his views would have put him in the `let him sit in a pew, but keep him mostly quiet' category in most Churches of Christ. I know this from firsthand experience of both his views and of the Churches of Christ.

The second item:
Also, these are historic facts: the Churches of Christ formalized their split from the Disciples/Christians via the 1906 census, and Alexander Campbell died in the 1860's.

Alexander Campbell was a leader of the Restoration Movement; he died too soon to be a member of the breakaway Churches of Christ -- even in the unlikely scenario he would have wanted to be.

 

Sigh.

Jhn 10:28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any [man] pluck them out of my hand.

Is that better?


How about this one?

Jhn 3:18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

 

How old are you? If you have firsthand knowledge of Campbell's views that would put you somewhere close to the age of Abraham when he died.:thumbsup: :thumbsup:

 

Smart allac. :smilewinkgrin:

How much of his own work have you read? I have first hand knowledge of his own views from reading his own work -- something you show no sign of having done. Instead, you quoted somebody else about him.

As much as you do not like to admit it, you just did not know what you were talking about when you alleged him to be a leader of the Churches of Christ. However, we all make mistakes, and when one is shown to us, the responsible thing to do is accept it.

You compound your mistake by persisting in it -- and making a snooty comment to the person who brought it to your attention. These activities do not exactly project intellectual responsibility.

If you would actually read any significant portion of his own work, you would a choice of two options. One option: you would have to accept that his views on some issues very important to the Churches of Christ are substantially different. Your second option: lie. This would be your choice to make if you read any significant portion of his own work.

As for chronology, it is this simple: Alexander Campbell was not a leader in the Churches of Christ. He could not have been a leader of a religious group that did not exist in his lifetime. The Churches of Christ split away from the Disciples/Christians via the 1906 census, decades after his death.

The Churches of Christ as they exist today are due in large part to the influence of Daniel Sommer in the 1880s and afterward, and the leader of the actual 1906 split was David Lipscomb. Alexander Campbell had been dead since the 1860's.

 

Yes, God's grace determines who is saved. It is what brings salvation to all people. It is by which we are saved (Titus 2:11; Eph 2:8).

 

HP: Is that code words, or simply a nice way of saying, those that God predestined to damnation? Sounds like double predestination to me...and to Calvin as well.

 

This thread will soon close but I want to make one observation. The Church of Christ is misnamed because it teaches a false doctrine of baptismal regeneration and that God cannot eternally secure the Salvation of those for whom Jesus Christ died. I do not doubt that it teaches other false doctrines but these two are enough to disqualify it as a Church of Jesus Christ.

 

I guess I didn't get in on this thread much. Oh well:tongue3: :laugh:
I was raised a Lutheran and sprinkled as a baby. The only baptism required for a person to go to heaven is the baptism of the Holy Spirit. The ordinance of water baptism is the first important step of obedience for the believer but it is not required to be saved!!!:thumbsup: :jesus:

 

You may be correct. I do know that back in Eastern Tennessee the people in the Church of Christ were called Campbellites. [It was them old Baptists.:smilewinkgrin:] Perhaps they were wrong or perhaps your knowledge is not as extensive as you think. :smilewinkgrin:

 

Well said!

 

That in itself was a good observation.
This thread, having reached 30 pages needs to close. Please feel free to start another.