death penalty?

Diggin in da Word · Sep 25, 2006

the wages of sin is death...

That is speaking of spiritual death, not physical death. Although sometimes things that we do does bring death.

Authorities were set up for the express reason of meting out justice in whatever means they deemed necessary. Even the death penalty. For crimes on this earth, judgment must be passed by proper authorities. Else this country would not last for long at all.

We are to love our enemies, to pray for them, but we are not meant to be door mats. Stand for the Word of God, man. It allows capital punisment.

canadyjd · Sep 25, 2006

If it where in your power, would you demand the death penalty for the Apostle Paul for his murder of Christians prior to his conversion?

peace to you

raying:

Diggin in da Word · Sep 25, 2006

If I had lived in Paul's time and Paul was not yet a Christian, I am sure the Lord would give me the wisdom to speak to him the needed words to witness Christ to his soul.

If I were a ruler and had to arrest Paul on murder charges, I am sure I would witness to him, but would obey the laws of the land if it came down to putting him to death for killing others.

And I am sure God would have not held that against me.

canadyjd · Sep 25, 2006

Diggin in da Word said:
If I had lived in Paul's time and Paul was not yet a Christian, I am sure the Lord would give me the wisdom to speak to him the needed words to witness Christ to his soul.

If I were a ruler and had to arrest Paul on murder charges, I am sure I would witness to him, but would obey the laws of the land if it came down to putting him to death for killing others.

And I am sure God would have not held that against me.

Let's see, Nero was the ruler of the Roman Empire. He ordered Christians burned at the stake to light his garden for a party. Since Nero was literally the "law of the land", would you support his death sentence for all those Christians? Do you think God held that against him?

How about Muslim governments giving the death penalty today for Christians. They are acting according to the "law of the land". Do you support the death of Christians in Muslim countries? They are, after all, committing a death penalty offense by converting to Islam.

peace to you

raying:

gekko · Sep 25, 2006

... so preach to the guy... then put him to death...

some philosophy ya got there... quite the witness too...

Marcia · Sep 25, 2006

canadyjd said:
Let's see, Nero was the ruler of the Roman Empire. He ordered Christians burned at the stake to light his garden for a party. Since Nero was literally the "law of the land", would you support his death sentence for all those Christians? Do you think God held that against him?

How about Muslim governments giving the death penalty today for Christians. They are acting according to the "law of the land". Do you support the death of Christians in Muslim countries? They are, after all, committing a death penalty offense by converting to Islam.

I know you asked someone else, but I just want to point out that in these cases, neither the Christians killed by Nero nor the Christians executed by Muslim governments have killed anyone. In other words, they were not executed under law for murder, which is what I think we are talking about here. I know the question of the OP is general, but most people are taking it as the death penalty in the US for murder (and I guess you could include high treason but that should probably be another thread).

Hope of Glory · Sep 25, 2006

canadyjd said:
Can you image what the early church thought about the conversion of Saul? Can't you see how frightened/amazed they were that the one that had sought their death with great passion, was now living His life for the cause of Christ?

But, the other apostles and disciples avoided him for a while; they didn't believe him.

Phillipians121 · Sep 26, 2006

Glad to see that over half of the posters on here understand what Gods word has to say about the subject :wavey:

TC · Sep 26, 2006

Magnetic Poles said:
The same Old Testament being used to support the death penalty also proscribes it for a rebellious son, a disobedient wife, and for a number of other petty offenses. Take a look a the long list of OT capital crimes.

2 Tim 3:16 All scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting, and training in righteousness, (NIV)

:type:

gekko · Sep 26, 2006

Glad to see that over half of the posters on here understand what Gods word has to say about the subject

in other words...

you're glad to see that over half of the posters on here are happy to see people die at the hands of men...

could somebody post the scriptures supporting the death penalty that are in the new testament please? i havn't read all these pages and dont plan to. just dont have the time. or link to the post or something?
thank you.

God bless

canadyjd · Sep 26, 2006

Marcia said:
I know you asked someone else, but I just want to point out that in these cases, neither the Christians killed by Nero nor the Christians executed by Muslim governments have killed anyone. In other words, they were not executed under law for murder, which is what I think we are talking about here. I know the question of the OP is general, but most people are taking it as the death penalty in the US for murder (and I guess you could include high treason but that should probably be another thread).

I believe something was said about following the "law of the land". That's what I responded to.

peace to you

raying:

Phillipians121 · Sep 26, 2006

in other words...

you're glad to see that over half of the posters on here are happy to see people die at the hands of men...

If it means saving INNOCENT lives then of course, who wouldn't?
So you are saying you are on the side of the murderer than the victim?
Man we live in a sick distorted world.

There are consequences for sin and this just happens to one of them. Eye for eye thooth for thooth-by the government, not by individuals.

canadyjd · Sep 26, 2006

Phillipians121 said:
If it means saving INNOCENT lives then of course, who wouldn't?
So you are saying you are on the side of the murderer than the victim?
Man we live in a sick distorted world.

There are consequences for sin and this just happens to one of them. Eye for eye thooth for thooth-by the government, not by individuals.

Are you talkin to me? Are YOU talkin to Me? ARE YOU TALKIN TO ME?:smilewinkgrin:

Try not to delete the poster's names or we won't know who you are speaking to.

peace to you

raying:

I Am Blessed 24 · Sep 26, 2006

Originally Posted by Phillipians121
Man we live in a sick distorted world.

Surely this doesn't come as a surprise to you?

gekko · Sep 26, 2006

yes we do live in a sick, wicked, deceitful and distorted world...

especially when it comes to the following: witness to a murderer - if he says no the first time - put him to death for his murder.

sin does have consequences. Jesus said hate is murder. are we going to put all those that hate people to the electric chair? or how about those that lie? steal? commit adultery? covet?
is physical murder the only sin that is punishable by death?
---

im still waiting for new testament scripture pertaining to the death penalty.

God bless.

Phillipians121 · Sep 26, 2006

Surely this doesn't come as a surprise to you?

No but it is even more sick and distorted comming from "Christians" I expect those to be against the death penalty from the world but not bible believing Christians?

I can't believe how many disagree on plain biblical truths on here?

Phillipians121 · Sep 26, 2006

How about this....

In the New Testament, Jesus denied trying to overturn the Old Testament law. "Do not imagine that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets. I have come not to abolish them, but to complete them." (Matthew 5:17) The apostle Paul told the Romans that revenge and retribution are different things entirely. "Never try to get revenge: leave that, my dear friends, to the retribution. As Scripture says, vengeance is mine -- I will pay them back, the Lord promises." But then just a few verses later, Paul notes that "if you do wrong, then you may well be afraid; because it is not for nothing that the symbol of authority is the sword: it is there to serve God, too, as his avenger, to bring retribution to wrongdoers." (Romans 13:4) "Authority" refers to the state, which is empowered to put evildoers to the "sword." Paul asserts that the state’s retribution of capital punishment is the retribution of God.

Clearly, the Christian Testament regards retribution by the state as not only different from vengeance, but rather as opposites. Vengeance is always personal and it is only rarely proportional to the offense. The Hebrew standard of justice for "an eye for an eye" replaced the hateful and very personal "head for an eye" standard of vengeance. Retribution is impersonal punishment by the state. And impersonal punishment is far more likely to be proportionate to the crime, meaning that it comes closer to the standard of "eye for an eye."
http://72.14.253.104/search?q=cache...nd+the+new+testament&hl=en&gl=us&ct=clnk&cd=1

pinoybaptist · Sep 26, 2006

Phillipians121 said:
No but it is even more sick and distorted comming from "Christians" I expect those to be against the death penalty from the world but not bible believing Christians?

I can't believe how many disagree on plain biblical truths on here?

My question is why do you think that if you're a Christian you should be or must be, for the death penalty ?

Why can't somebody be a believer, and yet against the death penalty ?

What I don't buy about being against the death penalty is when they bring in God's standards into the argument. Some people are just naturally repulsed by the thought of killing, period. But I don't think we ought to use God as an excuse.

On the other hand, there are those who may not necessarily be professing Christians but absolutely pro-death penalty, and so I don't think being pro-death penalty should be associated with being Christian.

Phillipians121 · Sep 26, 2006

Because God is. throughout biblical history God has always dealt with those who sin. It is his way of cleaning out evil so it doesn't spread through each generation.
Here is just one small example.

My bible study today was about Saul in 1 Samuel 15, God asked Saul through Samuel to DISTROY the Ameleks because of their evil ways. He said for Saul to distroy ALL the men women and children and infants and animals. Spare No one.
Saul disobeyed so God delt with him in other areas. It is because Saul and others in the old testament didn't totally obey God in distroying all he had asked, that there are so many problems today with the Palestinians.

We wouldn't have half the crime we would today in America if there were harsher punishments. Punishments that fit the crime. we have it all backwards in this country the crimminals have more rights than the victims. Something is wrong with that picture.

canadyjd · Sep 26, 2006

Phillipians121 said:
We wouldn't have half the crime we would today in America if there were harsher punishments.

We wouldn't have any crime in America today if everyone had the same spirit of mercy, compassion and love that Jesus commanded His followers to have.

peace to you

raying:

death penalty?

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