In the Greek there is no purpose clause for "for the remission of sins," just a prepositional phrase with eis as the preposition. I would translate it, "Be baptized on account of the remission of sins" (with that as the basis for the baptism, in other words). A simply solution for what is a simple Greek problem.
A. T. Robertson points out parallel passages for this usage in his Word Pictures:
"It is seen in Mt 10:41 in three examples eis onoma prophêtou, dikaiou, mathêtou where it cannot be purpose or aim, but rather the basis or ground, on the basis of the name of prophet, righteous man, disciple, because one is, etc. It is seen again in Mt 12:41 about the preaching of Jonah (eis to kêrugma Iôna). They repented because of (or at) the preaching of Jonah. The illustrations of both usages are numerous in the N.T. and the Koiné generally."
Does Acts 2:38 REALLy teach water baptism requiredto be saved?
Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Yeshua1, Feb 28, 2014.
Page 2 of 4
-
John of Japan Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
-
Never mind. -
What about this verse. Luke 5:14. Jesus has just healed a leper.
-
The 40th verse plainly says 'Save yourselves'. Baptism HAS to be part of what they had to do to 'Save yourselves'.
Had to be. It's just too plain, too cut & dried, that's what they had to do to be 'saved'. -
It's the same exact thing that Christ said:
He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved........ Mk 16:16
They had to get themselves baptized in order to be saved! Why is that so hard to accept? -
John of Japan Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
Have to go to church. It's Sunday morning in Japan. -
John of Japan Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
-
Saved in what way?
Saved from what?
Saved to what?
What is this saved you speak of?
Mind you, I'm not advocating a narrow "saved from hell, going to heaven" point of view, merely asking for yours.
I see about a half dozen ways in which "saved" is used in the NT, and the least of all uses denotes being converted, saved from hell, going to heaven, or any if the typical synonyms
So how do you define saved, and how does it apply to baptism?
BTW, I see no water in Mark 16:16 -
As usual James, you are actually using your own personal judgment in the matter. Kudos to you.
Baptism is an act of profession, in the case of the Jews of 'that generation' profession was required of them in order to 'save', to 'deliver', themselves from the wrath to come upon that generation.
When Peter says, "Save yourselves", he is not saying "Send yourselves to heaven". He is saying, 'Escape the wrath to come'. -
....Save yourselves from this crooked generation. They then that received his word were baptized....
Exactly as Christ instructed:
He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved....
Exactly as Peter said (again):
which also after a true likeness doth now save you, even baptism... -
Acts 2, NASBIt's a passive verb, indicating an action perpetrated on the subject of the sentence with no active participation by the subject, and it's the same in both Greek and English. Coulda saved yourself a whole lot of grief and aggravation by using a good translation.
40 And with many other words he solemnly testified and kept on exhorting them, saying, "Be saved from this perverse generation!" [Emphasis added] -
Lol, so what are pretending to be now d-CON? A modern linguistics translator?
I'll wait for JoJ's comments. -
Good stuff on those who were at John's baptism, and baptism as a form of confession.
I think some of your word usages have many people tripped up. When "saved" always means conversion and regeneration, or going to heaven, it's hard to get what you mean.
That's why I try to ask.
Good stuff -
-
-
John of Japan Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
Edited in: I edited, taking out a couple of extra returns, then clicked on "save" to "save" my changes. So this post is now eternally "saved," is it not?? :smilewinkgrin: -
John of Japan Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
-
Acts 2:5 tells us the audience that Peter would preach to was primarily Jewish. When Peter finished his sermon the collective Jewish audience was "pierced to the heart" (2:37). Peter was acquainted with the ministry of the John the Baptist (John 1:19-28) since Andrew, his brother, was a disciple of John (1:40). The Gospel of Luke provides more insight into John's baptism: John 3:3 "And he came into all the district around the Jordan, preaching a baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins". In verse 8 we read about those who were coming to be baptized, "Therefore bring forth fruits in keeping with repentance and do not begin to say, 'We have Abraham as our father.' For I say to you that God is able from these stones to raise up children to Abraham." It is interesting that John did not pronounce those who were water-baptized "saved". Those who were coming to be baptized were predominately Jewish. John knew the dead legalism of the Jewish faith at that time. He knew that, lead by the Pharisees, the people would turn John's baptism into nothing more than a pious work. Religious chest thumping. The true sign that repentance had taken place was a changed life. That is only possible through the new birth.
Being acquainted with the baptism of John, Peter insisted that the Jews in Acts 2 not only repent, but be baptized. They must identify with their now risen Lord and make a public declaration which would forever separate themselves from dead ritualistic Judaism. It was a serious act because it would result in their excommunication from the Jewish faith and Jewish society. To turn baptism into a requirement for salvation is to misunderstand the text and to pervert the Gospel. Indeed, while baptism is a commanded step of obedience, it is not capable of regenerating the soul. The Philippian jailer was told, "Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you shall be saved" (Acts 16:31). In his great treatise on justification by faith (Rom. 4-5), Paul never once mentions baptism. When he finally does mention baptism (Rom. 6:3), it is baptisms symbolism that is stressed, "Even so consider yourselves to be dead to sin, but alive to God in Christ Jesus" (Rom. 6:11).
During the patristic age baptism was often withheld from people as a form of political, civil, or religious penalty. This was a serious matter because many in the early church considered baptism necessary for salvation. This mistreatment of baptism later became and effective weapon of the Roman Catholic Church which would threaten individuals with the denial of its sacraments as a means of forcing obedience.
Baptism is important. Those who contemn the ordinance commit a serious error. Willful refusal to submit to baptism could be a sign of an unregenerate (rebellious) heart. But some individuals, like the thief on the cross, had no opportunity to submit to water baptism. If someone believes water baptism is required for salvation, then there is no exception clause. Jesus would have lied when he told the thief, "Today you will be with me in paradise."
The teaching that water baptism is a required component of salvation must be strongly opposed and condemned. -
JohnDeereFan Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
How can that be? If baptism saves, then why doesn't not being baptized condemn?
Out of curiosity, did you notice that the portion you quoted began in the middle of the passage?
Here's the whole passage:
For Christ also suffered once for sins, the righteous for the unrighteous, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh but made alive in the spirit, 19in which he went and proclaimed to the spirits in prison, 20becausee they formerly did not obey, when God’s patience waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was being prepared, in which a few, that is, eight persons, were brought safely through water. 21Baptism, which corresponds to this, now saves you, not as a removal of dirt from the body but as an appeal to God for a good conscience, through the resurrection of Jesus Christ, 22who has gone into heaven and is at the right hand of God, with angels, authorities, and powers having been subjected to him.
You realize that this passage, when taken in context, says that we're saved by the ark, which is Christ and His atoning work, and not through baptism.
Baptism corresponds to the ark, not to the flood.
Notice also, that it says that baptism doesn't make us clean.
-
pinoybaptist Active MemberSite Supporter
now if he starts to explain WHICH salvation requires baptism then you all are going to question......what ?
his sanity ?
:laugh:
Page 2 of 4