...or are they just called something else? I have always been curious of this, as Paul and Peter both go into pretty thorough detail of this official position in a church. I know some churches call them bishops, shepherds, pastors, and overseers. I was just curious about the Baptist way on this particular issue.
"Elders" in Baptist churches?
Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by ChurchofChristguy, Apr 27, 2019.
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ChurchofChristguy Member
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Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk -
A survey of this Baptist understanding:
SBTS's Greg Wills, "The Church: Baptists and Their Churches in the Eighteenth and Nineteenth Centuries":
"the pastor and deacons jointly constituted the eldership. South Carolina’s Tyger River Baptist Association, for example, judged in 1835 that "the eldership of the church" consisted of "the ministers and deacons."
Shaftsbury Baptist Association, 1804 Circular Letter:
"These are both called Elders, I Timothy 5:17. . . .By these Elders, we understand Bishops and Deacons; and we have not learned from the scriptures, but that these two are the only officers to be ordained in the Christian Church."
American Baptist Magazine, 1829:
"The term elder was, probably, a general term equivalent to our word officer; and thus it could be applied to a pastor, or to a deacon ; and the elders of a church included the pastor or pastors and the deacons."
In Charles Spurgeon's "The Sword and Trowel", 1866:
"the term elder is applied both to bishops and deacons"
Spurgeon's predecessors concurred:
William Rider, Laying on of Hands Asserted, 1656:
"in the word Elders is comprehended all officers in the Church, with the Ministerial work also, . . . and so Elders is distinguished into several offices in the Church, as Bishops and Deacons . . . . Philip. 1.1 vers. where the Apostle writeth to the Saints, with the Bishops and Deacons: so Paul to Timothy writes of the qualifications of the Bishops and Deacons ; not Elders and Deacons ; you shall never in all the Scripture find Elders and Deacons expressed."
Benjamin Keach, Gospel Mysteries Unveil'd [1701]:
"Moreover, the Deacons are to be helps in Government. Some think Paul calls the Deacons Elders, when he speaks of Elders that rule well [I Tim. 5:17] (as our Annotators observe)" -
More from the passage from Spurgeon's Sword & Trowel:
"the term elder is applied both to bishops and deacons....distinct officers were recognized by the Church, but they were lovingly blended together. There was no contention about a name as expressive of an authority, which it would have been sacrilege for others to invade."
Also:
Charles Spurgeon, "Work for Jesus":
"I remember that when Andrew Fuller had a very severe lecture from some Scotch Baptist brethren about the discipline of the church, [the Scotch Baptists were a short-lived offshoot: "A plurality of elders or pastors in every church, is a distinguishing feature in their order. . . .they consider a church incomplete without a plurality."] he made the reply, "You say that your discipline is so much better than ours. Very well, but discipline is meant to make good soldiers. Now, my soldiers fight better than yours, and I think therefore that you ought not to say much about my discipline." So the real thing is not to be for ever calculating about modes of church government, and methods of management and plans to be adopted and rules to be laid down, which it shall be accounted a serious breach to violate. All well in their place, for order is good in its way. But come, now, let us go to work. Let us have something done." -
and IMHO - I do not see the Deacons as officers of the church - their duty is to take care of the physical needs of the congregation - so the pastor (Elder) may concrate on the spiritual needs of the church. -
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Revmitchell Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
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Southern Baptist Convention > 2000 Baptist Faith and Message > Article VI The Church
...and you've previously assured us:
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Do you have a link about the IRS and Baptist deacons ( I looked - did not see anything) -
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Reynolds - thanks for the info.
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ChurchofChristguy Member
In small churches of Christ, it is common that there are no elders, only deacons. But that is usually more of a function of a control freak pastor/minister/preacher than anything else.
But most CofCs have elders. They are considered more "overseers" or "shepherds" of the church, while deacons are more "doers" - looking after finances, plumbing, missions, etc. In some CofCs, the elders are more considered spiritual overseers where the practical goings on of the church default to the ministers and deacons. In other CofCs, the elders take on more of a "board of trustees" role. -
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we are an independent Baptist church - .....
and that issue is not a test of fellowship. -
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(and by the way - we are also fundamental as well!) -
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