Fake Eschatology, continued from previous thread

Funny, that is exactly what I think of "futurist" views of eschatology. Presuppositions are built into the views of those who follow this view, clouding what should be a clear interpretation.

What you see as several dispensations I see as different eras. We have two dispensations - the old covenant and the new one.

 

Not so many years ago, I was in complete agreement with you. Fortunately for all of us, our views on eschatology do not affect our salvation.

 

Nero was not the beast/antichrist. There are many Scriptural criteria he didn't fulfill, while the TRUE beast will fulfill all to the letter.

Nero was never in Jerusalem, so he couldn't've committed the AOD. (No one has yet.)

He didn't overthrow 3 other rulers to become Caesar, but was APPOINTED by his uncle Claudius Caesar, & confirmed by the Senate.

He did not have a miracle-working false prophet as a deputy.

And he was not cast alive into hell, but DIED, having had his scribe Epaphroditus stab him rather than be captured by Galba's men.

 

If you BELIEVED ALL of them, you'd recognize there's a lot of eschatological events yet to be fulfilled. If yopu say they have been, why can't you tell us the names of the beast & false prophet, describe the mark of the beast, , etc. etc?

 

Not to speak for @kyredneck, but you do realize we have answered your questions many times. It's okay that you disagree with our views, but you keep acting as if we had never answered your questions. The fact that you disagree doesn't mean we can't or haven't answered these questions.

 

This generation means millennia later.
Soon means millennia later.
Quickly means millennia later.


He’s straightjacketed by his futurism.

 

So much for interpreting Scripture literally :Geek

 

The point is that they're all 'entities', not individuals.

The 'man' of Ephesians 2:15 has been 'known' since the writing. It's us, the Israel of God, comprised of Jew and Gentile where neither circumcision nor uncircumsion means anything.

'The Woman' of Revelation 12 is the heavenly Jerusalem, the same woman of Genesis 3:15; Psalms 87; Isaiah 54; Galatians 4:26, represented by ALL her children in this temporal realm.

'The other woman' of Revelation, the earthly Jerusalem, is "the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also their Lord was crucified". "And in her was found the blood of prophets and of saints, and of all that have been slain upon the earth".

Certainly history runs in spirals, forever repeating itself:

9 That which hath been is that which shall be; and that which hath been done is that which shall be done: and there is no new thing under the sun. Ecc 1

...and names, faces, and places, change, BUT, there's been only one violent consummation of the Sinai covenant of condemnation and death.

Yea, it'd help if you gave the passage. 'Sea'' is often symbolic of 'the Nations' in the scriptures.

That's a matter of opinion, imo, Satan has been bound and loosed already and 'the camp of the Saints' is being surrounded by her enemies, now, today.

The seventh head was the 'Holy Roman Empire' comprised of the Germanic tribes. Rome was first ruled by the Caesars and then by the Germanic tribes. These are also the ten horns of the seventh head of Revelation and the ten horns of the fourth beast of Daniel.

These ten kings of the seventh head were to make war with the Lamb [the Church]. We, as Baptists, are acutely aware of the persecutions the Church suffered at the hands of the Holy Roman Empire (RCC). The ten kings of the seventh head were also to hate the Harlot [the dispersed Jews], eat her flesh, and burn her with fire. Herein lies the realization of the punishments and curses outlined in Lev 26 & Dt 28 (etc.) on the Jews for not hearkening unto the voice of Jehovah, i.e., the persecutions, pogroms, expulsions, etc, that the Jews have experienced down through the last two millennia.

The eighth, "the beast that was, and is not, is himself also an eighth, and is of the seven", the dragon, that old serpent, was the controlling force behind all the heads.

 

....Except you can't show any **PROOF** those events have already occurred.

And in each of those eras, God has dealt, or will deal differently with each one. That's why they're dispensations.

Well, actually, & with all due respect, you TRIED to answer. I absolutely reject reducing many Scriptures to "figurative/symbolic" status, which is the ONLY was preterists can try to make their myth fit Scripture.

Yes, y'all answered, but INCORRECTLY.

The literality is proven by one simple, unassailable fact: the earth is still going right on as it did in 65 AD, 70 AD, & 75 AD. Same ole planet, same ole surface.

Right now, Jesus is sitting at His Father's right hand.What all they're doing now is not known, except they're watching everything occurring on earth. And whenever/wherever two or more are gathered in Jesus' name, He is spiritually among them.

As prophecy is fulfilled in ouir time, it seems to be going slowly. For example, modern Israel was founded a month after I was born. Now, I'm age 73, with bad knees & lumbar spine, & a few other medicla probs. I don't look a day over 80! Meanwhile, Israel has very slowly become wealthy and has become the "pound-for-pound" military champ of all time.

One event that'll occur quickly will be the building of a new temple in Jerusalem. And I believe the beast will rise to power fairly quickly. I don't know which will come first, but when one or the other happens, "look up, for your redemption draws near."

 

I can appreciate the humor with being 73 and not looking a day over 80, and will borrow that at some point.

On to serious topics, though. Whether you think our answers are correct or not, you keep saying that we can't answer. The point is that we have answered. To interpret a symbolic passage as being literal is just as wrong as trying to interpret a literal passage as symbolic. This is not a matter of reducing any passage, but of "rightly dividing the word".

Yes, Jesus is spiritually present whenever two or more are gathered in His name. I think that even applies over a forum such as this one. That doesn't mean that He didn't "come" in judgment on Jerusalem in AD 70.

I don't believe a 3rd temple will ever be built in Jerusalem. Neither do I believe the Beast will rise to power, as that happened long ago. Having said that, I am watching for the return of the Lord, even as you are.

 

Amen! Still think full blown preterism is heresy though!

 

When Jesus has the actual Second Coming, history as we now know it ends, and that did not happen AD 70!

 

He simply wasn't then seen.

Then, how can the AOD occur?

The beast will be both a man & the empire he rules.
The only time a statue was set up in the old temple was when Antiochus set up one of Zeus, & nobody made it speak.

The marka the beast will likely be some sorta microchip. The tech already exists, including medical implant procedures. But before that happens, the chip will be improved so that only the person to whom it'll be assigned can use it, to prevent murders for the purpose of stealing the vic's chip. (Won't prevent kidnappings for such purposes.)

For these events to occur as prophesied, a new temple is required. There's not a quark of history proving these events have already happened.

Far as preterism is concerned:
IT'S ONLY MAKE-BELIEVE (1958)-Conway Twitty

 

While Jesus wasn't seen, His judgment was clearly seen in the destruction of Jerusalem and the Temple.

Without a future 3rd temple, the AOD happened when the Roman army desecrated the Herodian temple.

A new temple would be required for your version of prophecy to be fulfilled. History shows these events came to pass long ago. Regarding the microchip technology, I agree that this is a cause for concern because we can't trust the government. For that reason alone, my family would not agree to such implants. If they were implanted without our knowledge or consent, I don't see how anyone could be held accountable for something beyond our control. But I digress. Time will show which view of eschatology is truly Make Believe.

 

It was the culmination of the fulfilling of the 'days of vengeance'.

No, it didn't. There was no 'beast' yet, no miracle-working false prophet, no statue set up in that temple, which the FP supernaturally made speak, & no marka the beast.

No, they weren't. With all due respect, you can't show us any such history.

After the Christians are raptured, opposition to the mark will be nil. The beast will hawk it as being "theft-proof, & loss-proof".

Sorry, but you're just repeating the guesswork of Preston, Stevens, Noe, Bray, etc. who invented that trash & suckered you in. IMO, those gents are all quax.

 

Glad to hear the word rapture! In which the Lord Jesus invites us to...

Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come. - Matthew 24:42

 

Exactly! That is the same thing.

With all due respect, Josephus and others have provided the evidence.

There will not be a rapture. I have learned much from Gentry, DeMar, and other Preterists, but I've also followed the Bereans' example and studied whether those things that these men teach are so. Also following the Bereans' example in my studies, I've come to realize that the futurists interpretations of eschatology are seriously flawed.

 

Please, one reference.

 

Here is a link with his history of the first Jewish revolt against Rome - The Chronology of the First Jewish Revolt According to Josephus. Section 7 (at the bottom) is very specific about the siege and destruction of Jerusalem in AD 70.

 

No one is speaking about full preterism except Astericktom,but he speaks and answers on his own threads. Why did you bring that into this discussion?