I have already done some of that in my response to JonC, but I urge you to read the eloquent address of George W. Truett from the steps of the U.S. Capitol in 1920 - Baptists and Religious Liberty
Almost every Baptist confession of faith calls for separation of church and state, and if you look for Baptist writings that predate the Moral Majority's founding, you will find near uniformity on religious liberty. It is only when Baptists joined forces with evangelicals in groups such as the Moral Majority and the Christian Coalition that the influences of the mainline churches overwhelmed Baptist convictions.
Freedom of assembly, association, expression, etc.?
Discussion in 'Political Debate & Discussion' started by Wesley Briggman, Feb 4, 2018.
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Baptist Believer Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
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FollowTheWay Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
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FollowTheWay Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
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Wesley Briggman Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
Finally, the Baptist churches with which I identify adhere to no "confession".
While religious liberty/freedom is widely promoted and accepted by men, it is not a Biblical principle.
Jhn 14:6 KJV - Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
Sounds narrow-minded - no?
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Squire Robertsson AdministratorAdministrator
By religious liberty, if you asked my Baptist Polity professor the late Dr. Richard Weeks of MBBC (now MBU) he would say it means as Baptists we do not want nor seek the power of the State to enforce religious beliefs.
I believe Dr. Weeks would be against what Leonard Verduin described as Sacral:
"bound together by a common religious loyalty.” By sacral society, we mean society held together by a religion to which all the members of that society are committed."
Both men would agree that in Heaven there is no religious liberty. -
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Baptist Believer Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
If you are open to seeing religious liberty in the scripture, it leaps out at you. Would it be good news to you if it were true? If so, I will look for an online resource that can walk you through all of the most relevant scriptures.
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Baptist Believer Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
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Revmitchell Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
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Baptist Believer Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
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Baptist Believer Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
And "alt-right", at least to me, is not a slur or derogatory term. Just a loose category of people of widely varying perspectives that gravitate toward the Alex Jones and Breitbart conspiracy views. I usually strongly disagree with their conclusions, but I understand and empathize with many of their concerns. -
FollowTheWay Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
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Revmitchell Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
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Please return to the OP, please.
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Revmitchell Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
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Thomas Helwys, a General Baptist, espoused it at the very beginning of recorded English Baptist history.
"For we do freely profess that our lord the king has no more power over their consciences than over ours, and that is none at all. For our lord the king is but an earthly king, and he has no authority as a king but in earthly causes. And if the king’s people be obedient and true subjects, obeying all human laws made by the king, our lord the king can require no more. For men’s religion to God is between God and themselves. The king shall not answer for it. Neither may the king be judge between God and man. Let them be heretics, Turks, Jews, or whatsoever, it appertains not to the earthly power to punish them in the least measure. This is made evident to our lord the king by the scriptures."
— A Short Declaration of The Mystery of Iniquity, 1612
John Leland, a Calvinist, championed freedom of religion and had a hand in convincing Madison that the First Amendment was necessary to prevent establishment of state religion.
"Yes, from the beginning of Christianity, down to the close of the eighteenth century, A.D. it never prevailed among a people, of any considerable consequence, but they would either punish or pamper it almost to death: either to proscribe it, or make it a principle of state policy. To say that the government of the United States is perfect would be arrogant; but I have no hesitancy in saying, that the Constitution has left religion infallibly where it should be left in all government, viz: in the hands of its author, as a matter between God and individuals; leaving an open door for Pagans, Turks, Jews, or Christians, to fill any office in the government, without any religious test, to make them hypocrites: securing to every man his right of argument and free debate: not considering religious opinions objects of civil government, or any ways under its control: duly appreciating that Christianity is not a scheme of coercion; but only calls for a patient hearing, a dispassionate examination and a rational faith."
You want proof texts; Baptists have drawn the inference from their understanding of God and man and the witness of the New Testament. We will, one day, give account to God for ourselves. The state will not stand before judgment, but individuals, and the state has no right to interpose itself between God and man in such a serious matter.
I have to ask why someone who calls himself a Baptist would think that enforced religion is a virtue. The colonial American Baptists were exiled, whipped and thrown into prison because they ran afoul of the Congregationalist and Anglicans. -
Wesley Briggman Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
I regret that I lead you to understand that I condone enforced religion.
I obviously need to improve my communication skills. Thank you for sharing your view.
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