Thank you for trying so hard to not say anything.
God is Completely Sovereign or in Control of EVERYTHING that happens. PT 2
Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by percho, Jun 24, 2020.
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Alan Gross Well-Known Member
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1 Corinthians 2:8 CSB
None of the rulers of this age knew this wisdom, because if they had known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.
Paul does not attribute the crucifixion to God. One could say God tricked them, but that is not the same as God controlling every aspect of it like how far the nails when in.
Acts 2:23 CSB
Though he was delivered up according to God’s determined plan and foreknowledge, you used lawless people to nail him to a cross and kill him.
Jesus delivering himself to the powers was part of God's plan. At no point does the passage say that God controlled the lawless people who nailed Jesus to the cross.
Acts 4:27-28 ESV
for truly in this city there were gathered together against your holy servant Jesus, whom you anointed, both Herod and Pontius Pilate, along with the Gentiles and the peoples of Israel, [28] to do whatever your hand and your plan had predestined to take place.
It's a difficult passage in translation, but it was Jesus, whom God anointed to do whatever His hand and His plan had predestined to take place. This is clear when taken in context with the rest of the Bible. -
Martin Marprelate Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
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I still hate idioms like this because the meaning is so varied, I spend too much time trying to find out what the other person actually means. -
Martin Marprelate Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
'Jesus' is in the accusative (Gk. Iesoun). Herod and the others are in the Nominative. They are the subject both of the main sentence and the subordinate clause. They gathered against our Lord to do the very thing that God's wisdom and mercy had determined should take place.
That does not mean that Herod & Co were unwilling participants; they followed their own wicked impulses; but what they meant for evil, God overruled for good (cf. Genesis 50:20). -
not as Cain -- of the evil one he was, and he did slay his brother, and wherefore did he slay him? because his works were evil, and those of his brother righteous. 1 John 3:12
And Adam again knoweth his wife, and she beareth a son, and calleth his name Seth, 'for God hath appointed for me another seed instead of Abel:' for Cain had slain him. Gen 4:25
And the man knew Eve his wife, and she conceiveth and beareth Cain, and saith, 'I have gotten a man by Jehovah;' and she addeth to bear his brother, even Abel. And Abel is feeding a flock, and Cain hath been servant of the ground. Gen 4:1,2
And bow before it shall all who are dwelling upon the land, whose names have not been written in the scroll of the life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world; Rev 13:8
Slain; If Adam should sin and bring, the death, to man, to the Son of Man, Christ or because he was going to?
Is the purpose of Seth, instead of Abel, unto the sons of God ? Gal 4:4-7 and when the fulness of time did come, [the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world;] God sent forth His Son, come of a woman, come under law, that those under law he may redeem, that the adoption of sons we may receive; and because ye are sons, God did send forth the spirit of His Son into your hearts, crying, 'Abba, Father!' so that thou art no more a servant, but a son, and if a son, also an heir of God through Christ.
Through? Does death and life out of death have anything to do with, through? -
And we have known that to those loving God all things do work together for good, to those who are called according to purpose; because whom He did foreknow, He also did fore-appoint, conformed to the image of His Son, that he might be first-born among many brethren;
Does all the above apply to Job? for to vanity was the creation [including Job in the loins of Adam] made subject - In Hope? conformed to the image of His Son, that he might be first-born among many brethren;
Firstborn? And himself is the head of the body -- the assembly -- who is a beginning, first-born out of the dead, that he might become in all things -- himself -- first,
he who is doing the sin, of the devil he is, because from the beginning the devil doth sin; for this was the Son of God manifested, that he may break up the works of the devil; 1 John 3:8
I can not understand how no one can see and understand that when God said let there be light that death and resurrection, life, out of death, would be the means of destroying the devil and his works, bringing about the new heavens and new earth in which there would be no darkness.
In the beginning of God's preparing the heavens and the earth -- the earth hath existed waste and void, and darkness is on the face of the deep,
There already needs to be - new heavens and new earth
Yes or No -
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Martin Marprelate Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
Satan is a dog on a chain. He can go just so far and no further (Job 1:12; 2:6; James 4:7). -
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We have injustice, because that is the reward of our actions. Our best actions are filthy rags.
Worship is NOT what God commands or demands. That is a pagan religious notion. He does command not to place other gods before Him. Exodus 20:3-7
3 Thou shalt have no other gods before me.
4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth.
5 Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me;
6 And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.
7 Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain; for the Lord will not hold him guiltless that taketh his name in vain.
If worship comes out of us, it is because we were created to worship. For it is out of willingness. It even comes out of a soul in slave to sin.
Revelation 5:13
13 And every creature which is in heaven, and on the earth, and under the earth, and such as are in the sea, and all that are in them, heard I saying, Blessing, and honour, and glory, and power, be unto him that sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb for ever and ever.
God simply wants trust and obedience.
Hebrews 11:6
"And without trusting, it is impossible to be well pleasing to God, because whoever approaches him must trust that he does exist and that he becomes a Rewarder to those who seek him out." -
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Satan was like Cain listening to his own thoughts.
They were two of a kind, but not kinfolk. Cain was a son of God. Satan was an angel. They both were obsessive compulsive, and thought too much. It is not a bad thing, but they could not keep their thoughts under control and both let their thoughts control them, instead of them being in control of their thoughts. -
God is Completely Sovereign or in Control of EVERYTHING that happens
I am not trying to straw man you or anyone else. That is why I used the word "control".
But yes, I agree, even John Calvin didn't believe "God forces men to do what they don't want to do". However, John Calvin did believe that God not only caused men to do everything they did, God also caused them to want to do it. You can read about this in his pamphlet "No Mere Permission."
That is of course what "in control of everything that happens" means to me in American English when relating to this particular subject. If you don't agree with John Calvin, then I was discussing something with someone who turned out not to be there and I apologize for wasting your time. -
Perhaps God is Michael Jordan? -
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