hearers/doers

:applause: :thumbsup:

 

Granted. :saint::saint:

 

:applause::applause::applause:

 

But Amy, aren't women "to keep silent in the church"? :smilewinkgrin:

 

:laugh:

But DHK, (in my best southern drawl) we ain't in church! :tongue3:

 

oh, okay.
Permission to speak is granted.

 

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How convenient for you to change the path. The implication in Lukes post seemed to suggest that if you are not "a bible scholar" than you should keep silent and offer no input on theological or doctrinal discussion.

BTW, I am in agreement with you that we should press on and encourage others also, nothing in my comment suggested otherwise.

 

It is exactly this attitude that I am calling wickedness.

When you (by you I mean whoever) get on bb, for example, and [snip - Personal attacks are not permitted]

This is done on a large scale in this culture and is, imo, MOST responsible for the apostasy of this culture.

Once again you miss the whole thrust of the matter while making up straw men.

I never said one had to be scholarly to influence people for Christ.

If you would stay focused and respect the people you debate and their ACTUAL viewpoints you would not be the most controversial moderator on bb.

This whole paragraph is pointless because it has nothign to do with the matter in discussion.

Now if only you had a reliable mirror you could perhaps make some progress.

This is further evidence of your total inability to stay on topic.

Yes, this verse is a great one to bolster the very point I am making.

 

Yes, and I even said that one can be painstakingly self-educated and possibly be qualified to speak on weighty matters.

What I am outright condemning as utter wickedness is the haphazard handling of the most important matters in the universe by people who don't really know what they are talking about.

 

No one's claimed this. This is a straw man.

I am unapologetically claiming that one who does not have a powerful grasp on theology ought to keep silent on the matter. One who is so arrogant as to speak on such matters in a venue where weaker minds could be influenced by what this one says is a very evil man in my opinion.

All Christians ought to join with me in vehement condemnation of such a man. Jude, Peter and Paul certainly do.

Yes, his condemnation was because they spoke out and did not know what they were talking about. They were so arrogant that even though they did not have a real grasp on Scripture they still spewed out their opinions any way.

This is EXACTLY what I am condemning.

My point exactly.

A right heart before God will seek out God gifted teachers and a multitude of counselors and have a REAL theological education thereby before it allows one to speak on such grave matters.

A dark and wicked heart will think that God speaks to him and he does not need teachers or counselors to qualify him to speak authoritatively on matters of eternity.

 

You ought to be a bible scholar if at all possible and you ought to keep silent on matters on which you have no real understanding.

A Bible scholar is one who makes it his life's ambition to study the Word of God and to know what it is actually saying and thereby to come to know the Author of it as well as possible.

You, if you are a Christian, should be a Bible scholar- if you are not you need to repent.

I am not talking about the portion of the Gospel which all Christian understand. Yes you should be doing this.

I am talking about matters of the Gospel that you (not you in particular- ANYONE) do not understand because you have not had a real education in such matters.

By "education" I do not necessarily mean seminary. I mean the process by which the humble student has set himself under people who God has gifted to teach and that student has also sought the counsel of a multitude of such gifted men (or women for that matter) and that student is using that training in his rigorous personal pursuit of the knowledge of God from the Word of God.

If one does not have such an education then he ought to keep silent on those matters of eternity which he does not yet understand.
Those matters which he does understand he should be speaking out on- but even then what he thinks he understands should have come through the means that I am enunciating here.

The reason for this is clear: simple people are easily led into error.

People who do not have a real education as I am defining it speak with great authority in this culture and simple minded people flock to their churches by the thousands.

This is exactly how the Pentecostal movement was born, the Mormons, the JW's, most Charasmatics and even cultist churches in the ranks of Baptists.

 

It was not a strawman, that once again is your opinion. I ask you again, what standards or credentials must one posses in order to pass Your litmus test to qualify to comment/teach on matters of doctrine or theology? Please be clear so that I don't misunderstand you.

A right heart before God will indeed seek to learn, understand and know more of the great mysteries of God and His Word.

Is your "dark and wicked" heart a pointed and intentional comment?

 

Nice number of posts Luke, you called DHKs attitude wickedness, and implied I have a dark and evil heart. I must say, if this is what painstaking study does to a man, it should be avoided like the plague.

I really don't know what to say except that your extreme pride and arrogance is setting you up for a big fall. But... I realize that is falling on deaf ears, some folks have to learn the hard way, and I fear you are one of these.