Is Harry Potter and Narnia good for the church?

This is based on ignorance. From a person in the US who has no knowlege of what Turkish delight is, selling that notion may be possible. But the fact is that the Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe is an English novel, and in England, Turkish delight at Christmastime is as commonplace as hot dogs as a baseball game.

Only a selfrighteous America-centric attitude presumes that Turkish delight somehow qualifies as an appearance of evil. Not to mention, the claim is an appearance of ignorance and stupidity.

 

This is based on ignorance. From a person in the US who has no knowlege of what Turkish delight is, selling that notion may be possible. But the fact is that the Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe is an English novel, and in England, Turkish delight at Christmastime is as commonplace as hot dogs as a baseball game.

Only a selfrighteous America-centric attitude presumes that Turkish delight somehow qualifies as an appearance of evil. Not to mention, the claim is an appearance of ignorance and stupidity. </font>[/QUOTE]Name calling is not a sound basis for a debate strategy John. Facts are. :cool:


Denial is not a river in Egypt, but it is alive and well in the new age church of experiential faith. The dopers know what turkish delight is:

Rabelais tells us the hero of his tale, Pantagruel , a giant named after the said herb, loaded for a voyage and, “amongst other things, it was observed how he caused to be fraught and loaded with an herb of his called Pantagruel ion, not only of the green and raw sort of it, but of the confected also.” The confection Rabelais refers to is the edible Turkish delight — a hashish confection. http://www.alchemylab.com/cannabis_stone3.htm

Other writers seem to know:

The story began with a French doctor named J.J. Moro de Tur. In 1845 AD he used the hashish as part of his treatment for melancholy, manias and other psychotic diseases. Meanwhile in Paris there were some rumors that some author promised a reward for the person who presents a new type of amusement. Dr. Moro decided to face this challenge and offered the author the first dose of hashish saying that this was the author’s part of the Heavens. The writer was astounded by the experience and later became the first member of “The Club of Hashishers”. The members of the club gathered once per month and some of them were from the highest rank of the then artistic class. Another writers and composers also wrote about hashish. The Cambridge students valued very much the so-called Turkish delight – bonbons with hashish, covered with sugar and gelatin. All kinds of cakes were made from hashish, all with different exotic names.

http://library.thinkquest.org/C0115926/drugs/cannabis.htm

I know, you are still in denial. How about a paper published on a United Nations website?

The products known in various regions as Mosmok, Mosjuk, Teriaki, Banghia, Malak, Assyuni and Teridka belong to the same category.
1.Garawish type. This is a paste, which cracks between the teeth. Chira (hashish) powder is mixed with well-cooked syrup, opium and Datura Stramonium being sometimes added. It is scented with various essences and spices (vanilla, cloves, cardamoms cinnamon etc.). It is thickened over a gentle fire and then emptied onto an oiled marble slab. The mixture solidifies on cooling and is then cut up.
Formerly, kinds of barley sugar prepared in a similar way could be obtained in Tunis.
Other sweetmeats which are commonly sold in the Levant and North Africa serve on occasion as vehicles for the drug, e.g.:
1.Stuffed dates. The confectioner splits the date, takes out the stone, and replaces it by a paste which is coloured green and made of almonds, pistachios and sugar. In the illicit traffic, dates have been found in which the paste used for filling contained chira powder.
2.Rahat Lokum (Turkish Delight): a very common sweetmeat made of starch, sugar and water and flavoured with essences (orange, lemon, rose, banana etc.). Pistachios and almonds are added. The product is semi-soft, and is sold in the form of parallelepipedal pieces rolled in a mixture of sugar and starch.
J. Bouquet has had the opportunity of analysing three samples of Turkish Delight, one of which contained chira powder, and the other two very finely-powdered Cannabis tops.
1.Kiste Kibarfi, Misari, Kulfi (India and occasionally Egypt), Briji, Capsh, Ikinji and Zahra (Syria, Palestine) are forms of sweets containing Cannabis.
The above are the best known preparations. They are however, only typical recipes. No short list would be comprehensive. The makers and sellers of the drugs spend their time in thinking out recipes that will attract and keep their customers.
A. CHARNOT[29] ( La Toxicologie au Maroc, 1945) gives the formula of a Majoun-Dawamesk type electuary well known in morocco:

http://www.unodc.org/unodc/en/bulletin/bulletin_1950-01-01_4_page003.html


Hey...go see the movie. It is between you and God. Might want to review how He feels about homosexuals and drugs, and those who revel in it though.Also review His opinion on magic, false worship, etc.


Be careful not to compromise too much, because it becomes easier as you go:

Luke 13
24 Strive to enter in at the strait gate: for many, I say unto you, will seek to enter in, and shall not be able.

 

Boanerges,
You are entitled to your opinion. But I have never connected the Turkish Delight that is sold in English candy stores with evil.
I have eaten a lot of it and given a lot of it. Didn't get addicted like Edmund, though. LOL

The website you quote is really stretching. The witch is portrayed as evil, Edmund is portrayed as falling prey to weakness and sin. But the Turkish Delight in that book is simply candy. And Edmund's greed for candy helps lead him astray.

Karen

 

gd, you know that your argument is hollow at best. I am citing specifics, while you are generalizing.The United Nations, an INTERNATIONAL organization (for John's accusation of me being a myopic American) says that Turkish delight is a hashish candy. Researchers have shown that it was popular in England at the time of CS Lewis.Let's review some of its properties:

It is an "enchanted" candy

It is addictive, and once he eats a piece of it he will want more and more

Did Edmund actually swap siblings for a fix? (can't remember)

[ December 08, 2005, 04:16 PM: Message edited by: Boanerges ]

 

have mercy Bo - all this time I thought you were just trying to agitate John - CS Lewis wrote a great set of Childrens books that can help lead a person to Christ - more so that any hellfire and damnation tract that I have ever seen. Type Turkish Delight into google and see what you come up with - all I come up with was candy recipes - without any drugs.

I hope the movie is great - I and most of our church will be there to watch it and have a discussion of the movie afterwords - Want to come - I have an extra ticket!

 

Rom 10
17 So then faith [cometh] by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

No matter how much version fishing I did, I could not come up with a translation that said anything different.

 

Does it matter if it's candy or drugs? Either way, it's someone falling prey to sin.

Also, I haven't read the books, so I don't know if they are good for a Christian to read, but: They may be good quality entertainment for a Christian, but do we need to use fables to lead someone to a saving knowledge? Isn't the truth better for that?

 

Bo,

You are right faith does come by hearing the Word of God, but how many times have pastors used examples or stories to apply the Word of God to our lives. I have not seen anyone who is in favor of teaching TLTWATW in church, instead of the Word of God. It, however, can be used as an introduction, of sorts, to the Word of God. The allegory invokes thought, and can naturally lead to a discussion of the Christian themes, which can then lead to a discussion of the Bible. Is it that hard to understand?

If you don't want to see it, don't, but stop the self righteous condemning of those that are going to see it.

 

Are people not lead to Christ because other folks were charitable to them. Do people find God in nature and come to Christ? Are we only limited to Scripture in our witnessing? Have you ever lead someone to Christ based solely on your testimony - I have.

The Chronicles of Narnia are a story of redemption, we can use that story to tell the story of Christ. The apostle Paul complemented the greeks on their Gods - said they were a religious people - then found the unknown God and led many of them to Christ - Was he wrong in doing this, could religious leaders of the day comdemned him? bo might have.

 

Actually, I believe that God can use anything, but should we? Paul addressed Greeks about Greek gods that they were already worshipping. Narnia, on the other hand, is a fable created to try and teach Christian values to Christians, and moral values to all others, while raking in the $$$.Disney, the films distributor has a cloud hanging over their reputation due to the homosexual influence that is in the organization, and has been written about on many websites. Do you want to use your stewardship to fund a company that makes worldly movies and smiles at homosexual behavior in their theme parks. Go ahead. I think I will pass. I have eaten enough "stale" bread for one lifetime. Bread of Life is all that will do for me.

 

That's exactly what's happenning. The bad guy in the book is doing something bad (which the person pays for by the end). How on earth does this make the book inappropriate for Christians? Should we then remove Herod from the story of Luke because he was a bad guy doing a bad thing? Ridiculous.

 

Bo I actually love that I can take something put out by Disney, or any secular company for that matter and use it for the casue of Christ! Your argument can be used for just about any national company these days

 

Aside from the fact that the "homosexual influence" claims on crackpot sites are typically overbloan, misrepresented, or often false, you have do date on this thread failed to support your claims with anything reasonable. The best you can do is conjur up some misleading tripe about Turkish delight.

I've been to Disneyland three times in the past 30 days, and can find nothing that "smiles" at homosexual behavior. And as far as "worldly" movies, what other kind of movies are there? Just more pharisaical nonsense.

Feel free to do as you please. But kindly refrain from forcing your own guidelines on others as a matter of Christian doctrine. What youv'e done here is in complete violation of scripture.

 

That's exactly what's happenning. The bad guy in the book is doing something bad (which the person pays for by the end). How on earth does this make the book inappropriate for Christians? Should we then remove Herod from the story of Luke because he was a bad guy doing a bad thing? Ridiculous. </font>[/QUOTE]Back to reality John. Herod is chronicled in INSPIRED scripture, written by INSPIRED and chosen writers of the Bible.

Narnia, on the other hand, is a fable that was written by a man who chose to write it. You've got to start looking closer at the details, because they are important. There will be a test John.

 

reaaally?...let me check that in my Message bible. :confused:

 

You're not answering the question. Should we refrain from reading any story that contains a bad guy doing bad stuff? That's an integral plot of most stories.

Do you realize how moronic your posts sound every time you say that?

 

You're not answering the question. Should we refrain from reading any story that contains a bad guy doing bad stuff? That's an integral plot of most stories.

Do you realize how moronic your posts sound every time you say that? </font>[/QUOTE]Do you realize how silly your defenses were for it on the Message thread? Kind of like this thread. You refuse to review the evidence, because it troubles your experiential touchy feely faith. Gay days at Disney is a documented event. If you search out some gay websites, I am sure you can read all about it there as well. My friend and his wife had the unfortunate experience of wandering into there on gay day, and the stories that he recounted as a FIRST PERSON WITNESS (him and his wife) are not even repeatable on this forum. Why dont you review the evidence for yourself John:

http://www.stopgaydays.com/beware!.htm

http://www.stopgaydays.com/news_article.htm

http://www.stopgaydays.com/Photo_And_Video.htm

 

Feel free to limit that discussion to a thread on the Message. Not only is it way off-topic, the association is weak and quite petty.

Clearly, you do not know me. My 15K plus posts lend support to the fact that my faith is quite firm and well-founded, and that I discuss evidences all the time.

You are omitting the fact that this is not a Disney sponsired event. It's an outside organization that plans this, and they have absolutely nothing to do with the company. In fact, this organisation (as well as several other outside organizations) have been admonished by the Disney company to refrain from using the Disney name, logo, and similar material to advertize their events.

Websites who "claim" that it's a Disney sponsored event are either mistaken, or outright lying.

I myself abhor the organization that puts this on, but I do not hold the Disney Company responsible for the actions of outsiders.

 

They're not permitted to. But unless they're misrepresenting themselves in advertizing, it's a bit difficult to prevent this legally.

You should do the same. The same site you linked to says on it "None of the "gay days" are official park events" and that they are "not affiliated" with Disney. Feel free to call 1-407-WDISNEY for yourself and ask the opeartor for Gay Days information, and the operator will tell you that it's not sponsored or endorces by them. Feel free to call the Disneyland Resort guest relations office at 1-714-781-7290, and they will tell you the same thing.

Oh, btw, my wife was a Disneyland Resort employee for three years, and she also confirms it. A coworker of mine was a Disney employee for 10 years, and confirms the same thing.

Actually, that very thing happenned about 3 years ago. Aside from several guys wearing "Gay Days" shirts, not once all day did I see any displays of "affection" among them. Actually, the only inappropriate public displays of affection I recall that day was among some heterosexual college-aged couples.