It's that time of year again . . .

[Robert Snow]

I hear avids are hard to kill.

WHen does avid season start, anyway?

Not only are avids hard to kill, they are almost impossible to cook properly. :laugh:

 

[Gina B]

Living in southern california, that would be difficult, unless I want to live off a diet of rattlesnake, opposum, and coyote.

Perhaps the reason I feel differently is because one if my kids did 4H and FFA for 6 years. The only thing I've learned about livestock is they simply don't care about the things we care about. I'm all for humane treatment of animals, but much of what we think of humane is subjective, not objective.

That's a very good point...being able to do your own thing is very difficult. I currently live in Oklahoma City, and am starting to believe that the only thing I can do is catch cockroaches. YUCK! LOL However, I do plan on getting the community gardening thing going here.

As far as meat, I'm trying to get more settled and look into reliable places to buy and farmers who sell, which are more widely available than my first impression gave me. I seem to have found a decent meat market. Now to be able to afford it...it will mean switching our diets around and working with what we can, but especially having children, should be worth the health benefits along with making me more at peace with being in line with how I believe we should try to live as Christians. I definitely recognize the difficulties we are faced with in our modern world when it comes to this issue! It's hard to reconcile our lifestyles with Christianity in almost EVERY area, let alone this one! So for now, it's what CAN be done and what takes precedence. For example, while this is very much a concern for me personally, if I can help with stopping the slaughter of humans through needless abortions, that takes precedence.
On the other hand, we all have our own talents and areas of expertise. Some have more of an ability to work on certain issues than others have. We can't all focus on one thing...and shouldn't condemn people who choose to spend more time and effort on one issue over another when they're trying to accomplish good.

Still, we ALL have the ability to know right from wrong and to as least express it and recognize it. When I saw this thread, that was and still is my thought...that even if some people are not able to go out of their way on this issue, they at least recognize what the obligation is and have respect for that. It's a step towards the right and towards having the right mindset, and no matter what, the right mindset puts us on the road to a closer relationship and understanding of our Creator.

 

[Johnv]

What I was getting at, Gina, is that the meat industry frequently gets an undeserved bad rap. They're accused of "abuses" which are most often contrived.

 

[Aaron]

Not only are avids hard to kill, they are almost impossible to cook properly. :laugh:

And the meat is too gamey.

 

[TC]

I can't believe what I'm reading on this thread.

Neither can I. Nevertheless, I will continue to hunt and fish and thank God for what I get to eat. In another month and a half or so, if the Lord wills, I will walk on water. Ice fishing is really cool.

 

[Spinach]

The control of pests is a necessity. I use copious amounts of poison around the home for the control creeping things. I own two quasi-ferrel cats for the control of rodents.

I shot a squirrel that was nesting in my attic with a .177 cal. precision pellet rifle and a laser scope. Right through the abdomen. It jumped from my roof and ran along the top of the fence, but by the time it got to the tree, it didn't have the strength to climb. I finished it off with a short length of two-by-four, and the trash service hauled it off the next day.

It's a necessity, and it was only natural that my girls felt sorry for the infernal thing.

But to take glee in killing is sick.

Meh, I'm not too worried about it. It's kill or be killed sometimes. In the case of the mosquitos, when I am bit I swell. One time at camp meeting, one got me right on the eyelid. I wore sunglasses to church because I looked like an ogre.

Once one bit me on the pinky tip and swelled up my whole hand.

If I could get an electrical zapper, I would. And then with each zap sound, I'd chuckle. I'd be happy that there was one less mosquito to cause me grief.

FTR, I'm not as heartless as all that. As a matter of fact, I cried when I sold my goat and they ate her.

 

[webdog]

I'm seeing two things on this thread.

Those who were born and raised hunting on this thread who look at it un-objectively.

Those who haven't who can look at it objectively.

Clearly for the hunters and anglers there seems to be no concern that killing anything should be anything but fun. Same is true for poking a hold in a fish for recreation. Killing and hurting for recreation cannot be defended, particularly with the argument from silence that "Scripture doesn't forbid it". Taking delight in pain, suffering and killing (all byproducts of sin) is very unbecoming of a christian attitude. I know if I had to kill an animal for food to feed my family, I would, but I would also feel sorrow for having to take a life in the process...I wouldn't be "thrilled" to grab the "trophy".

 

[JohnDeereFan]

I'm seeing two things on this thread.

Those who were born and raised hunting on this thread who look at it un-objectively.

Those who haven't who can look at it objectively.

Clearly for the hunters and anglers there seems to be no concern that killing anything should be anything but fun.

Obviously, you've ignored my posts. I very clearly said "there is a sense of sadness in having to kill a living thing", but that's OK. Why let the facts stand in the way?

I know if I had to kill an animal for food to feed my family, I would, but I would also feel sorrow for having to take a life in the process...I wouldn't be "thrilled" to grab the "trophy".

And then another hypocrite would come along and make the same sort of claims about you, how you love to kill things and all about your uncontrolled bloodlust, that you've made about me. I can't say "about us" because I don't know everybody here, but I haven't see anyone here say that they take pleasure in killing.

This is precisely why liberals are so annoying.

But at least I'm not a hypocrite who condemns others for hunting, but gladly pays someone else to kill an animal to eat for pleasure.

 

[Johnv]

I understand where your'e coming from, webdog, but I wouldn't say that doing something for fun isn't in and of itself a disqualifyer. I've taken my son fishing at a local stocked river lakea few times. There's I think a greater a sense of accountability and appreciation for nature when you catch your own dinner, or hunt your own meal. No doubt, there are people who hunt/fish for a twisted satisfaction gleaned by killing something, which is absolutely inappropriate. But the majority of people who hunt/fish would not, imo, fall into this category.

I mentioned earlier about one of my kids being in 4H and FFA for years. She's raised several steer and swine, knowing that it will be slaughtered for food. She's even witnessed the slaughter of her own animals, and on more than one occaision had her animal be our Christmas ham or roast. I can definitely attest to her having a greater appreciation for the food that ends up on our plate than those who buy something packaged meat in the grocery aisle that doesn't remotely resemble the animal it came from.

 

[webdog]

I understand where your'e coming from, webdog, but I wouldn't say that doing something for fun isn't in and of itself a disqualifyer. I've taken my son fishing at a local stocked river lakea few times. There's I think a greater a sense of accountability and appreciation for nature when you catch your own dinner, or hunt your own meal. No doubt, there are people who hunt/fish for a twisted satisfaction gleaned by killing something, which is absolutely inappropriate. But the majority of people who hunt/fish would not, imo, fall into this category.

I mentioned earlier about one of my kids being in 4H and FFA for years. She's raised several steer and swine, knowing that it will be slaughtered for food. She's even witnessed the slaughter of her own animals, and on more than one occaision had her animal be our Christmas ham or roast. I can definitely attest to her having a greater appreciation for the food that ends up on our plate than those who buy something packaged meat in the grocery aisle that doesn't remotely resemble the animal it came from.

Oh I agree that something fun in and of itself is not wrong, I just believe fun in something created by sin (pain and death) is.

 

[webdog]

Obviously, you've ignored my posts. I very clearly said "there is a sense of sadness in having to kill a living thing", but that's OK. Why let the facts stand in the way?

I don't recall where my comment was only to you, can you show me where I said that? If you have followed this thread, there are some who have claimed the "thrill of the hunt".

And then another hypocrite would come along and make the same sort of claims about you, how you love to kill things and all about your uncontrolled bloodlust, that you've made about me.

Do you know what a red herring is? If not, go look it up.

I can't say "about us" because I don't know everybody here, but I haven't see anyone here say that they take pleasure in killing.

Then go back through and read it.

This is precisely why liberals are so annoying.

I'm conservative. I can counter the liberals are the ones who take pleasure in killing an animal for recreation and then defend it by saying "but we don't waste the meat...we donate the meat...etc."

But at least I'm not a hypocrite who condemns others for hunting, but gladly pays someone else to kill an animal to eat for pleasure.

I'm not one either, as I have never stated hunting for food is wrong. Please follow along...I know it's been tough up until this point.

 

[Johnv]

I would agree that fun in something created by sin is inappropriate.

 

[Revmitchell]

I don't recall where my comment was only to you, can you show me where I said that? If you have followed this thread, there are some who have claimed the "thrill of the hunt".
Do you know what a red herring is? If not, go look it up.
Then go back through and read it.
I'm conservative. I can counter the liberals are the ones who take pleasure in killing an animal for recreation and then defend it by saying "but we don't waste the meat...we donate the meat...etc."
I'm not one either, as I have never stated hunting for food is wrong. Please follow along...I know it's been tough up until this point.

Then don't go hunting and your self imposed conscience will be more comfortable.

 

[webdog]

Then don't go hunting and your self imposed conscience will be more comfortable.

I don't, and I pray those would pull the veil off their "self imposed conscience" that taking thrill in something created by sin with no other purpose is glorifying to God and His creation.

 

[Mexdeaf]

I'm loving the 'holier-than-thou' attitude here. Some folks might not get their kicks from shooting animals but they get it from shooting their brethren.:tear:

 

[webdog]

I'm loving the 'holier-than-thou' attitude here. Some folks might not get their kicks from shooting animals but they get it from shooting their brethren.:tear:

If you are referring to me, I have done no such thing. I'm quite shocked there are so many beleivers that think it is premissible and God honoring to kill for the sheer enjoyment and excitement of doing so. If you fall into that camp, then so be it. I have yet to tell anyone they shouldn't do it, I just cannot understand after knowing what sin brought (death) there are those here who defend killing for recreation.

 

[Mexdeaf]

If you are referring to me, I have done no such thing. I'm quite shocked there are so many beleivers that think it is premissible and God honoring to kill for the sheer enjoyment and excitement of doing so. If you fall into that camp, then so be it. I have yet to tell anyone they shouldn't do it, I just cannot understand after knowing what sin brought (death) there are those here who defend killing for recreation.

SIGH... I have not seen ONE post that advocated killing for recreation. But I have seen a lot of hyperbole, scripture-twisting, and false accusations.

 

[Johnv]

SIGH... I have not seen ONE post that advocated killing for recreation. But I have seen a lot of hyperbole, scripture-twisting, and false accusations.

A sidebar question, just for clarification. You agree, then, that killing when done primarily for the purpose of recreation is morally inappropriate? I believe it is wrong to do so, and I myself am not opposed to sport hunting or angling. Been sport fishing several times.

 

[JohnDeereFan]

If you are referring to me, I have done no such thing. I'm quite shocked there are so many beleivers that think it is premissible and God honoring to kill for the sheer enjoyment and excitement of doing so.

And I am quite shocked that somebody who calls himself a Christian would continue to lie and bear false witness the way you insist on doing.

But then, we've already established that you're a hypocrite, so what else is new?

 

[JohnDeereFan]

SIGH... I have not seen ONE post that advocated killing for recreation. But I have seen a lot of hyperbole, scripture-twisting, and false accusations.

Nor have I. But that won't stop him.

I honestly don't know how he could read the post where I said "THERE IS A SADNESS ABOUT KILLING A LIVING THING" and still believe that I kill for pleasure.

I wonder if it's that he understands that we're providing food for our families and is insecure because he can't provide for his. I wonder how his wife feels about that.