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Featured Justification by Faith

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Van, Mar 16, 2023.

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  1. Alan Gross

    Alan Gross Well-Known Member

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    Justification is obtained after the sinner is Pardoned from their sins.

    When a sinner is told to "believe" without the Conviction of their sins through the word they can only believe in what their belief is", without God or Regeneration.

    For a lost sinner to "believe" is not the Regeneration of the soul.

    It leaves them in their sin, without God or Repentance and Faith, which are both gifts of God in the New Birth.

    When a sinner is told to "have faith" without the Conviction of their sins through the word they can only believe in what they think their "faith is", without God or Regeneration.

    No Jesus. No Pardon from sin. No Justification.

    Same thing when a sinner is told to "sign a decision card" or pray the sinner's prayer with or without a mourner's bench, or to "open a door" without the Conviction of their sins through the word they can only sign or pray or open what their belief is in their "decision", without God or Regeneration.

    No Jesus. No Pardon from sin. No Justification.

    They have peradventure been Granted REPENTANCE and Faith, yet, which comes by the New Birth, in the Holy Ghost's use of Jesus' blood and Gospel to save them.

    To assume faith Justifies, or belief or chosing or praying or opening a door they can't open is to propose a religion exists besides Christianity, on which these various other gospels are held to with wasted determination.

    Jesus is included in the salvation of sinner's in Christianity.

    Does not the poster this and I boast of that and never said Jesus is the Savior?

    It's be nice if you actually did include Jesus as the Savior, instead of your faith and your faithful faith that is very faithful, etc., etc., but I don't see it happening.
     
    #41 Alan Gross, Mar 21, 2023
    Last edited: Mar 21, 2023
  2. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Yet another off topic attack on me personally. This is all they have!

    The ploy is simply an effort to nullify God's word as clearly stated. Crowds seeking God gathered to hear Jesus and obtain blessings such as healing.

    Luke 9:43 (NASB)
    And they were all amazed at the greatness of God.
    But while everyone was astonished at all that He was doing, He said to His disciples,

    To claim they all came seeking an earthly king is an outrageous falsehood of the highest order. When big crowds came to hear Jesus, they were seeking God. When deniers of God's word say scripture says no one ever seeks God, they may actually be so blinded by their bias they think the crowds came seeking to hear falsehoods.

    Did God choose individuals for salvation through faith in the truth, a conditional election? Yes, 2 Thessalonians 2:13.

    If our placing our faith in Christ does not automatically save us, then God must credit our faith as righteousness and spiritually place us “into Christ” which saves us, because in Christ we receive the justification to life provided by Christ. Wow now that is a systematic theology that fits with all scripture.

    Having an unregenerate trust is Christ is not the cause of Regeneration! No one said it did. Having God credit the faith of an unregenerate as Righteous Faith results in regeneration. See Romans 4:23-25!!!!
     
  3. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Once again we have no defintion of "justification" as if it we some obscure, hard to understanding theoology doctrine. Utter nonsense. Justification is when God reconciles a sinner's debt of stored up wrath, removing it, forgiving it, and remembering it no more forever.

    Every born anew believer undergoes the washing of regeneration, also called the circumcision of Christ, and arises in Christ a new creation, forgiven, perfected, blameless and holy. Voila Justified.
     
  4. AustinC

    AustinC Well-Known Member

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    Your faith does not save you, Van.
    God's grace saves you.
    We receive faith as a precious gift so that we will believe. This gift of faith justifies us before God. It is the mark that we are indeed God's child.
     
    • Winner Winner x 1
  5. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Yet another falsehood, a deliberate act of Satanic fabraction. I just posted and I quote:
    Justification is when God reconciles a sinner's debt of stored up wrath, removing it, forgiving it, and remembering it no more forever.
     
  6. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Folks, see if you can find "through faith" anywhere in your bibles, such as Galatians 3:26. Ask yourselves how we become children of God through faith unless God utilizes our faith in choosing to make us children of God.

    Ask yourselves the same question for Ephesians 2:8.or for the other places, at least 5, where God saves us and bestows the blessings of salvation upon us THROUGH FAITH.
     
  7. AustinC

    AustinC Well-Known Member

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    Folks ask yourself this question: How do humans, bent on being their own gods and desiring to rule over others, then exercise a faith in God, whom they despise because that means they aren't rulers?
    You who refuse to give God the glory and refuse to declare that it was God who changed your rebellious heart and gave you a living heart, made you a new creation, so you could believe, tell us how you willed yourself to have faith in God so that you caused God to save you and declare your own glorious faith to be righteous.
    We await your bragging.
     
  8. Alan Gross

    Alan Gross Well-Known Member

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    Good question.

    They don't/ won't/ don't want to.

    God Himself working in His people
    that faith and obedience IS THE ACTIVITY of GOD.



    from: Chapter V
    The Doctrine of Divine Decrees

    By James P. Boyce

    "(8) God Himself works in His people
    that faith and obedience which are called the conditions of salvation:

    Ephesians 2:8; "For it is by grace
    you have been saved through faith
    ,
    and this not from yourselves; it is the gift of God"
    ;

    Philippians 2:13; "For it is God which worketh in you
    both to will and to do of his good pleasure
    ."


    2 Timothy 2:25; "In meekness
    instructing those that oppose themselves;
    if God peradventure will give them repentance
    to the acknowledging of the truth.
    "

    REPENTANCE and FAITH are Twin Doctrines,
    both Given by God at the same time,

    as He says, "if God peradventure will give them repentance",
    (to show this, then, by saying; "God, at the same time,
    Gives Faith to the acknowledging of the truth.")

    Faith in this verse is, then, of course, implied,
    just not spelled out each time.


    It is still;
    Philippians 2:13b; "...God which worketh in you
    both to will and to do of His good pleasure
    ."

    and;
    Ephesians 2:8; "For it is by grace
    you have been saved through faith
    ,
    and this not from yourselves; it is the gift of God"
    ;

     
    #48 Alan Gross, Mar 22, 2023
    Last edited: Mar 22, 2023
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  9. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Yet another in the long line of denials of God's word. Jesus said "Your faith has saved you!" Do the false teachers deny this truth? Yes.
    Putting our trust in God is giving glory to God.
    Does our putting our trust in God deny He alone saves, and gives us a new heart, and an indwelt Holy Spirit? Nope
    Does believing "cause" God to save them? Nope, see the second and third soils of Matthew 13.
    So yet another non-stop stream of falsehoods.
     
  10. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Folks, see if you can find "through faith" anywhere in your bibles, such as Galatians 3:26. Ask yourselves how we become children of God through faith unless God utilizes our faith in choosing to make us children of God.

    Ask yourselves the same question for Ephesians 2:8.or for the other places, at least 5, where God saves us and bestows the blessings of salvation upon us THROUGH FAITH.
     
  11. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Justification is when God reconciles a sinner's debt of stored up wrath, removing it, forgiving it, and remembering it no more forever.
     
  12. AustinC

    AustinC Well-Known Member

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    Not quite.

    Justification is when God saves a sinner by grace, gives the sinner faith to believe, and reveals to them that the faith which God gave them, means that Jesus substitutionary sacrifice justifies them before a Holy God.
     
  13. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Note the complete absence or any scripture to support these non-stop falsehoods.
    Justification is when God reconciles a sinner's debt of stored up wrath, removing it, forgiving it, and remembering it no more forever.

    See Romans 4:23-25.

    We are saved by grace THROUGH FAITH, not saved then given faith. As I said, non-stop falsehoods is all they have.
     
  14. AustinC

    AustinC Well-Known Member

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    Wait, so you can provide a definition with no Bible reference, but I can't? LOL.
    Ephesians 2:1-10
     
  15. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    How many verses have I posted that say "through faith?" Ephesians 2:8 ring a bell?

    Ephesians 2:8
    For by grace you have been saved through faith; and this is not of yourselves, it is the gift of God;

    Romans 3:25
    God publicly displayed him at his death as the means of reconciliation accessible through faith. This was to demonstrate his righteousness, because God in his forbearance had passed over the sins previously committed.

    Galatians 3:26
    For in Christ Jesus you are all sons of God through faith.

    2 Timothy 3:15
    and how from infancy you have known the holy writings, which are able to give you wisdom for salvation
    through faith in Christ Jesus.

    The question we should ask is does God utilize faith which He does not credit as righteousness or faith that He did credit as righteousness? See Romans 4:23-25

    Romans 4:23-25 teaches God will credit the faith of those who believe - God raised Jesus from the dead - for the believer's benefit. Some deny that benefit is salvation, but it would be absurd to say God saves those whose faith He does not credit as righteousness.
     
  16. AustinC

    AustinC Well-Known Member

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    How many times have we gone over the fact that until "God...even while we were dead...made us alive...", we cannot exercise any faith. Therefore the faith you point to in verse 8 must be there precisely because God gives it as a gift, at the moment of His gracious salvation, so that through faith...you can actually believe what God has graciously done.

    Van, we have gone over this, ad nauseam, and the thing that causes you to stumble is that you utterly refuse to accept that God gave you faith as a gift, after He saved you.
     
  17. Silverhair

    Silverhair Well-Known Member

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    Austin once again you prove that it is not the bible you trust but rather your Calvinism and your errant understanding of scripture. You really like to make wild off topic comments in a vain attempt to distract from the real issue. Austin you seem to think you know more about the means of salvation than God does. You do seem to be a wee bit arrogant there young man. Talk about someone bragging, Austin you need to humble yourself before God and confess your sin.

    Rom_3:22 even the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all those who believe; for there is no distinction;

    Rom_3:30 since indeed God who will justify the circumcised by faith and the uncircumcised through faith is one.

    Gal_2:16 nevertheless knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the Law but through faith in Christ Jesus, even we have believed in Christ Jesus, so that we may be justified by faith in Christ and not by the works of the Law; since by the works of the Law no flesh will be justified.

    Gal_3:14 in order that in Christ Jesus the blessing of Abraham might come to the Gentiles, so that we would receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.

    Gal_3:26 For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus.

    Eph_2:8 For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God;

    Eph_3:12 in whom we have boldness and confident access through faith in Him.

    Eph_3:17 so that Christ may dwell in your hearts through faith; and that you, being rooted and grounded in love,

    Php_3:9 and may be found in Him, not having a righteousness of my own derived from the Law, but that which is through faith in Christ, the righteousness which comes from God on the basis of faith,

    Col_2:12 having been buried with Him in baptism, in which you were also raised up with Him through faith in the working of God, who raised Him from the dead.

    2Ti_3:15 and that from childhood you have known the sacred writings which are able to give you the wisdom that leads to salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.

    Heb_6:12 so that you will not be sluggish, but imitators of those who through faith and patience inherit the promises.

    Heb_11:4 By faith Abel offered to God a better sacrifice than Cain, through which he obtained the testimony that he was righteous, God testifying about his gifts, and through faith, though he is dead, he still speaks.

    1Pe_1:5 who are protected by the power of God through faith for a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.

    Just in case you missed it the common factor in these verse is that whatever is accomplished it is THROUGH FAITH. If you doubt this I am sure you can look at the context of these verses.
     
  18. AustinC

    AustinC Well-Known Member

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    Tell me, Sliverhair, what other documents do I read, other than scripture? You bring up a straw man everytime I show you in the Bible that God gives the gift of faith to all those He saves so that through faith they will believe and be justified. I show you this over and over again, and you reject it. You openly hate the fact that God caused you to be saved by His grace alone and gave you faith to believe. To you, that makes God a "puppet master" when he chose to redeem you.
    I honestly cannot imagine spending my life, looking for a loophole in the Bible, where I could praise myself for my great choices. But, here you are, doing just that very thing. You keep attempting to find something where you can deny God His authority over your life and you can claim to be your own ruler and savior. I kid you not when I say your theology is just dumbfounding in its humanism.
     
  19. Silverhair

    Silverhair Well-Known Member

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    Austin how can you say you trust the bible an at the same time deny what it says. I posted 14 verses and you do not respond to one of them but instead try to make it about me. Why is that Austin?

    Try dealing with these verses without the hyperbole and misdirection of your usual comments. If you are so inclined you can read them in context but that will not change what these verses show. Remember Austin it is about the bible not me, try to stay on topic.

    Gal_3:26 For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus.

    Eph_2:8 For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God;

    Eph_3:12 in whom we have boldness and confident access through faith in Him.

    Eph_3:17 so that Christ may dwell in your hearts through faith; and that you, being rooted and grounded in love,
     
    #59 Silverhair, Mar 24, 2023
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2023
  20. Martin Marprelate

    Martin Marprelate Well-Known Member
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    1 Corinthians 12:3. 'No one can say that Jesus is Lord except by the Holy Spirit.'
    The Holy Spirit must first open a sinner's heart to perceive the truth, before the heart can believe and the tongue profess that Jesus Christ is Lord. Then one is justified by faith and sealed by the Spirit for the day of redemption. See Ephesians 1:13 and Acts of the Apostles 16:14.
     
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