I have shared several times in other threads the scipture in 1 Cor. 12:7 "But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal"
I have given the meaning as of the Greek word phanerosis, which means " a manifestation, a making visible or observable."
Also gave illustrations of manifestations...such as
Electric energy in a light bulb is manifested in the form of light and heat.
Chicken pox is manifested as a rash or small pimple-like sores.
Another example would be if I gave someone a swiss army knife (gift). It can be manifested in 9 different ways. Two blades/big and little, two screwdrivers/flat head and phillips, a can opener, an awl, scissors, a file and a pair of tweezers.
So we see one gift with many manifestations. With that in mind...the Holy Spirit is the gift...the manifestations are listed in vs. 8-10.
I believe in using the words that are in the Bible when talking about the things of God. Some people (myself included) will sometimes use "gifts" to desscribe wht the Bible calls "manifestations" of the Spirit. Words have definite meanings, and it is those meanings that clear communication is made possible. "Manifestation" does not mean "gift." The difference is that a gift is individually given, and no one has a gift unless it was given to them. A manifestation is an evidence, a showing forth, of something that a person already has.
There are spiritual gifts, which include the Holy Spirit, God given ministries such as that of an apostle, prophet, teacher, evangelist etc. and the gift of everlasting life (Rom. 6:23).
Also notice that every verse that they put "gift" in is not in the Greek text. (1 Cor. 12:1;13:2;14:1;12:12;12:37)
The Greek word translated "spiritual" in 1 Cor. 12:1 and 14:1 is pneumatikos, which is an adjective, and thus needs a noun to complete the sense of the sentence.
I think it is important to use the word "manifestation" rather than "gifts" when referring to the list in vs 8-10. God used that word, and we are always on solid ground when we use the language of the Bible. Plus it points to the fact that we are dealing with outward evidences of something, which in this case is the gift of Holy Spirit.
Just wanted to clear that up!!:thumbs:
manifestation vs gift
Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by awaken, Oct 3, 2012.
Page 1 of 9
-
John of Japan Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
-
In verse 4 is charismaton, a plural noun meaning "grace effects." This might refer to various manifestations of God's grace. Using this idea, grace is the gift, a bestowal of divine favor, but that might cover a range of things, from a nice day to placing a person spiritually in Christ.
Now in verse 9 we have a slightly different form of "grace effects" a plural noun.
Bottom line, correctly translating God's words is very important, but it seems a stretch to say the grace effects of the Spirit cannot be referred to as gifts of the Spirit. -
-
Hebrews 1:1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
--In the OT God the Holy Spirit manifested or revealed himself in different ways to the fathers by the prophets. What were those "different ways"?
They were: dreams, visions, audible voices, theophanies, angels, and other ways. God doesn't do that any more.
In the first century God manifested himself through the gifts of the Spirit. He did that primarily through the Apostles. There were some others that were given these gifts by they were temporary. The local church were told that they would pass away and they did. There are no more apostles, no more temporary revelation being given, for our revelation is complete, no more unbelieving Jews, etc. The sign for which its use was intended has passed. The sign has been removed.
Now the Holy Spirit manifests itself through the fruit of the Holy Spirit.
He also manifests himself through convicting individuals of sin, righteousness, and judgement. That is his roll today. -
-
You are speaking to a people that have never witnessed a working of the Holy Ghost, therefore it does not and cannot exist. If something does happen, they will immediately assign it to Satan instead of rejoicing at another miracle of Jesus. They have quenched the Spirit with their knowledge, and have become stiff necked like the children in the desert. Can't you see how little faith they have just to live? Watch the way they talk, it is always flesh and fear.
-
-
-
-
You, DHK, witness a person praying over someone that died 8 hrs ago ok? Go with me...
The person prays for whatever time in Jesus name.
The dead person comes to life, who did it? God or Satan? -
Second, if it were just 8 hours ago, I would consider other options, as if the person were truly dead, or did some of his bodily functions shut down temporarily so that he seemed to be dead.
Third, it still is not on par with the miracle of Jesus raising Lazarus who was four days dead, bound in grave clothes, and already buried.
With the raising of Lazarus there was no question that Lazarus was dead. -
-
-
-
Like you said..most will first try to reason it within their own mind, then try to explain it away if they do not see, hear, touch, smell or speak it themselves. Faith goes beyond the flesh....I am still learning this myself! But it is a wonderful journey! Glad another Baptist gets this! -
John of Japan Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
Then in the OP you said,
-
-
You have no evidence that He still manifests himself as fire by night and a cloud by day, as he die in the wilderness wandering, but you believed he did. You have no evidence that today he manifests himself through the operation of the gifts of the Spirit but at one time he did. They are not in operation, you would have evidence but there is none.
Hebrews 1:1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;
--The two verses contrast each other.
God in the OT spoke this way: visions, dreams, by His voice, etc.
God in the NT speaks through His Son, and his Son his revealed to us through His Word, Acts 2:17 notwithstanding.
-
Do you not believe in the Trinity? WHen He speaks throught the Holy Spirit today..is that not through Jesus?
It turns out that "uninterpreted tongues" have been used in Israel's history as a sign to the unbelieving Israelites that God's judgment had come upon them. Paul was quoting a prophecy from Isaiah 28:11-12:
"Very well then, with foreign lips and strange tongues God will speak to this people, to whom he said, "This is the resting place, let the weary rest"; and, "This is the place of repose"-- but they would not listen." (Isaiah 28:11-12)
This prophecy was fulfilled when the Assyrian army swooped down upon Israel speaking a foreign language (an uninterpreted tongue), carrying Israel off into captivity. Paul used an example from Israel's history to show that uninterpreted tongues are sometimes used as a "sign" for unbelievers that judgment has come upon them.
Then Paul pointed out that if an unbeliever enters a church where Christians seem to have lost their minds, the unbeliever wouldn't see this as a sign of impending judgment. This is why Paul said that prophecy is much more beneficial during a church service.
YOU TRY TO DISPROVE WHAT IS RIGHT BY SHOWING THE FALSE... THere are false Christ too...are you going to tell me Chirst is not real too???
Page 1 of 9