Nascar is back

I agree with everything you just said.

On the Earnhardt thing, I think that although he may have not had the total number of wins of some of the other drivers that he is if not the best overall driver NASCAR has seen, he is atleast in the top 3.

This may get me shot...but I think that Richard Petty is a little over rated. Sure he has all those wins, but look at how many starts it took him to get those. I think if he was in his prime during the same time as Earnhardt that he would not have had that many wins and would not be as highly regarding.

But that is just my opinion, and everyone is welcome to their own view.

I am just glad it is time for racingggggggg!

 

I agree. Not a #48 fan. </font>[/QUOTE]Kind of hypocritical for a Junior fan to cast stones at anyone else for cheating.

 

I agree. Not a #48 fan. </font>[/QUOTE]Kind of hypocritical for a Junior fan to cast stones at anyone else for cheating. </font>[/QUOTE]I did not throw stones at anyone. I simply agreed with ccr that I hoped Johnson stayed in the back. I don't care for him regardless of the cheating issue.

None of them should cheat, Dale Jr. included. I do not agree with some of the things Jr. does, but I am sure that could probably be said for 99% of the drivers.

I am a Dale Jr. fan because he and I lost our fathers at about the same age and I can relate a little to the struggle he has went through. Obviously my father was not a world wide celebrity, etc. But loosing a father at a younger age is a hard thing and I am thankful I did not have to do it on a national stage.

 

i don't mind watching the last few laps of a race on TV, but i can't watch the whole thing.
I did learn who some of the drivers were a few years ago when i was living closer to my father in law because he is a pretty big racing fan.

 

Petty was a good driver whose equipment was years ahead of everyone else. Being the first to have automaker support was a huge advantage that he held alone or in small company for some time.

The Earnhardt legend will endure... and I couldn't stand the guy when he was racing. I thought he was cheap and dirty. Like Junior, once he gained star status NASCAR gave him a much wider berth than any of the other drivers.

None the less, Earnhardt was a pretty incredible driver. His record speaks for itself... even though the competition even in his era wasn't what it is now. Most importantly, he was a popular star of the sport who died at the wheel. Even people who despised him (like me) were sick on our stomach for awhile afterwards. The sport was changed for the worse by his untimely exit.

He never would have tolerated the non-sense some of these young guys try to pull... and I don't think he would have stood by and watched the older drivers get tossed aside.

 

I agree completely! It is a shame we cannot see how things would be with all these young racers and #3 around.

 

I don't think they would have been at all.

I definitely don't think that the DE ego and Busch brother's egos... and recklessness could have peacefully coexisted.

 

Oh yeah, Jeff Gordon won his first qualifier at Daytona! How could I have missed that.

BTW, I wonder how Earnhardt's winning percentage stacks up against Gordon? I imagine Gordon's percentage is higher than anyone on the list you gave. Of course, he has not yet reached the twilight of his career and reaching that stage tends to diminish a driver's statistical winning percentage. Both Petty and Waltrip lingered on in their cars long after they had lost their competitive edge. If either had retired at the top of their game their percentage would be much higher.

The aspect of Dale Earnhardt's life that will keep him in memory is his personna. As a character, he dominated his times. That will keep him in memory, but I still think in time that his statistics will be evaluated more objectively and he will not be as highly regarded.

 

A couple of comments.

I agree that Petty was great in large part on the strength of his personality. When he came along, most drivers were rough-hewn like Earnhardt. Petty, through his demeanor, civilized the sport. As to his percentages, if Petty had retired in 1984 with two hundred wins, his winning percentage would have been better than 21%. So, the years of racing past his prime hurts that percentage drastically.

Earnhardt will be weak statistically in the future because of the records Jeff Gordon is likely to set. Gordon will pass Earnhardt THIS YEAR in wins. It is hard to argue that Gordon has faced weaker competition in his career. He may very well pass Earnhardt in championships, but who knows. In 1994, when Earnhardt won his 7th, I thought he would probably win 10 before his career was over. But, it was Jeff Gordon who won 3 of the next 4 and ended Earnhardt's opportunity to surpass Petty.

Earnhardt really is weak in the races won category. He has fewer wins in the modern error that Darrell Waltrip despite all of the championships. He trails Petty, Pearson, waltrip, Allison, and Yarborough in superspeedway wins despite the fact that, during his heyday, the NASCAR schedule was composed of 2/3rds superspeedway races, while in their heyday is was half superspeedway, or less.

Finally, Earnhardt was a man with great driving talent who developed the ability to WIN races only late in his career. Early on he was far too hard on equipment. If he had that problem in his day, he would have been very unsuccessful in the Petty-Pearson era when the cars were much more unreliable and had to be babied.

In short, a few years from now, the emotions of Earnhardt's death will fade and his career will be evaluated with less emotional baggage. Calling him the best driver ever will be highly debatable.

 

I agree completely. I did not mean to appear that I dislike Petty or think he was a bad driver, etc. I have the utmost respect for Petty and what he has done for the sport and his place in history. Yet I have and still hear people talk about how he is the best driver of all time, and I disagree. I would probably say he is the 4th best driver behind Pearson, Earnhardt and Yarborough. And as much as it pains me to say it, Gordon will more than likely be up there with those guys before it is all said and done.

Question for everyone: Besides Jeff Gordon, is there anyone driving right now that you think can be up there with the greatest drivers of all time when their career is over?

 

First, I would say that drivers today are better overall than they were in the past. Many of the drivers in the filed today started driving when they were very young children. Also, they can race on computer simulators and learn the characteristics of the cars before they get on the track. They have thousands of hours experience on the tracks compared to drivers of the past and that makes them better. Of all the drivers out there now, if I had to pick one to drive my car I would pick Greg Biffle. Last year when they took the big spoilers off the cars, lots of drivers complained that the cars were too loose and out of control. Biffle never complained, but went on a tear and won several races.

 

My answer would be Tony Stewart. I think he and Jeff Gordon are the most talented drivers in the series today. I think one of things that makes both so talented is that they are good and win on any kind of track NASCAR has...they can win at the superspeedways, short tracks, road courses and the inbetween tracks.

I think if Stewart stays around, he will be up there in wins and championships.

 

One of the frequent arguments for Earnhardt being the best driver ever is that, though he did not win as many races as Petty or Pearson, he drove in an era that was more competitive. My point is, that Gordon is out-performing Earnhardt in the "win" category and you can't argue that Gordon's era is less competitive than Earnhardt's. This argues against Earnhardt being the all-time best driver. Incidentally, Gordon and Earnhardt finished 1-2 on several occasions, but, to my knowledge, Earnhardt never bested Gordon in a 1-2 finish. Earnhardt's dominance of NASCAR ended very suddenly with the arrival of Gordon.

Ask the car owners he had prior to Richard Childress and let them tell you how he destroyed cars. Bud Moore is one who comes to mind.

 

How had Evernham done without Gordon? A handful of wins and he has had 4-5 different drivers (although that is with two cars). He has won no championship. The closest he has come is with Jerremy Mayfield who has finished last in the "Chase" the last two years. I think Evernham would be the first to tell you that he would hire Gordon at the drop of a hat if he could.

I'm not even a Gordon fan, but "facts is facts" and in light of Gordon's career, I just don't think that Dale Earnhardt is the best ever.

 

Evernham has not done much after Gordon. However as Ccr pointed out Gordon has not done nearly as well after Evernham either. So it seems to go both ways. For whatever reason Gordon and Evernham clicked and did great things together.

Gordon is a great driver. But I do not think he can be put in the same category as Earnhardt yet.

 

I started watching NASCAR back in the 50's and the big differents I see is it use to be 90% or better the driver and to day I would say it is about 15 to 20% driver.
Do you think Rex White could win today with a shop out of his home?
Fireball Roberts won with who ever he drove for, he could just flat win.
It use to take a bigh man to handle a car, now it does not. If you want to have some fun, look at the size of the past winners and how when we move forward to today how much smaller they are as a group in size. I'm not even sure Tiny Lun could get into todays cars.