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Featured No need of Calvin, OSAS, Arminius, Spurgeon, Luther, and Boice

Discussion in 'Calvinism & Arminianism Debate' started by rockytopva, Dec 21, 2018.

  1. rockytopva

    rockytopva Well-Known Member
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  2. Jerome

    Jerome Well-Known Member
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    I saw this from the Fundamental Baptist Fellowship:

    Proclaim & Defend • Dr. Dave Sproul

    "The movie 'Sheffy,' produced by Bob Jones University, is the life story of an itinerant Methodist evangelist in the hills of Kentucky in the early 1800s....Dr. Bob Jones Sr....was born and reared in a Methodist Church....he held large city wide meetings with more than a million people professing salvation"

    "old time Methodists believed in Biblical holiness and lived that way....My Mother and Father were saved through the ministry of Methodist preachers. I was saved under the preaching of a Free Methodist woman evangelist...the Word was given and 17 were saved the night I came to Christ"

    Hallelujah!
     
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  3. rockytopva

    rockytopva Well-Known Member
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    I have researched the revival...

    1. The Methodist revival was best around the time of the Civil War
    2. The Pentecostal Holiness revival was best around the world wars.

    The old timers would tell you that if you got sanctified that the Baptism was not that far away. To get sanctified, or to get religion as the old Methodist would call it, the experience would come with a sweet Christ like spirit, or they would tell you that you do not have it yet, come back tomorrow night! And smile a little as they would say it. An old story goes of a farmer seeking this blessing, while plowing wind rows, the horse would veer a little and he would get angry. The wife would then holler out the door, "Not yet honey! Not yet!" When you got sanctified the first ones to know about it will be the family pets, instead of kicking them you will rub them and show a little love.

    The old timers would tell you that when you got good and sanctified that the baptism was not that far away. And once people went through to the Holy Spirit all the blessings were unique. Discernment... If E = mc2 then we can divide and conclude that...

    Mass (m) = Energy (E/c2) And there are three varieties...

    Natural E/c2 - All mass is basically cooled plasma, the sun is the visible form of E/c2
    Mental E/c2 - Our thinking can produce creativeness, light, and good things
    Spiritual E/c2 - E (motivation, warmth, love) / c2 (faith, hope, charity, joy)

    The Natural E/c2 in the form of mass produces a gravity that attracts other objects
    The Intellectual E/c2 produces a gravity that draws us to study
    The Spiritual E/c2 also has a gravity that draws and makes religion attractive

    The true spiritual E/c2 has a warmth and a light about it, making the blessing appealing, and motivating others to get it as well. If the blessing is not of God there will be no E (motivation, warmth, love) / c2 (faith, hope, charity, joy), but rather a strange experience, or outright darkness. The Apostle Paul calls these things fruits of the Spirit, and it is very important that they follow the blessing.

    Charles Stanley tells about the old Pentecostal Holiness here... https://www.intouch.org/read/magazine/the-pulpit/enduring-witness... And the kind of experience that his grandfather kept up in his lifetime. But as far as Robert Sheffey (Methodist Circuit Rider) and George Washington Stanley (Pentecostal Holiness grandfather of Charles Stanley) they were fruits of a good revival that has passed with time.

    Photoed below is the Virginian Methodist Saint Robert Sayers Sheffey, in which GC Rankin also makes reference to...

    I passed my examinations and that year I was sent to the Wytheville Station and Circuit. That was adjoining my former charge. We reached the old parsonage on the pike just out of Wytheville as Rev. B. W. S. Bishop moved out. Charley Bishop was then a little tow-headed boy. He is now the learned Regent of Southwestern University. The parsonage was an old two-and-a-half-story structure with nine rooms and it looked a little like Hawthorne's house with the seven gables. It was the lonesomest-looking old house I ever saw. There was no one there to meet us, for we had not notified anybody of the time we would arrive.

    Think of taking a young bride to that sort of a mansion! But she was brave and showed no sign of disappointment. That first night we felt like two whortleberries in a Virginia tobacco wagonbed. We had room and to spare, but it was scantily furnished with specimens as antique as those in Noah's ark. But in a week or so we were invited out to spend the day with a good family, and when we went back we found the doors fastened just as we had left them, but when we entered a bedroom was elegantly furnished with everything modern and the parlor was in fine shape. The ladies had been there and done the work. How much does the preacher owe to the good women of the Church!

    The circuit was a large one, comprising seventeen appointments. They were practically scattered all over the county. I preached every other day, and never less than twice and generally three times on Sunday.

    I had associated with me that year a young collegemate, Rev. W. B. Stradley. He was a bright, popular fellow, and we managed to give Wytheville regular Sunday preaching. Stradley became a great preacher and died a few years ago while pastor of Trinity Church, Atlanta, Georgia. We were true yokefellows and did a great work on that charge, held fine revivals and had large ingatherings.

    The famous Cripple Creek Campground was on that work. They have kept up campmeetings there for more than a hundred years. It is still the great rallying point for the Methodists of all that section. I have never heard such singing and preaching and shouting anywhere else in my life. I met the Rev. John Boring there and heard him preach. He was a well-known preacher in the conference; original, peculiar, strikingly odd, but a great revival preacher.

    One morning in the beginning of the service he was to preach and he called the people to prayer. He prayed loud and long and told the Lord just what sort of a meeting we were expecting and really exhorted the people as to their conduct on the grounds. Among other things, he said we wanted no horse- trading and then related that just before kneeling he had seen a man just outside the encampment looking into the mouth of a horse and he made such a peculiar sound as he described the incident that I lifted up my head to look at him, and he was holding his mouth open with his hands just as the man had done in looking into the horse's mouth! But he was a man of power and wrought well for the Church and for humanity.

    The rarest character I ever met in my life I met at that campmeeting in the person of Rev. Robert Sheffy, known as "Bob" Sheffy. He was recognized all over Southwest Virginia as the most eccentric preacher of that country. He was a local preacher; crude, illiterate, queer and the oddest specimen known among preachers. But he was saintly in his life, devout in his experience and a man of unbounded faith. He wandered hither and thither over that section attending meetings, holding revivals and living among the people. He was great in prayer, and Cripple Creek campground was not complete without "Bob" Sheffy. They wanted him there to pray and work in the altar.

    He was wonderful with penitents. And he was great in following up the sermon with his exhortations and appeals. He would sometimes spend nearly the whole night in the straw with mourners; and now and then if the meeting lagged he would go out on the mountain and spend the entire night in prayer, and the next morning he would come rushing into the service with his face all aglow shouting at the top of his voice. And then the meeting always broke loose with a floodtide.

    He could say the oddest things, hold the most unique interviews with God, break forth in the most unexpected spasms of praise, use the homeliest illustrations, do the funniest things and go through with the most grotesque performances of any man born of woman.

    It was just "Bob" Sheffy, and nobody thought anything of what he did and said, except to let him have his own way and do exactly as he pleased. In anybody else it would not have been tolerated for a moment. In fact, he acted more like a crazy man than otherwise, but he was wonderful in a meeting. He would stir the people, crowd the mourner's bench with crying penitents and have genuine conversions by the score. I doubt if any man in all that conference has as many souls to his credit in the Lamb's Book of Life as old "Bob" Sheffy.

    At the close of that year in casting up my accounts I found that I had received three hundred and ninety dollars for my year's work, and the most of this had been contributed in everything except money. It required about the amount of cash contributed to pay my associate and the Presiding Elder. I got the chickens, the eggs, the butter, the ribs and backbones, the corn, the meat, and the Presiding Elder and Brother Stradley had helped us to eat our part of the quarterage. Well, we kept open house and had a royal time, even if we did not get much ready cash. We lived and had money enough to get a good suit of clothes and to pay our way to conference. What more does a young Methodist preacher need or want? We were satisfied and happy, and these experiences are not to be counted as unimportant assets in the life and work of a Methodist circuit rider.

    [​IMG]
     
  4. Marooncat79

    Marooncat79 Well-Known Member
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    Rocky are you a oneness Pentecostal?

    Thanks in Avance
     
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  5. The Biblicist

    The Biblicist Well-Known Member
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    Ignorance is bliss but sincerety cannot replace truth and these people were woefully ignorant of truth. They denied grace because they simply were ignorant of the Biblical teaching of grace. You cannot be taught what your teachers are ignorant about as water cannot rise about its own level.
     
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  6. SovereignGrace

    SovereignGrace Well-Known Member
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    Apparently he’s afraid of answering? Also, apparently he’s okay with women preachers, too. :rolleyes:
     
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  7. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    Yes
    If you ignore past teaching of men God used, you can just make your own rules and say the Spirit led you.
     
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  8. Wesley Briggman

    Wesley Briggman Well-Known Member
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    Thankfully, there is no aptitude test to get into heaven. You just have to be adopted into the right family.
     
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  9. The Biblicist

    The Biblicist Well-Known Member
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    But sincerety will not place you in the right family, only grace can do that.
     
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  10. Wesley Briggman

    Wesley Briggman Well-Known Member
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    Well said. The list could go on & on & on.... The good news is none of these traits or flaws will not keep me out, as I am one of His Elect.

    Additionally, prophesying, casting out devils or doing many wonderful works in the name of the Lord will get you into heaven if these efforts are not done in the will of the Father.

    Mat 7:21 KJV - Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
    Mat 7:22 KJV - Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
     
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  11. The Biblicist

    The Biblicist Well-Known Member
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    No, the list begins and ends with grace as far as entrance into heaven is concerned, if you take away or add anything else it is no longer grace (Rom. 11:5-6) and this text is speaking of the election of grace.
     
  12. Wesley Briggman

    Wesley Briggman Well-Known Member
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    Agreed. His grace is sufficient for the elect.
     
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