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Pastor tells congregation to, "Love it or leave it!"

Discussion in 'News & Current Events' started by Reformed, Jul 22, 2019.

  1. Reformed

    Reformed Well-Known Member
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    Pastor doubles down on 'America: Love or leave it' sign as members walk out

    In my opinion, this pastor is wrong because he placed nationality over the Gospel. I love America. Like many other BB members, I proudly wore the uniform of one of our military branches. But I am not an American first. I am a child of God. It seems like this pastor's version of patriotism has split his church. How sad.
     
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  2. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
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    If no one shows up it did more than split his church. I don't know that this is not a recoverable issue. However, he doesn't seem to want to. Two things:

    1. This is not a result of placing nationality over the gospel.
    2. This is not a result of racism.
     
  3. GoodTidings

    GoodTidings Well-Known Member

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    There is a time and place for everything. The pastor is right in what he said, but wrong in his delivery method.
     
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  4. Reynolds

    Reynolds Well-Known Member
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    I agree with him. If anyone didn't like it, they are liberals. Church will be better off without those tares anyway. I wish our pastor would run off what few liberals we have.
     
    #4 Reynolds, Jul 22, 2019
    Last edited: Jul 22, 2019
  5. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    Hmm. . . . It needs to be done, if at all, over the word of God and not merely over American patriotism.
     
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  6. Baptist Believer

    Baptist Believer Well-Known Member
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    Sure it is. He has declared a nationalist message on the church's sign, making it an official message of the congregation/pastor. The kingdom of God is not the United States.

    At the same time, how does this nationalist leader masquerading as a spokesman for God judge 'loving' America? I suppose he might think that a person doesn't love America if that person offers a critique of something in American culture or government policy, but if that is true, then just about everyone reading my words now 'hates' America. Also, that would mean that the OT prophets hated Israel, Jesus hated Israel, the New Testament Christians hated every culture, and our current President has hated this country and it's leaders for much of his public life.

    However, I sincerely doubt this nationalist leader has given his message that much thought.
     
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  7. Reynolds

    Reynolds Well-Known Member
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    Anyone who doesn't like it is either a liberal or is OVERTHINKING it.
     
  8. Baptist Believer

    Baptist Believer Well-Known Member
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    Please tell me, what does it mean to "love America?" What does that look like on a practical and public level?
     
  9. Reynolds

    Reynolds Well-Known Member
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    Not undermining and trying to destroy her as the liberals are doing.
     
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  10. Baptist Believer

    Baptist Believer Well-Known Member
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    That's an extremely subjective standard. I happen to think our current President is undermining most of the American principles laid down by our Founding Fathers and destroying the hard bi-partisan work of many generations. I think our previous President also did some damage by setting the precedent of using Executive Orders to accomplish things he could not do through Congress.

    So if you support our current President, I think the shoe is on the other foot and you should be the one leaving this country. But that would be a totalitarian attitude which violates our foundational and sacred American principles, so I don't have that attitude. But you and the President need to stop it. Don't hate America.
     
    #10 Baptist Believer, Jul 22, 2019
    Last edited: Jul 22, 2019
  11. Wingman68

    Wingman68 Well-Known Member
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    Went to Walmart today for some range ammo, & saw a twenty something girl there wearing a bold t-shirt saying the same thing. I was a little surprised but heartened at the same time. There is nothing wrong with the message. Too many of the messages coming from churches ARE wrong, morally, this is not one of them.
    I would be elated to see this on my church marquee, I might even think about going back, however the Pastor is a supporter of ‘the new deal’ that has overtaken the hapless SBC, so.............
     
  12. Reformed

    Reformed Well-Known Member
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    Speaking only for myself here are a few ways how love for America can be displayed:

    Pray for a large-scale movement among God's people to put off worldliness and put on godliness (1 Peter 1:15).
    Pray for our leaders without blind party-allegiance to every decision they make (1 Timothy 2:1-2).
    Display our love to our fellow brothers and sisters so that God receives the glory even among unbelievers in our society (Matthew 5:16; John 13:34; Galatians 5:14).
    Take up the plight of the unborn who are being slaughtered on the altar to Satan (James 1:27).
    Proclaim the Gospel not only in our churches but in the public square, knowing that it is the only hope in our godless culture (Romans 1:17; 2 Timothy 4:2).
    Do not erect unbiblical requirements (tradition, political, societal) that a person must meet in order to be one of us (Galatians 1:10).
     
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  13. Baptist Believer

    Baptist Believer Well-Known Member
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    I haven't bought ammo from Walmart in a couple of years. They were having trouble keeping it in stock, so I started buying online. Are the prices still decent on "white box" Winchester ammo?

    Well, it violates our founding principles, so I think it is unAmerican.

    This type of message shouldn't come from the church at all. The church should be about the Kingdom of God, not promoting certain views of earthly kingdoms.
     
  14. Baptist Believer

    Baptist Believer Well-Known Member
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    This is an outstanding and biblical answer.
     
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  15. Reformed

    Reformed Well-Known Member
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    Amen and amen.

    This pastor made a subjective statement on what it means to love America. Apparently, the majority of his church disagreed. Are they to be condemned for that? Where is this pastor's love for his flock evident? He is so willing to take a principled political stand that he will allow his flock to be scattered? How very sad.
     
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  16. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
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    Sorry your black and white fallacy doesn't stand.
     
  17. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
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    Of course you do. TDS is in full effect.
     
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  18. Wingman68

    Wingman68 Well-Known Member
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    Federal & Winchester 9mm/100 rds, 17 bucks. Didn’t need ammo, but don’t want to cut into the stash. They only had a couple of rifles, but plenty of 22 ammo, bricks, buckets, boxes, so that was good.
     
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  19. Baptist Believer

    Baptist Believer Well-Known Member
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    You are quite good at claiming things true or false, but very poor at actually explaining why.

    Why is my statement a fallacy? Why do you consider it not black and white?

    The message is about the United States, a political entity (nation) of this world. The sign identifies the location as the place where the business/worship of the church (Friendship Baptist Church) is based, and there is not indication that the church allows the community or passers-by to place messages on the sign. The duly-appointed leader of the congregation proudly admits that he placed the message on the sign, so unless you are making the claim that the public does not perceive the pastor as having authority to speak for the congregation, then it is an official statement. Beyond all of that, Jesus explicitly taught that His Kingdom is not of this world, as a political agency where people would take up swords to defend it.

    So how in the world is my statement a fallacy?
     
  20. Baptist Believer

    Baptist Believer Well-Known Member
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    Yes, Trump Delusion Syndrome. You have a severe case of it.
     
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