All I am saying is that we're commanded(christians in that context) that when we pray, we pray in the name of Jesus. It is(as Brother TC previously posted) as authority. We pray in the name of Jesus in authority because we are His and His ears are open to our prayers and His eyes are always looking towards us. With the unregenerate, it is not so. His face is against them(not looking at them), and His ears are not attentitive until their prayers. He hates sin and sinners that much.
Now, those who do not serve Him, their prayers He will not answer. Why? They have not the authority to pray in the name of Jesus.
Carry this over to the gospel. Regeneration is solely the act of God apart from man's will. In this work of grace wrought upon their heart, faith, repentance and love are bestowed upon the sinner and then they exercise their will when they are saved. Man is passive in regeneration, but active in salvation, seeing their will has been changed by grace and they being born of God, are no longer His enemyy, no longing hating, but loving, Him.
Please explain this.
Discussion in 'Calvinism & Arminianism Debate' started by SovereignGrace, Apr 29, 2016.
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SovereignGrace Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
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That is my point with "regeneration leads to salvation" (there is never a time when one is regenerate yet lost, spiritually alive yet faithless....these are oxymoron). -
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InTheLight Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
The thief on the cross.
The tax collector. Luke 18:13
Cornelius.
Anyone who calls on the name of the Lord Romans 10:13 -
SovereignGrace Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
Instead I believe that salvation as a whole (to include regeneration) is the mercy of the Father on the grounds of the Cross and in Christ, through faith worked by the Spirit in the lives of those who believe (Ezk. 36; Eph. 2). Where we disagree is I view faith as a continual work of the Spirit rather than a "gift" in the form of a product of regeneration.[/quote]
Faith is both instaneous and ongoing, just like repentance. One doesn't repent once and not any more. One who is progressively sanctified also has an ongoing faith.
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SovereignGrace Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
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InTheLight Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
"For whosoever God regenerates he will enable them to call upon the name of the Lord." Calvins 10:13 -
SovereignGrace Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
Those who love Him have been born of Him. That is what 1 John 4:7 avers. -
True faith (faith unto salvation) endures unto the end. I believe that this is often what the apostles spoke of when they spoke of faith. The faith that endures is the faith that is wrought of God because what God begins He completes. Likewise, true regeneration finds it's final state when we are resurrected in the image of Christ. The event of a lost man being saved is the precursor to a life being saved which find's its fulfillment in that final state of salvation.
My argument was simply that in each case regeneration does not lead to salvation but instead is itself a vital and interdependent aspect of salvation. -
InTheLight Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
Oh yeah, these same people are not seeking God either.
Sent from my Motorola Droid Turbo. -
SovereignGrace Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
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SovereignGrace Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
Look at it like this ITL. Go up to a slobbering drunk and witness to him/her. Tell them the gospel as Paul laid out in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4. Unless God is working within them, they will turn you down. They will have no desire to be saved, being enslaved by sin. 1 Corinthians 2:14 and Romans 8:7-8 ring ever so true here.
The unregenerate want nothing to do with God. You brought up the millions who go to church who are unregenerate. That is sadly true, and I will never deny this. I have seen the tabloids where the likes of Britney Spears was spotted leaving church after a service. Yet, she is living a rebellious life. They have a god fashioned in their minds that is not the God of the bible, and the god fashioned in their minds is one who loves the sinner but hates the sin. The god they serve loves g@ys and is okay with them being married, because 'God is love', right? Vicki Gunvalson of 'Real Housewives of Orange County' avers she is going to heaven when she dies, saying she is a Christian. Yet, she was shacked up with a man whilst having 'relations' out of wedlock. She's been divorced three times, gets drunk, but she is going to heaven. Then another one attends Jentezen Franklin's church claiming to be a Christian. Yet she dresses provactively, and tends to drink too much. Another was recently baptized and they had to bleep out a bunch of her words.
Ppl fashion a god in their mind and worship him. But not the God of the bible. -
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And if they are why do you disagree with Romans 8:7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
Matthew 6:24 No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon.
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I have no problem with examining regeneration as enabling people to believe. But I also have no problem acknowledging that no one is regenerated who does not believe. These are two aspects of salvation that cannot be pulled apart (they are interdependent).
I am cautious, however, when some lean towards faith (in terms of salvation) as primarily evidence of salvation rather than salvation by grace through faith. A few comments seems to present the idea that a person is saved and then he comes to believe as evidence that he has indeed been saved. Hopefully I'm just being overly cautious. -
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