A reporter asked Pope Benedict yesterday "So what are you going to give up for Lent this year?"
The Pope said "Funny you should ask me that...."
:laugh:
Pope Benedict to Resign at End of Month
Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by Zaac, Feb 11, 2013.
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You must be talking about there co redeemer Mary. In fact it seems they never pray to Christ. Maybe it's the actual flesh of Christ you are talking about you know the flesh of Christ the bread preist pray over and it turns in to the flesh of Christ. Maybe even its all those so called Saints they pray to or maybe the beads they count as they pray to Mary. Hail Mary holy mother of god. The problem is which god. is it Mary or the Pope himself? Faith misplaced might as well not exist because it does nothing.
Sure they can be saved but they have to place that faith in Christ alone.
MB -
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I do believe a lot of times in our attempts to be compassionate , we can start to forsake keeping God first because of a "cause".
So let's love on unsaved Catholics just as we would anyone else who doesn't know Christ. But let's not let our idea of compassion help them to stumble right into hell because we don't want to tell them they are unsaved because they have not gone through Christ for salvation. -
Probably best I not post my testimony and reasons for becoming Catholic on this thread as I no longer consider myself a Baptist and only posted in this forum by mistake. I would be glad to share my testimony in the appropriate forum, however.
BTW, there is so much mis-information on this thread as to the pope and what he has said about Islam and other Baptists 'ideas' about Catholicism it is difficult not to comment but I will respect the rules of the board. -
Alrighty Then...
On a seperate note...I appreciate your intent and respect for the posting rules of the Board. Sometimes you have to do a post like the one above just to get a message across. I know that is true. Your respect for the rules tells me something positive about you.
Bro.Greg:saint: -
Crabtown believes you are judging him. I believe it's an accurate discernment. His own fruits are what has already judged Him.
MB -
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Thanks...and...
By the way...forgive for not knowing but what is RCIA?
Bro.Greg:saint: -
My pupose on this board is not to try to convince anyone that the Catholic Church holds the Apostolic Faith. I'm not trying to convert anyone. I do learn much from reading through threads not related to Catholicism although I do not comment on them often. I do sometimes comment on threads relating to Catholicism in the 'Other Denominations' forum simply because of the tremendous amount of mis-infomation found there. Your thoughts on papal infallibility is an example. Only when the pope speaks Ex-Cathedra (which rarely happens) through the assistance of the Holy Spirit is anything considered 'infallible'. In other words, when he defines a dogma in virtue of his supreme authority and in his capacity as chief pastor of the universal Church. According to Catholic doctrine, papal infallibility is based on the fact that in Luke 22:32 Jesus promised Peter that his “faith” (i.e., his declarations of divine truths concerning “faith and morals”) would not fail. I know you may not agree with the contextual disposition of Luke 22:32. Christ instructed the Church to preach everything He taught (Matt. 28:19–20) and promised the protection of the Holy Spirit to "guide you into all the truth" (John 16:13). That mandate and that promise guarantee the Church will never fall away from his teachings (Matt. 16:18, 1 Tim. 3:15), even if individual Catholics might. Anyway, no pope can issue something Ex-Cathedra that contradicts scripture nor is it given more weight than scripture. The pope also sees himself as 'another fallen man in need of a Savior'. In fact, the present pope goes to confession regularly. Probably best to discuss this in the soon to be created thread.
I will make every effort to discuss matters in an open minded, civil, biblical and Christian manner in the soon-to-be created thread. Please keep in mind there are only three Catholics allowed on this board at this time. We are allowed here because we were Baptists when we joined and have become Catholic afterwards and we don't attempt to proselytize. Because there are so few of us, it is not easy to answer the many posts that may appear on this type of thread. I see the reverse on Catholic boards and I often feel for the evangelicals that are barraged with questions. -
I have no doubt that there may be saved, blood-bought believers in the Catholic Church.
BUT, after living in Mexico for a number of years as a missionary, I can tell you that there is a definite difference between how Catholicism is believed and practiced in the USA versus in Mexico, Colombia, and other Hispanic countries. In those countries it would be very hard for one to be a believer in Christ alone for salvation and still remain a practicing member of the Catholic Church. Most who receive Christ have to leave, not just the Church, but family, friends, and employment.
There is still persecution of Bible preachers and missionaries in Mexico by the Catholic Church, mainly focused in the rural areas. I have personally talked with pastors who have suffered such.
Those believers who are in the Catholic Church should do the right thing and get out. -
Thank You
Bro.Greg:saint: -
preachinjesus Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
Its clear a lot of have experience with or around the RCC. Growing where I did two of my friends in middle school and high school ended up becoming priests in the Roman Catholic Church. I have a good friend locally who is a RCC priest. In my PhD work I spent a healthy amount of time studying the RCC. So I've got a bit of a platform to discuss this stuff too. Having been around this place for a while now, and having been in Baptist churches even longer, I see too many examples of individuals who have bad information about the RCC.
However, I'm not secretly wishing I was Roman Catholic. I am happily and firmly Baptist. I do believe there are many in the RCC who are saved, and its probably the same ratio as folks who are part of Baptist churches.
I do have problems with the veneration of Mary. She clearly was not a perpetual virgin and we have evidence of that. She was a special person who was used mightily by God. We can be thankful for her and not take things to dramatic ends. :)
Now, I don't accept the Roman Catholic view of soteriology. In fact, I reject it. However, my historical reticence makes me note that this view of salvation has been maintained for a rather long time. So instead of mischaracterizing this view, let's do our best to accurately represent it.
Justification is the means by which we are sealed in the grace of salvation through faith in Jesus Christ. A Roman Catholic would have no problem affirming that salvation is by grace through faith, and not of works. Where our differences creep in often has to do with where does the efficacy of grace intersect with personal behavior and, more importantly, is an ecclesial institution necessary for according that grace throughout our lifetime?
Clearly I don't accept the RCC answer here. But I also can't mischaracterize their position.
Secondly, show me with a direct citation where Pope Benedict XVI has this about Islam. Otherwise, you're slandering him as well. -
I disagree...strenuosly
PIJ...from what I've read by others here and said myself I don't think we are "mischaracterizing" Catholic doctrine as much as we are "interpreting" and defining it according to the truths taught in the Word of God about what does...and does NOT constitute our salvation and justification by grace through faith and other vital Biblical truths.The following excerpt from your post is clearly contradictory as follows:
You said:
"Well this is a bit of misunderstanding about their soteriology. When Catholics say "the Church" is the "key to salvation" they are simply noting that the Church, institutionally, functions as the deliverance of efficacious grace through the celebration of the seven sacraments. A person is only saved insofar as they maintain communion with the Church, observe the sacraments, and receive mediating grace. It is an inarticulate position to say the "church is [their] key to Salvation".
If THIS is what they "believe" and what they are "saying" then they ARE saying their salvation comes by and through their CHURCH. There is nothing even SLIGHTLY scriptural about ANY of that...in my humble opinion. There is NOTHING about ANY church or denomination (Baptists included)that constitutes a "means of grace". It's simply not in the Bible...even if it is part of their church tradition. Neither is papal authority, apostolic sucession, papal "infallibility" mariology, purgatory, indulgences,the "mass" (transubstantiation)confession to a "priest" or "Father". I could go on but that's enough for now.
Bro.Greg:saint: -
That still looks like everything but by grace through faith.
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InTheLight Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
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preachinjesus Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
You end up usually getting a mixture of works based, Osteen positivism, and pantheistic philosophy wrapped into a cliche laden statement. I think we can agree that all our churches need to do better at educating our folks on this stuff.
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