Questions KJVOs Can't Answer.

[Dr. Bob]

Since there is no "one-Greek-text=TR", then anything that purports itself to be the TR is a "critical" text, correct?

If I am laboring under a misunderstanding, let me know. But I've study a lot of Greek documents and never found the TR text in any ONE of them. Always a compilation by someone.

So even the lame "TR only" argument must put unbelieveable faith in Erasmus et al in compiling a "critical text".

 

[skanwmatos]

Originally posted by Askjo:
If you believe that the NKJV was based on the TR, it is a critical edition TR.

No, Askjo. It is based on Scrivener's TR. The one which gives all the Greek words which underly the KJV. The one D.A. Waite says is the "perfectly preserved pure word of God in Greek." There is no "critical edition TR" anywhere in the picture. Why do you keep making up new lies to try to cover up your old lies? Why not just admit the truth? The NKJV is translated from the same Greek text as the KJV. If you continue to hate the truth, just remember what Jesus said. He is the Truth! If you despise the Truth, you despise the Lord Jesus Christ, Who IS Truth!

 

[HankD]

Dear askjo,

You keep saying that the NKJV follows the critical text while the translators themselves say that they followed the Scrivener TR which has no critical apparatus (at least mine doesn't).

Because you are stating this as a fact you are technically accusing the NKJV translators of fraud or misrepresentaion of the facts and are possibly liable should they chose to persue your accusation.

If you really believe what you are saying then you should at very least indicate that you are expressing an opinion.

HankD

 

[Lacy Evans]

Lacy finally answers a question, but his answer is so ambivalent as to be meaningless. He seems to have asserted the old "KJVO Double Standard." The NKJV is wrong for doing exactly the same thing the KJV does!

I'm sorry, I really never even intended to answer any of the "questions".

Lacy

 

[Phillip]

Why can't KJVo's answer the questions?

Surely, they aren't too hard to understand, if they can understand the KJV.

Then again, maybe they have no answers.

 

[Askjo]

In the preface to the NKJV, the editors say that their text of the New Testament is based upon the TR.

However the critical edition TR is as not same as the TR that the KJV was based upon.

 

[HankD]

I give up!

HankD

 

[Askjo]

Originally posted by Pastor_Bob:
I guess I'm missing something here. As far as I can see, the KJV does translate logos in Hebrews 5:11.

Heb 5:11 Of <peri> whom <hos> we <hemin> have <logos> many things <polus> to say <logos>, and <kai> hard <dusermeneutos> to be uttered <lego>, seeing <epei> ye are <ginomai> dull <nothros> of hearing <akoe>.

An illustration is 2 sentences:

I "say" - not logos.

I have many things "to say" - logos.

See the difference between them.

 

[skanwmatos]

Originally posted by Lacy Evans:
I'm sorry, I really never even intended to answer any of the "questions".

I know. You can't. Typical KJVO. Long on mouth but short on brains.

 

[Askjo]

Did the KJV and the New KJV follow the SAME Greek text?

John Ankerberg said: "The NKJV is based on the SAME Greek text as the 1611."

D. A. Waite refuted him by saying: "This is not completely true." Waite explained more about that in his book, "Foes of the King James Bible Refuted."

 

[skanwmatos]

Originally posted by Askjo:
In the preface to the NKJV, the editors say that their text of the New Testament is based upon the TR.

However the critical edition TR is as not same as the TR that the KJV was based upon.

Please post the publisher and ISBN number of this so-called "critical edition" of the TR you keep talking about. You can find it on the bottom of the first page inside the title page. Please tell us where you got, or saw, this "critical edition" of the TR. Who publishes it? Where can I get one?

Or are you lying again? (I believe this to be the most likely.)

 

[skanwmatos]

Originally posted by Askjo:
An illustration is 2 sentences:

I "say" - not logos.

I have many things "to say" - logos.

See the difference between them.

Once again you have proven your absolute ignorance of all things biblical.

The Greek word "logos" is not translated in the KJV in Hebrews 5:11.

The Greek word translated "to say" is the Greek word "legein" not "logos."

Typical KJVO. Long on mouth but short on brains.

 

[skanwmatos]

Originally posted by Askjo:
Did the KJV and the New KJV follow the SAME Greek text?

John Ankerberg said: "The NKJV is based on the SAME Greek text as the 1611."

D. A. Waite refuted him by saying: "This is not completely true." Waite explained more about that in his book, "Foes of the King James Bible Refuted."

It is not completely true because the KJV doesn't follow ANY Greek text on some occasions. Sometimes it follows the Latin Vulgate of the Roman Catholic Church. Sometimes we don't have any idea of what it follows.

But the FACT remains that the NKJV follows the TR of Scrivener which is the TR which underlies the KJV. The "not completely" part is the 6 times the KJV departs from any known text.

 

[HankD]

But the FACT remains that the NKJV follows the TR of Scrivener which is the TR which underlies the KJV. The "not completely" part is the 6 times the KJV departs from any known text.

And this "not completely" part can in no way be construed as derived from or constituting a critical text. It is a KJV textual anomaly.

BTW, I believe I have seen a Scrivener TR for sale with an apparatus but it is for work involving variants to one of the W/H editions.

It was NOT used for the NKJV translation work.

HankD

 

[HankD]

There is an online apparatus with variants only of:

Byzantine Majority Text: The Greek New Testament According to the Byzantine Textform. As edited by Maurice A. Robinson and William G. Pierpont. Revised edition, 2001.

Textus Receptus: F.H.A Scrivener’s 1894 edition.

Critical Text: The Greek New Testament edited by Kurt Aland, Matthew Black, Carlo M. Martini, Bruce M. Metzger, and Allen Wikgren, fourth edition, Copyright © 1966, 1968, 1975 by the United Bible Societies and 1993, 1994 by Deutsche Bibelgesellsschaft (German Bible Society), Stuggart (which is identical to the Nestle-Aland 27th Edition of the Greek New Testament).

Note: Maurice Robinson graciously provided the yet to be released 2001 edition of the Byzantine Majority Text to this writer before it was even published. He also provided copies of the TR and the most recent edition of the CT in the appropriate format for a comparison program he provided which listed the differences between these three texts. With these items, this textual apparatus is as up-to-date as possible. Many thanks to Dr. Robinson for his gracious help in this regard!

http://www.dtl.org/alt/variants/intro.htm

HankD

 

[Askjo]

Did the NKJV follow the Greek TR? Let us compare the KJV, the NKJV and the SAME Greek text.

Acts 7:5 KJV -- And he gave him none inheritance in it, no, not so much as to set his foot on: yet he promised that he would give it to him for a possession, and to his seed after him, when as yet he had no child.

Acts 7:5 New KJV -- And God gave him no inheritance in it, not even enough to set his foot on. But even when Abraham had no child, He promised to give it to him for a possession, and to his descendants after him.

The Greek Text: kai ouk edwken autw klhronomian en auth oude bhma podoV kai ephggeilato autw dounai eiV katascesin authn kai tw spermati autou met auton ouk ontoV autw teknou

Please show me where the word "God" on this Greek text.

 

[gb93433]

If I recall right there are over 30 different Textus Receptuses.

 

[Trotter]

'God" was put in itallics in the NKJV. It was added for clarity (duh!).

The KJV has 'he', 'him', and 'his' EIGHT times in this one verse! Without looking at the context, I had no idea who each 'he' was, or when the narrative shifted from one to the other. By naming one of them, you have a reference point to go by.

Are you so slow as to not see that? Or are you just trying to pick at a nit? Did you actually look in the NKJV to find this example, or did you just pull it out of one of (Gipp/Riplinger/Ruckman/White)'s books?

In Christ,
Trotter

 

[Trotter]

At least the NKJV capitolizes the pronouns that refer to God.

In Christ,
Trotter

 

[Orvie]

Originally posted by Slambo:
No one wants to play your Alexadrian games..You have no final authority and you want others to sink to your level..Get a life!!

***yawn***How original.