Religion of Evolution

The second thing I looked at was the "Misconceptions Evolutionists have about Evolution" section.

It endorses the old claim that the 2nd law of thermodynamics refutes evolution.

As some people may have noted, Paul has already challenged any and all creationists to show us even one process required for evolution that is prohibited by the 2nd law.

That challenge remains unanswered, because there is no such process.

 

Another strange claim is that psuedogenes don't support evolution.

Psuedogenes are genes that are in some manner inactivated so that they don't work.

A good example is the vitamin C gene in humans. It is the same gene as is found in many other mammals, but it's been damaged and doesn't work. Humans evolved from populations that had abundant vitamin C in their diets, and so losing the gene was of no consequence.

Primates have and inactivated vitamin C gene, as do guinea pigs. But the primate psuedogene has been inactivated in a different way than the guinea pig psuedogene.

Which is precisely what is predicted by evolutionary theory.

 

Amoung the definitions of a "religion":

# A set of beliefs, values, and practices based on the teachings of a spiritual leader.
# A cause, principle, or activity pursued with zeal or conscientious devotion.

Evolution fulfills both of these. The theory of evolution has changed so often, yet people are still dedicated to it. Makes me glad that God doesn't change. He is the same yesterday, today, and forever.

Actually, evolution is a subdivision of the religion of Humanism.

 

Words uttered by a man with vestigal digits still remaining on his feet.

 

Words uttered by a man with vestigal digits still remaining on his feet. </font>[/QUOTE]How do you know their vestigial. Because man is not smart or intelligent enough to discover the function of a certain organ or part of the body that God gave man, man turns around and calls it vestigial because he is ignorant of God's design. Incredible!
The cobbler in a third world country can mend a good pair of shoes and do a good job of it. But ask him to repair an 18x optical/900x digital zoom on a miniDV Camcorder. Will he come to the same conclusion you do. I don't know its function, therefore it is vestigial. I don't think so. The reasoning of the typical evolutionist is like an on going saga--humorous too watch. Maybe the cobbler will come to the conclusion that the camcorder evolved overtime from the thick eyeglasses that he is wearing!
You change your story every time scientific evidence proves you wrong--as it often does, have no real science to back it up, and have a hard time admitting that in the end it is only a religion at best, with no scientific fact to support it.
DHK

 

"Vestigial" only means that it no longer has its original function not that it no longer has any function. A few vestigal things.

I know, I know. I'm just not smart enough to know why some of us can wiggle our ears or why we can puff up our hair or why we have the vestiges of muscles from when our ancestors walked on four legs.

"You change your story every time scientific evidence proves you wrong--as it often does, have no real science to back it up, and have a hard time admitting that in the end it is only a religion at best, with no scientific fact to support it."

If you really believe that, come on up and defend the blantent lies of the YECers I have been giving as examples of their "junk" science and dispute some of the evidences for an old earth I have been giving.

http://www.baptistboard.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi/topic/28/2740.html?

 

I'm not familiar with any values in evolutionary theory. Science has no "values", anymore than plumbing has values. And I have no idea who the "spiritual leader" might be.

That's the nature of science. When the evidence requires, the theory changes or is replaced as needed. Every science is like that. It's one of the ways by which science differs from religion.

Religion stays the same, science changes. For good and proper reasons.

Actually, humanism (not "secular humanism", but humanism) is a subdivision of Christianity.

"There can be no Humanism without the Gospels."
- Protestant theologian Karl Barth

Learn about humanism here:
http://www.eldrbarry.net/heidel/deras.htm

 

Huxley admitted that the "VALUE" in the doctrines of evolutionism is in removing God from the conscience.

Richard Dawkings admits that the beauty of evolutionism is that it claims to "explain everything" such that God is "not needed".

This is impossible to miss as the claims evolutionists THEMSELVES make about the value and purpose of evolutionism.

In Christ,

Bob

 

Sorry, I'm not much in the habit of deferring to atheists on questions of God.

You probably should avoid it, too.

Most of us are theists and don't agree with atheists on this.

Atheists and YE creationists agree on the subject for the same reason;

They want to make God and science incompatible. A hopeless quest.

 

Notice that these are evolutionists making claims about evolutionism ITSELF - not about the Bible.

You may choose to ignore what evolutionists THEMSELVES say about their OWN brainchild - evolutionism - but you should at least admit you do it.

In Christ,

Bob

 

Logically you have just contradicted yourself.

And you never even noticed it!

Just for fun, what stories do you have in mind that we have changed lately?

And which is better, a mind that never changes when new evidence comes in, or a mind that changes to accomodate new evidence when new evidence comes in?

 

As far as my ETERNAL security, I'm thankful for truth that doesn't change.

I'm reminded that as a 5th grader, we were astounded to learn that the Moon was pulled out of the Pacific Ocean. Let's see, that was 1964... The teacher was
so certain as it is still moving away from the earth to this very day...

 

Words uttered by a man with vestigal digits still remaining on his feet. </font>[/QUOTE]How do you know their vestigial. Because man is not smart or intelligent enough to discover the function of a certain organ or part of the body that God gave man, man turns around and calls it vestigial because he is ignorant of God's design. Incredible! . . .
DHK </font>[/QUOTE]OK just for fun what do YOU use your little toe and the toes next to them for? OR ANY OTHER HUMAN BEING ON THE FACE OF THE PLANET?

 

Sample usage: Entertaining children. You grab the big toe first, then each in turn, saying "this little pig went to market, this little pig stayed home, this little pig had roast beef, this little pig had none, this little pig cried WEE WEE WEE all the way home!"

But that usage is so biologically trivial it does not elevate the little toe up beyond a vestige.

 

Galation suggests that atheists are not the best people to ask about how well science and God fit together.

They are atheists, trying to tell us God and science are incompatible. You endorse their atheistic claims, because they appeal to you more than orthodox Christianity.

And, as you learned earlier, Christians, not atheists first proposed the modern theory of evolution. It was the brainchild of Christians, not atheists.

 

Bob,

You keep trying to sneak theology into science.

One can believe in YEC based on the bible since after all we don't have ALL the facts.

But one's theology does not affect what science shows us.

If you were sick and came to a doctor's office with abdominal pain would you want the doctor to have studied medicine from textbooks at an accredited medical school or would you want him/her to tell you to drink a little wine since that's what Paul told Timothy?

The argument on science is an argument unto itself. The text of Genesis has bearing on someone's beliefs but not on a scientific interpretation of the facts.

Just as you'd want a doctor to be an expert in medicine you'd want a scientist to be an expert in science and its methods. Someone with a degree from a local bible college likely does NOT have a solid background in science. A genetics professor at Harvard may be lost - but I guarantee you he knows science better than the guy from bible college - and thus his conclusions based solely on the facts will be more accurate.

The scientific facts must be judged solely on evidence and not belief. A person's beliefs obviously are not shaped only by facts but by other things - but a person's theology does not change the facts of archeology.

 

I am guessing that is in response to something I said. What was it?

True enough.

Yes it does. Atheist evolutionists "view the data" through lense of "no Genesis, non-God, naturalism". They seek to prop up their "belief" in the doctrines of evolutionism -- as Richard Dawkings points out.

Christians don't start off with that handicap when they are confronted with the same data.

Yes. Because studying the NATURE that God MADE in Gen 1-2:3 is not contrary TO Gen 1-2:3 it is in harmony WITH Gen 1-2:3.

NOTE: I have NEVER had a doctor say "I would GIVE you an asprin IF I believed God created the world in SIX days but since I don't think there IS a God I will give you an antibiotic".

Though evolutionist often like to "tell that story" among their "many stories in evolutionism" as if ANY of it were true.

My Father was a doctor AND a Christian who took the Bible "literally". Never did he claim that "I can not give this medicine because the world was in fact created in SIX days and God rested on the 7th".

NOR did he ever say "you know when they started teaching immunology in Med school all us Christians had to leave the room because WE blieved the world was CREATED by God in SIX days".

Your argument is totally bogus -- and the interesting part is -- you know it.

In the same way - neither biology, or chemistry or physics or calculus or geology NEEDS us to deny that the world was created in SIX days. I can SEE rock formations EVEN though I believe the world was created in six days. I can SEE chemical reactions EVEN though I believe the world was created in SIX days.

But EVEN MORE amazing - I can SEE that ALL proteins inside the cell membrane of LIVING cells are composed of mono-chiral L-Amino acids which makes abiogenesis IMPOSSIBLE.

What is more I CAN SEE that entropy is SEEN as a principle driving biological systems toward decay due to the basic 'innefficiency' of energy transfer and tranformation making molecule-to-brain evolutionism impossible.

I can SEE INCREASED entropy at the local level and KNOW that "aggregating Local INCREASES does not RESULT in the MASSIVE DECREASE" needed by evolutionism.

So my Creationist "beliefs" allow me to freely JUNK the junk science models of evolutionists.

The benefits just keep right on going.

In Christ,

Bob

 

Bob,

"So my Creationist "beliefs" allow me to freely JUNK the junk science models of evolutionists."

Well at least I'm seeing your angle a bit. You assert that science can be interpreted through our religious convictions. I disagree with you here but...

The point I've been trying to make is that many young people are going to see through the YEC arguments IF they really know science.

 

"Usually, even a non-Christian knows something about the earth, the heavens, and the other elements of this world, about the motion and orbit of the stars and even their size and relative positions, about the predictable eclipses of the sun and moon, the cycles of the years and the seasons, about the kinds of animals, shrubs, stones, and so forth, and this knowledge he hold to as being certain from reason and experience. Now, it is a disgraceful and dangerous thing for an infidel to hear a Christian, presumably giving the meaning of Holy Scripture, talking nonsense on these topics; and we should take all means to prevent such an embarrassing situation, in which people show up vast ignorance in a Christian and laugh it to scorn. The shame is not so much that an ignorant individual is derided, but that people outside the household of faith think our sacred writers held such opinions, and, to the great loss of those for whose salvation we toil, the writers of our Scripture are criticized and rejected as unlearned men. If they find a Christian mistaken in a field which they themselves know well and hear him maintaining his foolish opinions about our books, how are they going to believe those books in matters concerning the resurrection of the dead, the hope of eternal life, and the kingdom of heaven, when they think their pages are full of falsehoods and on facts which they themselves have learnt from experience and the light of reason? Reckless and incompetent expounders of Holy Scripture bring untold trouble and sorrow on their wiser brethren when they are caught in one of their mischievous false opinions and are taken to task by those who are not bound by the authority of our sacred books. For then, to defend their utterly foolish and obviously untrue statements, they will try to call upon Holy Scripture for proof and even recite from memory many passages which they think support their position, although they understand neither what they say nor the things about which they make assertion. (bolding mine) [1 Timothy 1.7]"

Saint Augustine De Genesi ad litteram libri duodecim

 

Our job as parents and church members is to help them see through the "Stories" and "myths" in the junk science known as evolutionism.

We can also explain to them that we do not have a video of the six days of creation that could be viewed and "played with" by evolutionists or creationists. So a lot of "discovery" is left to find out HOW the six days of nature's creation have left their mark on nature.

I have two daughters going through public university - taking engineering and thoroughly convinced from the science presented - that creationism is "good science" and evolutionism is 'junk science'. They get a few semesters of physics and chemistry in this deal - and still find that the GOOD science in the classroom has nothing at all to do with the fables and stories of evolutionism.

Now and then a teacher tries to "drag evolutionism" into an otherwise sound lecture - but when they do that it is pretty obvious that this is simply a "Belief" of the teacher and has nothing to do with the SCIENCE that is observable and verifiable.

No need to fear the truth. Good science will never be a problem for a Christian.

In Christ,

Bob