The Elect are Manifested in Repentance and Faith and Good works.

[AustinC]

Once again we have a post of deflection, deception and disparagement, devoid of truth.
James 2:5 is there for all to read, God chooses individuals for salvation who are "rich in faith" and who "love God." Full Stop

Did anyone say being rich in faith or loving God "MERITS" salvation? No, that is the falsehood endless posted to deceive.
Scripture says salvation does not depend on the person who wills or does things to be saved, but upon God alone. See Romans 9:16. This verse teaches the lost can will and work to be saved, something denied by a certain sect, and that such effort on the part of the lost does not result in salvation, which depends on God alone.

Van, I did no deflecting. I specifically addressed James 2 and I showed you your error. I quoted you and highlighted your error. You said, "God chooses individuals for salvation on the basis of being "rich in faith" and those who "love God." Stop being dishonest. Stop teaching merit based salvation and I won't feel obligated to point out your error.

 

[Brightfame52]

Still not addressing the response in Matthew 13 or Matthew 23. Your claim is unbiblical. I addressed Romans 3:11, why not offer a response to biblical truth?

Men naturally dont seek after God Rom 3:11 nor understand God

 

[Brightfame52]

Still ignoring Matthew 13 and Matthew 23. Repeating bogus claims and not acknowledging biblical truth is underwhelming.
To repeat:

Here a verse is cited with the implication that no lost person ever understands the gospel, but Matthew 13 teaches soils #2, 3 and 4 did understand the gospel to a degree and sought God. Then, Matthew 23:13 has lost people seeking God even though "dead" in sin. So Romans 3:11 indicates everyone does not understand or seek God all the time or when sinning.

​

The Gospel is hid permanently to the Lost 2 Cor 4:3-4

3 But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:

4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

One cannot believe believe the Gospel until after they are saved.

 

[37818]

Some Calvinists teach merit based salvation. Some of those who deny faith precedes salvation. Romans 4:5, Romans 10:13-15 and Ephesians 1:12-14. Ephesians 2:8-9.

 

[canadyjd]

canadyjd…
I knew you would, and that's unfortunate because it means you are in the dark as to the Justifying value and property of the Blood of Christ before the Law and Justice of God upon all for whom He died Rom 5:9…..

You are welcome

I am always ready to change my mind based on scripture in context. Since you believe there are different “aspects” to salvation, perhaps you could identify each aspect and use scripture to support your understanding.

Please begin by telling us how many aspects of salvation there are, support each with scripture and then tell us how a person moves through each aspect of salvation to get to the final relationship with God.

I’ll wait patiently in the dark for you to enlighten me.

peace to you

 

[AustinC]

Some Calvinists teach merit based salvation. Some of those who deny faith precedes salvation. Romans 4:5, Romans 10:13-15 and Ephesians 1:12-14. Ephesians 2:8-9.

Exegete each of your cited verses and explain how they teach faith comes before God quickens. I eagerly await your exegesis of each verse for us.

 

[Brightfame52]

I am always ready to change my mind based on scripture in context. Since you believe there are different “aspects” to salvation, perhaps you could identify each aspect and use scripture to support your understanding.

Please begin by telling us how many aspects of salvation there are, support each with scripture and then tell us how a person moves through each aspect of salvation to get to the final relationship with God.

I’ll wait patiently in the dark for you to enlighten me.

peace to you

Well, Scripture says Christ died for people, He died for their sins, He put away their sins, so they are Justified by His Death/Blood Rom 5:8-9

8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.

9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.

According to Vs 9 how were they Justified ?


The Atonement of Christ: What did it REALLY Achieve ?7

There are 6 previous threads on the same subject, I

 

[canadyjd]

Well, Scripture says Christ died for people, He died for their sins, He put away their sins, so they are Justified by His Death/Blood Rom 5:8-9

8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.

9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.

According to Vs 9 how were they Justified ?


The Atonement of Christ: What did it REALLY Achieve ?7

There are 6 previous threads on the same subject, I

Ok, are you saying the first aspect of salvation is that all people are justified by the death of Jesus and that by His death all people have their sins paid for and are justified before God? In this aspect of salvation, the only thing necessary is to exist as a human being?

peace to you

 

[37818]

Ok, are you saying the first aspect of salvation is that all people are justified by the death of Jesus and that by His death all people have their sins paid for and are justified before God? In this aspect of salvation, the only thing necessary is to exist as a human being?

peace to you

Sounds like the other is teaching universalism.

 

[37818]

It is some Calvinists who make false claims of universalism and accusations of justification by one's works for salvation.

 

[Martin Marprelate]

I beleve that it is more accurate to say that the elect are saved (by grace) through repentance and faith and are then manifested by good works.
I do not believe that anyone will be found in heaven who has not repented and trusted in Christ for the forgiveness of his sins.

Do you?

 

[Brightfame52]

Ok, are you saying the first aspect of salvation is that all people are justified by the death of Jesus and that by His death all people have their sins paid for and are justified before God? In this aspect of salvation, the only thing necessary is to exist as a human being?

peace to you

Nope, You dont pay attention. I have explained in my thread

 

[AustinC]

It is some Calvinists who make false claims of universalism and accusations of justification by one's works for salvation.

Not false claims.
You refuse to truly evaluate your open contradictions and instead get upset when your contradictions are exposed. That's entirely on you.
I am still waiting for your exegesis of the Bible passages you sited. Why do you refuse to exegete God's word to explain why you are not contradicting yourself?

 

[canadyjd]

Nope, You dont pay attention. I have explained in my thread

Ok, I am asking for clarification. You stated there were different aspects to salvation and at least one aspect of salvation did not require faith in Jesus Christ. I asked you to clarify and you quoted passages on justification.

So, does a person in the aspect of salvation that gives justification before God need faith in Jesus?

These are the terms you have used to explain your position that faith is not required for a certain aspect of salvation.

Since I disagree with you, you have stated I am in the dark. I am simply attempting to understand how a person can have salvation (the right relationship with God) without faith in Jesus

peace to you

 

[AustinC]

It's interesting how @37818 laughs when people ask him to exegete scripture that he references.
It seems the scripture he referenced doesn't teach what he teaches.

 

[Van]

Men naturally dont seek after God Rom 3:11 nor understand God

Why did soil #2 receive the gospel with joy? Your claims are fictions.

 

[Van]

The Gospel is hid permanently to the Lost 2 Cor 4:3-4

3 But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:
4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

One cannot believe believe the Gospel until after they are saved.

Matthew 13 and Matthew 23.

To repeat:
Here a verse is cited with the implication that no lost person ever understands the gospel, but Matthew 13 teaches soils #2, 3 and 4 did understand the gospel to a degree and sought God. Then, Matthew 23:13 has lost people seeking God even though "dead" in sin. So Romans 3:11 indicates everyone does not understand or seek God all the time or when sinning.​

 

[AustinC]

Why did soil #2 receive the gospel with joy? Your claims are fictions.

Why have so many people joined a church when they aren't saved? Here's the answer that Judas exhibited and many others have emulated: $$$$ ££££

 

[Van]

Why have so many people joined a church when they aren't saved? Here's the answer that Judas exhibited and many others have emulated: $$$$ ££££

Yet another ignore biblical truth and change the subject post, the sine quo non of advocates of falsehood.

Why did soil #2 receive the gospel with joy?

The answer is the bible teaches the lost can understand and affirmatively response to spiritual milk, the fundamentals of the gospel.

 

[Brightfame52]

Why did soil #2 receive the gospel with joy? Your claims are fictions.

He received it naturally, not with spiritual understanding like soil #3 who received it with a good regenerated heart and bare fruit like faith Matt 13:23

23 But he that received seed into the good ground is he that heareth the word, and understandeth it; which also beareth fruit, and bringeth forth, some an hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.

So the good soil is the only one that receives the Gospel and understand it and is converted.

The other received it naturally and superficially and without understanding spiritually.

So it still stands, man naturally not only seeks God, nor does he understand God spiritually. In fact the word for understandeth in Matt 13:23

its the same word for understand in Rom 3:11

There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.

But notice Jesus didnt say the one who received it with joy understood it, because he wasnt regenerated. Jesus said he had a stony heart, thats a hard heart.

So men not born again can sometimes with their natural reason agree with the Truths of the Gospel, but it falls short of spiritual conversion, and sooner or later they shall fall away.