About systematizing doctrines, I guess Paul was wrong, eh ? He tried to systematize why children of God believe to the Romans.
Well, if we really ever get to heaven, I guess we can look him up and say that to his face, right ?
The route to Calvinism
Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by dwmoeller1, Mar 9, 2007.
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pinoybaptist Active MemberSite Supporter
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That was not my point that because it's found in teachings and articles it is less trustworthy. It's when Scripture is read through this lens it becomes a problem.
Have you ever considered the non cal position to be true, too, for the same reason you mention?
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Is this one?
Proverbs 16:9
In his heart a man plans his course,
but the LORD determines his steps.
Maybe this one?
Proverbs 19:21
Many are the plans in a man's heart,
but is it the LORD's purposes that prevails.
This one?
Daniel 4: 35
All the peoples of the earth are regarded as nothing.
He does as he pleases with the powers of heaven
and the peoples of the earth.
No one can hold back his hand or say to him:
"What have you done?"
Or this?
Lamentations 3: 37
Who can speak and have it happen if the LORD has not decreed it?
Or is it here?
Acts 17: 26
From one man he made every nation of men, that they should inhabit the whole earth; and he determined the times set for them and the exact places where they should live.
As a Calvinist, I find my Bible makes more sense when I give God the glory He alone deserves as the Sovereign Lord over His creation. -
oops, double post.
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Many of what you have put forth has been debated countless times here. It would do well to do a search in the old calvinism / arminianism forum from a couple years back. -
But God's ways are above our ways. -
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I used christian sources for the defination of elect. -
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Why do we need to "get it all" from day one of our Christian life?
The apostle Paul prayed for the Colossians that they would be filled with the knowledge of His will through all spiritual wisdom and understanding(Col. 1: 9).
Did he mean for God's Spirit to accomplish this in one sermon or study?
I doubt it.
So as we study, we grow in our understanding.
As we pray with humility we change our beliefs to reflect our current understandings.
As we spread the gospel, we gain wisdom into God's will.
God's will is obviously that not all Christians believe and understand the Bible the same way. These theological differences serve His purposes for as long as He sees fit to ordain them.
I think there are several instances in the NT that show that God's will is that we make mistakes or have gaps in our theology.
Peter needed to be corrected.
Apollos needed more teaching from Aquilla and Priscilla.
Perhaps even Simon the Sorceror was genuine in his search after being rebuked by Peter.
I also want to say that our sinful natures and immature spirits can also prevent us from reaching a true understanding of passages.
Please note that I am not saying that Calvinists are less sinful or more mature than other believers, but sin affects all areas, including our ability to be teachable. -
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Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.-Matthew 7 21-23
And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats: And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left. Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world: For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in: Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me. Then shall the righteous answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, and fed thee? or thirsty, and gave thee drink? When saw we thee a stranger, and took thee in? or naked, and clothed thee? Or when saw we thee sick, or in prison, and came unto thee? And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me. Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels: For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not. Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee? Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me. And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.-Matthew 25 32-46 -
I'm a new guy, so I'm getting in late in this thread, but by reading the Bible and using plain interpretations wherever possible, and realising that all scriptures fit together like puzzle pieces sometimes (all are valid, from the Lord), I found it easy to believe in the Predestinarian way.
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John of Japan Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
Your comparison of the CvA argument with the arguments about baptismal regeneration are spurious. Both sides should end up doing evangelism in the same way, while the Campellite view of salvation is a heresy that sends people to Hell.
Those who believe we have to understand the sovereignity of God or we can't be good Christians end up arguing endlessly about the subject as an intellectual exercise. That is not profitable to believers, IMO. :type: -
Don't you think this is kind of a ridiculous statement you made? -
I still disagree with that.
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