as you used it...for as you said..
What did you mean by hate??????
The "World"
Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Rippon, Feb 22, 2007.
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I'm done with the games, James. I answered you already.
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It seems like Hank believes God is really God. I agree Hank...He is God and can do as He pleases -
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Biblical common sense 101:
1. God cannot sin:
James 1:13 Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:
2. God "kills", "slays" people for their sin.
Genesis 38:10 And the thing which he did displeased the LORD: wherefore he slew him also.
3) God kills, slays people and nations (Sodom and Gomorrah) and even the whole world (except for Noah and those on the ark) and yet He does not sin by doing so.
HankD -
Please notice Israel asking...
Wherein hast thou loved us?
Wherein hast thou loved us?
Israel is saying...I do not feel you God do love us. Show me where you loved us. PROVE IT GOD!!!
And God said...Was not Esau Jacob's brother? saith the LORD: yet I loved Jacob, And I hated Esau,
That sounds like proof to me. :)
If it is anything other then hate, it makes no sense.
Was not Esau Jacob's brother? saith the LORD: yet I loved Jacob, And I hated Esau,
sane ....used as>> hate 136, enemies 3, enemy 2, foes 1, hateful 1, mis
No "love less" ...or not like as much.
every English Bible claims it. Every Hebrew claims it. Will you change it to fit your doctrine?
Wherein hast thou loved us?
will it be the Calvinist that changes the meaning...or will you?
My guess it will be you -
http://lincolnstandard.com/main.asp?SectionID=26&SubSectionID=301&ArticleID=705&TM=74674.59 -
Hello HankD.
About God's emotions. I would not judge God's emotions as I judge men's. When He says He is angry I believe it to be anger. The joy in Heaven is His not the angels. For God to repent, as we use the word, is a change of mind. This is one thing God never does and conflicts with scripture. It must be modified away or scripture falls.
john. -
Genesis 6
6 And it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.
7 And the LORD said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them.
What other way can this be taken than God was sorry He created man?
Either way, as you say, to reject what this passage in Genesis is plainly saying would cause Scripture to fall.
And many other passages.
Personally, I really don't care what any Systematic Theology says or Calvin or any other man.
Again:
To be sure I am at a loss to explain how this can be since God is Almighty and omni-everything but I don't want to explain it away or assign some euphamism to the choice of words of the Holy Spirit.
I realize that Scripture on occassion appears to contradict itself:
Malachi 3:6 For I am the LORD, I change not; therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed.
Notice it says "I change not".
So, as a place perhaps of a meeting ground: God repents (apart from repentance for sin) but in His repentance somehow His essential nature remains the same and does not change in spite of the repentance.
From Strong's:
Repent 5162
nacham {naw-kham'}
Meaning:
1) to be sorry, console oneself, repent, regret, comfort, be comforted 1a) (Niphal) 1a1) to be sorry, be moved to pity, have compassion 1a2) to be sorry, rue, suffer grief, repent 1a3) to comfort oneself, be comforted 1a4) to comfort oneself, ease oneself 1b) (Piel) to comfort, console 1c) (Pual) to be comforted, be consoled 1d) (Hithpael) 1d1) to be sorry, have compassion 1d2) to rue, repent of 1d3) to comfort oneself, be comforted 1d4) to ease oneself
I realize that reams of paper (and now electrons) have been written to change the meaning of this word when it comes to God's character.
Also some folks seem infuriated at the fact that the Scripture plainly assigns "hate" and "anger" to God and go to no small length in attempt to rewrite the Scripture:
Psalm 5:5 The foolish shall not stand in thy sight: thou hatest all workers of iniquity.
This simply cannot be made to say "love less" IMO.
Jeremiah 7:20 Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, mine anger and my fury shall be poured out upon this place, upon man, and upon beast, and upon the trees of the field, and upon the fruit of the ground; and it shall burn, and shall not be quenched.
Does thus saith the Lord GOD have no meaning anymore? He Himself speaks of His anger and fury with no mincing of words here and elsewhere.
However, since it seems so common a theme (God having this ability as well as a capacity of emotion) in the Scripture, I'm fully inclined to accept it without question.
HankD -
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Miseo
to hate, pursue with hatred, detest
to be hated, detested
KJV (42) - hate, 41; hateful, 1;
NAS (40) - hate, 13; hated, 12; hateful, 1; hates, 12; hating, 2;
The LORD gave and the LORD has taken away; may the name of the LORD be praised.
john. -
Psalm 5
5 The foolish shall not stand in thy sight: thou hatest all workers of iniquity.
6 Thou shalt destroy them that speak leasing: the LORD will abhor the bloody and deceitful man.
It is His right to destroy those whom He hates and in particular the workers of iniquity.
But He is also merciful and gives the opportunity for repentance before the destruction.
Revelation 2
20 Notwithstanding I have a few things against thee, because thou sufferest that woman Jezebel, which calleth herself a prophetess, to teach and to seduce my servants to commit fornication, and to eat things sacrificed unto idols.
21 And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not.
22 Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds.
23 And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts: and I will give unto every one of you according to your works.
He doesn't mince words about it either.
HankD -
Therefore, world has various meanings, some of which Calvinists have defined beyond even the frame of context. For instance, 1John 2:2 "And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.[/quote] "Whole world" here is not just the "elect" nor just the "elect from all the world." There is NO basis in context for making such an application.
skypair -
The argument that God is not under His own law is foolish. God's laws are just, holy and righteous, all characteristics of God. If God were to break His own laws to men and requirements, He would not only be a hypocrite, but not God.
Let me ask you all this...could Christ, who is God, have broken the very laws He set forth in stating whoever hates is a murderer? He is 100% God and Man, so if God does not need to follow His own laws He sets forth, does that mean Christ wouldn't be sinning if He commited adultery (lust) and murder (hate)? -
To hate someone is to pass judgment on them. God is entitled to do that. We are not. We can hate what someone does, but we dare not hate the person.
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So what judgment was passed onto Esau before He was born? I don't recall that Esau went to hell.
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