If one believes in irresistable grace then Jesus was not God because Judas rebelled.
Too free or not too free, that is the question.
Discussion in '2005 Archive' started by King James Bond, Oct 31, 2005.
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Larry;
If these gentiles were glad then they believed before.
This verse does not stand on anything but the fact they were saved to. This is the subject and obviously they weren't sure, so when they heard, they were glad they weren't left out. As far as support for being Ordained first it doesn't say if they were or not That's just your input. You first claimed the chronology of the verse because the word ordained appeared first That this shows that we are ordained first.
This is what you originally claimed;
Cassidy;
It's funny You don't have anything I'm affraid of, or avoid.
In The Light Of Christ;
Mike -
ILUVLIGHT,
Do you have trouble reading?
When the Gentiles heard this, they were very glad and thanked the Lord for his message; and all who were appointed to eternal life became believers. (NLT)
When the Gentiles heard this, they were glad and honored the word of the Lord; and all who were appointed for eternal life believed. (NIV)
When the Gentiles heard this, they began rejoicing and glorifying the word of the Lord; and as many as had been appointed to eternal life believed. (NASB)
And when the Gentiles heard this, they rejoiced and glorified (praised and gave thanks for) the Word of God; and as many as were destined (appointed and ordained) to eternal life believed (adhered to, trusted in, and relied on Jesus as the Christ and their Savior). (AMP)
This message made the Gentiles glad, and they praised what they had heard about the Lord. Everyone who had been chosen for eternal life then put their faith in the Lord. (CEV)
And when the Gentiles heard this, they began rejoicing and glorifying the word of the Lord, and as many as were appointed to eternal life believed. (ESV)
Now when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad and glorified the word of the Lord. And as many as had been appointed to eternal life believed. (NKJV)
And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad and glorified the Word of the Lord; and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed. (K21)
And as the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of God: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed. (ASV)
And the Gentiles, hearing this, were glad and gave glory to the word of God: and those marked out by God for eternal life had faith. (BBE)
And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed. (KJV) (WBS)
The Gentiles listened with delight and extolled the Lord's Message; and all who were pre-destined to the Life of the Ages believed. (WEY)
And the nations hearing were glad, and were glorifying the word of the Lord, and did believe -- as many as were appointed to life age-during; (YLT)
Are you really going to tell Larry that is not clear?
KJB -
Jarhed, Learn to format your posts properly.
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On this post, i was trying to respond to jarhed and apparently hit edit instead. His post is found in the quotes. Sorry Jarhed.
[ November 03, 2005, 02:04 PM: Message edited by: Pastor Larry ] -
[qutoe]You first claimed the chronology of the verse because the word ordained appeared first That this shows that we are ordained first.
This is what you originally claimed;[/quote]Where did I claim anything about word order? -
Larry;
Mike -
Come on guys you are fishing for reasons to prove LArry wrong, if you continue to read he clarifies the greek wording, by saying it is the tense that decides what comes first, quit ignoring the stuff that makes your argument incorrect. Larry did not say what you are atrributing to him.
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Timothy27;
In The Light Of Christ;
Mike -
Only if you ignore what he is saying in his posts.
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Mike </font>[/QUOTE]This appears to be an honest mistake on your part due to unclear wording on my part. However, the subsequent posts about grammer did clear this up and apparently you missed it.
Go back and think about what was said. The point I made had nothing to do with word order. You misread it. I wasn't wrong. In the verse, the ordaining precedes the belief in terms of grammar, not word order.
Sorry you misunderstood. But you should have learned from seeing it clarified in subsequent posts.
You can't argue word order from Greek (or any language for that matter). Verb tense determine priority of action. -
Larry;
It cracks me up that you find it necessary to blame me for your mistake.
Your subsequent post.
In The Light Of Christ;
Mike -
ILUVLIGHT,
You may really have a problem of reading things backwards. I would have yourself checked out real soon.
I forgot what the name of the disorder is.
Try again;
When the Gentiles heard this, they were very glad and thanked the Lord for his message; and all who were appointed to eternal life became believers. (NLT)
When the Gentiles heard this, they were glad and honored the word of the Lord; and all who were appointed for eternal life believed. (NIV)
When the Gentiles heard this, they began rejoicing and glorifying the word of the Lord; and as many as had been appointed to eternal life believed. (NASB)
And when the Gentiles heard this, they rejoiced and glorified (praised and gave thanks for) the Word of God; and as many as were destined (appointed and ordained) to eternal life believed (adhered to, trusted in, and relied on Jesus as the Christ and their Savior). (AMP)
This message made the Gentiles glad, and they praised what they had heard about the Lord. Everyone who had been chosen for eternal life then put their faith in the Lord. (CEV)
And when the Gentiles heard this, they began rejoicing and glorifying the word of the Lord, and as many as were appointed to eternal life believed. (ESV)
Now when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad and glorified the word of the Lord. And as many as had been appointed to eternal life believed. (NKJV)
And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad and glorified the Word of the Lord; and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed. (K21)
And as the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of God: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed. (ASV)
And the Gentiles, hearing this, were glad and gave glory to the word of God: and those marked out by God for eternal life had faith. (BBE)
And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed. (KJV) (WBS)
The Gentiles listened with delight and extolled the Lord's Message; and all who were pre-destined to the Life of the Ages believed. (WEY)
And the nations hearing were glad, and were glorifying the word of the Lord, and did believe -- as many as were appointed to life age-during; (YLT)
My wife is Pilipina and in Tagalog it says the same thing. I will check with my Mexican friend and see if it is saying the same thing in Spanish.
I have provided a few English versions for you.
It is clearly saying people that were ordained by God to be believers, believed! It would be very fair to conclude that all the other people did not believe.
Which people did not believe?
All those not appointed by God to eternal life did not believe.
Hope that helps you out!
KJB -
How does that compute with coming to Christ with the trust of a little child? They dont have to read the original manuscripts or to know Greek to be able to place their trust in Christ do they? If Christ causes one to hunger and thirst for Him and they submit to Him as a bondslave its a pretty sure thing that person was chosen before the foundation of the world to be one of Christ's own!!
Now, according to your " those who belive were appointed" that surely gets the cart before the horse as we who are appointed to eternal life will at the given time believe!! -
I have snipped the insulting personal attack regarding rings in noses and Catholic nonsense as it is beneath notice. -
TCassidy,
Your presupposition leads you to believe that the words, 'as many as were disposed to eternal life, believed,' suggesting that they only believed in Jesus because He ordained them for this lot in life.
No, what the scholars mean is that the Holy Spirit disposed people to either reject or to received Christ. Those, obviously, who believed in Acts 13:48 welcomed His grace and were saved having become the elect ones and worthy, through Christ, as receiving eternal life.
A disposition to believe comes from the ministry of the Holy Spirit and in finality by the movement of the human will to receive Him. Every sinner has a free will and has a human volition. When sinners hear the Gospel they are called on by God to decide where they want to spend eternity. -
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Ray,
I think I have asked you before and I will ask you again;
Can God save babies that are from one day to lets say 4 years old? Yes or no?
What do the babies have to do to be saved?
Yes, I do have a ring in my nose...and I thank God it is His ring in my nose.
2BHizown,
As usual you make a great post.
TCassidy,
Amen!
KJB -
You said, 'Can God save babies that are from one day to lets say 4 years old? Yes or no?'
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