Why God calls some and passes by others, even though He desires all to be saved and all are totally depraved, is beyond human reason.
When the Bible Blows Your Mind
Discussion in '2003 Archive' started by Monergist, Jun 6, 2003.
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But the whole supposition to begin with is from human reason :D
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God choses some, Eph.1:6 "to the praise of the glory of His grace," Eph.1:12 "to the praise of His glory." Eph.1"14 "to the praise of His glory.
God's glory is the supreme purpose of redemption.
mike -
Eric,
You are right, I can't believe I let that go by. I've been gone for a week and I must have missed that one. Thanks for backing me up. I notice that no one even attempted to answer you.
Revealing. ;)
and hardened their heart.... </font>[/QUOTE]Tim,
This is my point. The only time that scripture speaks of man's inablity to believe is in regard to God's hardening. Do you equate hardening with Total Depravity? If so, you have some problems. Hardening is something that occurs after one hears the truth and rejects it. Total Depravity is from birth and claims that man cannot even understand the truth of God. Hardening teaches that man understands the truth but rejects it thus becoming hardened. Plus, the judicial hardening of Israel is temporary according to Paul in Romans 11. Is Total Depravity temporary?
Please explain. -
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Plus, if you read the entire passage you will see that the things that the "natural man" cannot understand are the "deep things of God" (vs 10) not the basic gospel. If it were the basic gospel message that they could not understand then the people Paul is writing to in Corith must have been lost because Paul tells them "they were not able to recieve it" either.
Plus, this passage is about what one understands once the Spirit has indwelled them. It says nothing about the means by which the Spirit indwells them. Gal. 3 tells us the answer to that question, "the promised Spirit comes through faith."
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Man starts out depraved, from birth.
Man hears the truth, rejects the truth, and his heart is darkened. (See Romans 1)
In some way, God hardens those whom He chooses to. There are some things here that I don't clearly understand, as I posted earlier. But God does harden hearts (the hearers from John 12 of which Isaiah foretold, Pharoah, etc.) for His own purposes and glory.
Depravity is a condition; hardening is an action, resulting in a further condition. That's how they're differnt. -
Pharoah is the clearest example of this. He, of his own free will, decided that he would not let the Israelites go, yet God also hardened him. Why? God sealed Pharoah in his stubborn condition so that the first few plagues wouldn't convince him to let the people go too early. God wanted his power to be displayed through the plagues and didn't want Pharoah to change his mind too soon, so He hardened his heart. The assured that Pharoah would not see the light even despite the very obvious display of God's power.
The same is true of the Israelites. They (for the most part) had decided by their own freewill to reject God despite the fact that God longed to save them (Matt 23:37). God hardened them in that stubbornness so that even the awesome miracles and very convincing teaching of the Christ would not persuade them. Why? Because God was using the Jews to accomplish His purpose. One, the crucifixtion. Two, the ingrafting of the Gentiles. I hope that clears it up a little bit for you.
Why does the scripture clearly indicate that had they not been hardened they might have seen, heard, believed and turned to God for healing if indeed they were born "Total Depraved???" :confused: -
Brother Bill,
I would like to read your definition of: Repentance, Regeneration, Faith. What is the difference between repentance and regeneration? Which one comes first? What would you say man is capable of doing by himself: repent, believe (having saving faith in Christ) and be born again? Which one do you see as an act of God and which one is the act of man?
Waiting....
I enjoy your postings!!!
Pardi
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