I think I am with you on this, in fact, I have spoke of this before here and else where, except for what you say here. The creator and the maker are the same, but it sounds as if you are making them two different things. Could you explain better how being a creator and maker can be different?
Whose Son is YHVH, the Christ?
Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by Seve, Aug 15, 2012.
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So the bottom-line..... the apologizers here believe that God is one in Number. It’s a belief that even the Jews, Oneness people and the Unitarians could relate to. Whereas, I believe God is one in Unity. The Elohim (The plural of Eloah, God), who is one (Echad) in Unity.
Deuteronomy 6:4 attests to this fact: “Hear, O Israel: The LORD (YHVH or Jehovah) our God (Elohim, plural referring to the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost, who were all individually called God), is ONE (united) LORD.
For example...
ONE IN UNITY is used in the case of Gen. 2:24, when the husband and wife were called ONE by God. How can the two in number, be One?
This is possible only in the sense of UNITY. We can understand John 10:30 in this sense, “I and my Father are one.” One in Unity not in number. It is also in this sense that the thousands can be one like the builders of the tower of Babel in Gen 11:6. Even the millions of Christians can be one in this sense according to John 17:21.
The use of “ECHAD” of Genesis 2:24 best explains the “ECHAD” of Deuteronomy 6:4. Therefore, when Moses said that the husband and wife (TWO BEINGS) would become “ECHAD” (one), that is a “collective one” of two beings.” If that is “collective one” of TWO BEINGS, why would you assume that Moses’ usage of “ECHAD” in Deut. 6:4 is a “collective one” of ONE BEING?
When Moses applied “collective one” to God in Deut. 6:4 it was applied to MORE THAN ONE ENTITY. Otherwise, it was an erroneous usage for Moses since “collective one” can only be applied to more than one entity.
I don’t have any problem with the three Persons and in ONE God (Collective ONE, that is). But the issue is this:
Did the Bible say that the BEING of the Son is the SAME BEING of the Father and of the Holy Spirit since the traditional view says God exist as three distinct persons but not separate persons?
I don't think so. -
Thinkingstuff Active Member
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Create (ex-nihilo) - God, the Father, thru the power of his logos.... create things from nothing.
Making / Forming - physically making up things from already existing matters.
Example: Insertions are mine for presentation only....
Genesis 2:4 These [are] the generations of the heavens and of the earth when they were created (by the Father thru the power of his logos), in the day that the LORD God (Son) made the earth and the heavens, (thru the palm of his hands)
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Scripture says No man knows the name of Almighty God Father even to this date, until one overcometh in the end - only then the name would be written and revealed as promised by the Son.
Look and read:
Revelation 3
12 Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name.
IF YHVH is the Father himself, then Jesus is only pulling our legs -- promising to reveal the name of his God... when it is already documented in the Scripture (OT). Would that be the case, of course not .... unless of course, in addition, all of you have already overcometh the end of this world?
Ephesians 3
14 For this cause I bow my knees unto the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, v15 Of whom the whole family in heaven and earth is named,
Revelation 19
12 His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, THAT NO MAN KNEW, but he himself.
13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.
Based on the above Scripture..... No one knows the name of the invisible Almighty Father, at this time.... and I agree.
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Jesus is God made visible.
Jesus was with God in the beginning.
I believe Jesus was God made visible from the beginning.
Colossians 1:15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation.
From what I gather from your posts, it sounds as if we have the same beliefs about this. If that is the case, then I am glad to meet someone with whom I can study this more. -
And may the good Lord share you more wisdom and understanding of the knowledge of him. God Bless
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In His love,
Moriah -
NOT 3 seperate Gods in agreement
NOT one God who has 3 modes he manifests Himself in! -
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Note: Insertion is mine for presentation.
Psalms 110:1 The LORD said unto my (David's) Lord, Sit thou at my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool.
Who was David's Lord in the Old Testament... when he had this prophetic vision above, YHVH?
If so, who was the LORD... asking David's Lord (YHVH) of Old, to sit down on his right hand ..... ?
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The Biblicist Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
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The Biblicist Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
Originally Posted by Seve
Correct, the invisible Almighty God Father is a Spirit that NEVER change - no physical shape or form... whatsoever. -
However, in response to your querry above regarding Mal 3:6...about YHVH righteousness that changes not.... Please do not combine apples and oranges. It's a prophesy that took place in the OT... fulfilled in the NT.
I suggest that you read the entire context of your own cited text again.... in order for you to understand the the Lord YHVH was referring to his own attributes of mercy .... to fulfill his covenant of promise to the sons of Jacob... redemption and mercy.... will be open to those who will return back to him after repenting their sins... The covenant or promise will never change.... and redemption will come in the new testament.
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The Biblicist Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
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seve
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The Biblicist Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
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Okay, this will be tha last time I am going to clarify my position... based on your distoreted premises.... for the sake of others and for the sake of exposing what I believe to be blatant dishonesty on your part.
Next time, I will not respond to any distorted premises, except make a notation on it..... therefore, do not even waste your time posting.
Again, I ask you to read my previous post (below) very s-l-o-w-l-y regarding this same matter.
Besides, the context of the cited text indicate that he (YHVH) is the only God physically FORMED for us to worship and witness.... NOT that they should worship graven images, idols or pagan gods.
Again, try to listen to other' rather than pretending to be a smart person that you are not. :BangHead:
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Thinkingstuff Active Member
For instance God begins to be simply known as Elohim or God emphasis on power. Genesis 1:1. Then he's revealed as Adonai emphasising Lordship. Then he's revealed as YHWH referencing Salvation then he's revealed as Maccaddeshem or sanctifier, then he's revealed as Rohi or our shepherd, then he's revealed as Jireh or our provider and with each instance of him interacting with his people and they discover more about God they apply a new title. Thus in revelation when a new title is given for his greatness and salvation that is applied to those who are his. That's why it is a new name rather than an unknown name.
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