You know, I watched that episode of Larry King (yeah, I know you're wondering how someone with no TV watches Larry King) and I really just felt embarrassed for her pastor.
All of us have gotten caught asleep at the switch, approving somebody for church membership who shouldn't have been, approving a baptismal candidate who shouldn't have been baptised, failing to discipline somebody who should have been disciplined, etc, so I couldn't really point a finger at him for that.
But I really would have been impressed with him if he had said, "I'm the pastor and so the buck stops with me. When Jennifer asked to be made a part of our church, we sincerely believed that she showed all of the signs of true, Biblical repentance and faith in Christ and His atonement on the cross on her behalf and met the Biblical criteria for church membership. Based on that, we chose to make her a member of our church. In the same way, we believed that she met all of the criteria of a baptismal candidate and so chose to baptise her.
However, I now understand that we were disobedient to God's word and sinned against Jennifer when we failed to exercise Biblical discipline, even though we were aware of he ongoing and unrepentant sin.
We have repented before God, both as a congregation and as the leadership of _______ Church. We, the leadership, have apologized to the church body. And now, on behalf of the church, I would like to apologize to Jennifer and ask for her forgiveness for failing to show her the love and care for her and her spiritual well being by failing to try to restore her to a right relationship with God through discipline and a call for her to repent for her sin."
Would You Let a Known Lesbian Perform at Your Church???
Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by righteousdude2, Apr 24, 2010.
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JohnDeereFan Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
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1 John 5:16-17, "Anyone who sees his brother sinning, if the sin is not deadly, should petition God, and thus life will be given to the sinner. This is only for those whose sin is not deadly. There is such a thing as a deadly sin; I do not say that one should pray about that. True, all wrongdoing is sin, but not all sin is deadly."
Matthew 26:24 (New International Version)
24The Son of Man will go just as it is written about him. But woe to that man who betrays the Son of Man! It would be better for him if he had not been born."
Peace! -
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Well sure there are different degrees of sin. Murder is clearly a worse sin than shoplifting.
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Thinkingstuff Active Member
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Thinkingstuff Active Member
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Thinkingstuff Active Member
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Remember, the "books" are compared to the "book of life." This is not a judgment for salvation, but for condemnation.
No Roman Catholic would agree with my position on this. -
Thinkingstuff Active Member
Most evangelicals only make the distinction that the works which we do are rewarded by crowns fewer works, fewer crowns but as far as level of sins all sins are purged in the attoning sacrifice of Jesus Christ and once we drop this body it (sins) no longer is relevant. -
So a Catholic would agree in part, but not totally, and not substantively. The Catholics are right on some things. It's the things they are wrong on that are the issue.
But note your inconsistency. You argue that believers have degrees of reward, but unbelievers don't have degrees of punishment. That makes no sense, particularly given the biblical revelation on this. -
Thinkingstuff Active Member
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Is your argument that unbelievers don't go to the lake of fire or that Satan and unbelievers are punished equally even though Satan is more culpable? -
Thinkingstuff Active Member
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I think you have talked yourself into a rather uncomfortable position.
If God punishes Satan equally to unbelievers, even though Satan is more culpable, then God is not just. If God does not punish them equally, then you have established my point.
While you are thinking about that, think about this:
In Luke 12:47-48, JEsus teaches that those with greater knowledge receive greater punishment; those with less knowledge receive less punishment, though they still receive punishment.
In Matt 11:22, Jesus says it will be more tolerable for Tyre and Sidon in the day of judgment than for the people in Chorazin and Bethsaida.
In Luke 20:47, he says that the scribes will receive greater condemnation.
So I think it is pretty clear that Jesus taught degrees of punishment, isn't it? -
Thinkingstuff Active Member
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Thinkingstuff Active Member
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