Featured can One Be Charasmatic And NOT Be In Word of faith?

You are referring to Jude 1:20. Let me say this. I just finished preaching through the Book of Jude last September. I started in the beginning of February. It took me 8 months to preach through those 25 verses. There is no commentary that I came across anywhere that suggest what you are suggesting. Jude does not suggest anything about praying in tongues. Everyone of us are commanded to pray in the Holy Spirit. One of the best and most well written articles on that passage was by Spurgeon:

Others said the same thing, but far more succinct--as in one or two sentences.

First, you DO speak gibberish.
Second, gibberish is not a gift of God, you just are deceived in thinking it is. For 1900 years no one spoke this gibberish except pagans and cults. It is not a Christian practice.
God does know every language. Gibberish is not a language, not even by the most advanced and scholarly linguistics standards. It is proven that it is simply nonsense syllables run together. No one can understand that which is completely incomprehensible, not even God.
You have blind faith, not in God, but in the gibberish that you speak, that it is from God, when it is not.

No one called gibberish praying in the spirit.
No one called speaking in languages praying in the spirit either.
On both counts you are wrong.
Furthermore, ALL gifts were given for the edification of the ENTIRE body.
Do you think God would give you the gift of healing, for example, to go home and heal yourself, just yourself! In the same way speaking other languages was never intended for your own private use. It was to the edification of the entire body.

I have shown you scripture. You keep on rejecting it. What was the gift that was given on the Day of Pentecost? It was tongues. That was the miracle. They spoke in other languages. They knew what they were saying, otherwise they couldn't speak it. For example if they were going to recite Psalm 8 or comment on it in Arabic, they would have to think in Arabic first in order to express themselves before opening their mouths. That was the ability that God gave them.

What do you think "gift of languages" mean. If I, as a missionary, were given the gift of languages, then I wouldn't have to learn the language of the country I go to, correct? Think it through.

You get hung up on those 25 cent words like utterance and manifestation don't you. You need more simple language that you can understand.

Acts 2:4 They were all filled with the Holy Spirit, and began to speak with other languages, as the Spirit gave them the ability to speak. WEB
"utterance" = "the ability to speak"
They had the ability to speak the language that God gave them; the ability to understand and therefore speak.

There were always two language groups present.
Paul preached in synagogues.
It was a sign to the Jews (one language group) -Hebrew)
In a city like Corinth there were often people traveling from other nations where they may not have spoken Greek--another language group. Tongues would be spoken for their sake and translated back into Greek.

Gibberish is the devil's gift. Why do you persist in speaking it?

I stand on the Word of God. Tongues ceased. What you speak no one can understand. It is pure gibberish.

He already has.

Verse two is a rebuke to those that have the ability to speak in tongues or languages. He tells them don't do it.

But you don't get interpretation. What languages do you speak in?

Where does it say you can heal in private, do miracles in private, etc.
Every gift was given for the edification of the entire body.

Not a single verse have you given me.

You deny 1900 years of Christian history and put your trust in a movement that started in 1905, a movement that started to speak gibberish back then, a phenomena known only to paganism and extreme cults. And then you try to convince us that it is of God. Do you know how ridiculous that sounds??

 

Actually it does. Babblings are not the tongues of the NT. What you have described of your experience does not line up with tongues as a language as in the NT.

You may be sincere, but I believe you are sincerely wrong.

 

I have never studied out the prosperity teachings, so I can not say what I believe on that!
I do believe that healing is part of the cross! Spiritual, mental and physical!

 

There are many prayers in the spirit...tongues being one of them! You can not ignore that Paul called it praying in the spirit in 1 Cor. He also said tongues was praying to God. Also it edifies us! So it does not contradict what Jude is saying!

NO!

You accuse unjustly once more! My faith is in His Word and I have proven over and over tongues is for today and it is speaking to God/ prayer/ magnifying God!

You did! Because tongues is praying in the spirit!

How many times do I have to quote this scriptures for you to see it!
"For if I pray in an tongue, MY SPIRIT PRAYETH...I will PRAY WITH THE SPIRIT and I will pray with the understanding also..."VS. 14-15 This is in context with tongues!

Then we just disagree!

Praying is not selfish!! Do you pray privately? Yes! Whether I pray in the spirit or pray with my understanding..either way I can do it in public or in private.

No where does it say they themselves understood what they were saying! ONly the ones listening! You are assuming that to fit your theology...but that would then contradict 1 Cor. where it says to pray for the interpretation! ANSWER THIS: WHY DOES IT SAY TO PRAY FOR THE INTERPRETATION IF YOU ALREADY KNOW WHAT YOU ARE SAYING???

You again have to believe it this way to fit your interpretation! But you can not find one example of tongues being used to evangalize in scripture. It is plain tongues is speaking to God not to man..1 Cor. 14:2 "For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unot God..." YOu have to ignore that scripture along with others to believe the way you do!

Sounds more like you are having more trouble with them than I am! BECAUSE THEY SPEAK LOADS OF TRUTH! Something you want to ingore!

Without the Holy Spirit one can not speak in tongues! It is through the Holy Spirit!

I see you continue to ignore and never answer that question...WHY PRAY FOR THE INTERPRETATION IF YOU ALREADY KNOW THE LANGUAGE??

That is getting old and it shows your inability to answer the post!
I was speaking about God's gift/tongues! You continually call God's gift gibberish!

As I have said many times before..stay in your unbelief concerning tongues!

You are not speaking the truth about that verse He does not say do not do it...because then he would contradict his statement "forbid not to speak in tongues." You need to read that verse again!

If you could answer this question it would give you the answer to those questions you keep asking over and over while ignoring vs. 13." Why does he tell us to pray for the interpretation if we know what we are saying?"

So now you are going to limit the power of the Holy Spirit on all the gifts? Where does it say can not!! It says to lay hands on the sick...they could be in the hospital, in their bed at home...anywhere! YOU LIMIT GOD! He does not put limits on where He will or can manifest in any of His gifts!

Do you deny that 1 Cor. 2 says we speak to God (that is prayer), vs. 14-17 ..We give thanks in the spirit (that is praying/speaking to God). If you are going to ignore those...why give more?

I do not ignore it! I just do not build a doctrine on it! I believe what the word say over any movement or religion/man made theology.

 

Well..you are entitled to your opinion! Just glad I do not base by life with Christ on it! I base it on the Word of God!

 

Graphe is the "written word" "writings"
Logos is the "understood message of the graphe/writings/scriptures"
Rhema is the Logos declared. Rhema is utterance, words spoken or decalred.

The graphe (book/Bible/written) gives us the logos (understanding of the graphe) so we can Rhema (declare/stand on).
Rhema is what the Spirit uses in warfare.

 

No you don't, as has been shown.

Just curious, believing as you do, why do you not join an Assembly of God or something similar?

 

[/quote]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speaking_in_tongues

True Christian gifts cannot be duplicated so easily by Satan, and so often by Satan. Satan flees at the power of God. But here he is mocking it. Why? Because what is being done in the name of Christianity isn't genuine Christianity. It is imitation, fake, fraudulent. Satan knows it, and also is mocking it in other pagan religions.

 

Yup, it sure does sound ridiculous ... there's no question about that!

But, I think you're tired of reading what I've been saying for months:
God reveals spiritual Truths through spiritual revelation.

Of course, this includes when one is reading the Scriptures.

Add to that ... God moves in mysterious ways.
He has explained that He enjoys making people look foolish who think they are so wise (1 Cor 1).
It's all about blessing SOME people with far-out spiritual truths, which seem idiotic to others.
Ref. the "foolish" gospel (1 Cor 1:18).
If not this example, why not others? ... God certainly is capable of it.

I think you're also tired of seeing this passage:
“And I (Jesus) will pray (to) the Father, and He will give you another Helper,
that He may abide with you forever -- the Spirit of truth
… you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you.
I will not leave you orphans; I will come to you.
… If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him,
and We will come to him and make Our home with him.
… But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name,
He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you.”
(John 14:16-26)

You might just consider that this teaching can go beyond only the interpreting of Scripture.

Signing off now from Star #3846192 ...
.

 

God's revelation is closed. We have the Word of God--God's complete revelation to mankind. To put yourself on the same level as God's inspired prophets and apostles who by the inspiration penned the very words of God, is blasphemous.

But not contrary to His Word, as you would have us to believe.

Are you admitting that you are looking foolish these days?

God doesn't have "far-out" spiritual truths. He is a God of order and not of chaos.

Do you think the gospel is foolish? Sad.

God does not go against His Word.
The gift of languages has ceased.
God does not recognize your gibberish as "His" gift. It is not. It belongs in the enemy's camp.

He doesn't teach you all things does he? Are you omniscient? God?
The verse doesn't apply to you. He was speaking to his disciples who would later pen the words that are now recorded in the NT. Unless you can claim the same omniscience that God has "all truth" that verse was not written to you.

No, I don't consider anything beyond what the Scripture teaches.
That is what Gnosticism is all about.
Is that what you teach?

 

You definitely could be" pentecostal"and not be word of faith. A lot of Pentecostals do not like nor agree with much of the word of faith teachings. But about all Pentecostals would agree that physical healing was provided for us in the atonement.

 

Whats wrong with the church I am in?

 

WHat????? How does this prove what was shown in scriture to be wrong? Why can't you just stick to scripture!

 

2 Timothy 3:8 Now as Jannes and Jambres withstood Moses, so do these also resist the truth: men of corrupt minds, reprobate concerning the faith.
--These two magicians were emissaries for Satan imitating the miracles of Moses. But they could not do very much. God's power was too great. There came a point when even the magicians told Pharaoh that the God of Moses was the true God, and that He was destroying the land.

The true power of God cannot be imitated by Satan.
That is why Jesus and the apostles warned to beware of false prophets. You shall know them by their fruits (doctrine). They shall come to you as wolves in sheep's clothing. These are the Charismatics.
The real wolves are openly out there. I gave you an URL to where they practice their religion: Voodooism, Hinduism, Mormonism; they all speak in tongues.
The same wolves dress up in sheep's clothing wander among the sheep and pretend to do God's will. But what they have is not of God, and never was of God. Their "tongue" is gibberish, not real "languages" as it was in Biblical times. It always has been gibberish. It is a pagan practice, and never came on the "Christian" scene until 1905.
But the Bible says:

2 Corinthians 6:14 Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?
15 And what concord hath Christ with Belial? or what part hath he that believeth with an infidel?
16 And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.

 

I don't know, maybe nothing. I just was wondering how many in it believe as you do. If you're the only one, you must feel out of place.

 

I'll tell you another way to recognize a false prophet: money. These people on television who are always begging for money are false prophets. Mike Murdock is one of the worst, always exhorting people to sow a $1000 seed or other amount and telling them they'll never be poor again.

He and his kind are not prophets; they are "profits".

 

Well, again you have taken scriptures and added your own little twist to it. I could do the same, but I am not going to play that game!

If Charismatic is believing in the manifestations of the Holy Spirit in 1 Cor. 12...then I am one.. along with others on this board! So according to your post we are unrighteous, darkness, wolves in sheep clothing, infidel and the devil etc. Is this what you stoop to when you can not answer questions like...WHY DOES IT SAY TO PRAY FOR THE INTERPRETATION IF WE KNOW THE LANGUAGE OR UNDERSTAND WHAT WE PRAY?Would you like me to post all the verses on unbelief?

 

You would be surprised how many in churches all around/every denomination that believe as I do.

 

I will agree with this...if the main focus is money...watch out!