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Featured Do Mormon Martyrs go to Heaven?

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Steven Yeadon, Oct 2, 2017.

  1. Steven Yeadon

    Steven Yeadon Active Member
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    I ask this question because I myself cannot make up my mind on it, yet this is a vital question to my current accepted beliefs about living for Jesus.

    Really, I am asking if anyone who is a false teacher or accepts false teaching goes to heaven when they die? Another key question, is do you go to heaven if you died a martyr for a different Gospel to the biblical one?

    This rule could also be applied to Jehovah's Witnesses, Roman Catholics, Orthodox, and Seventh Day Adventists among other people who are loosely "Christian" and die for their faith.
     
  2. Squire Robertsson

    Squire Robertsson Administrator
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    Nope.
     
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  3. Sapper Woody

    Sapper Woody Well-Known Member

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    There is no intent to trivialize your question in my reply, though I understand that it may come across that way. But clear biblical teaching shows that there is only one way into Heaven, and that is through the shed blood of Jesus Christ. If it were allowable for anyone who died for their faith to enter Heaven, then that would mean that there was more than one way, and that would invalidate Christ's statement of Him being the only way.

    Now, I do believe that there are saved Mormons, Catholics, etc. But I believe that they found the truth and accepted Christ in spite of their religion, not because of it. I've personally met a Catholic who was able to explain to me exactly the biblical way of Salvation, and believed wholeheartedly in it. Yet they would not leave the Catholic church, and actually thought that the Catholic church taught what they had found on their own in the Bible.

    But, back to your question, with God being consistent and never changing as He is, simply ask yourself this question to answer your original question: would God allow an atheist into Heaven if they died for their faith? The obvious answer is no. So, since the statements are equivalent, God will not allow someone who believes incorrectly into Heaven simply because they die for their faith.
     
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  4. Steven Yeadon

    Steven Yeadon Active Member
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    I consider your reply an honest and sound one, it trivialized nothing.

    I already have a scripture coming to mind on this, but before making up my mind fully, I will wait for more counsel and post this on another message board than BB. Proverbs says it is good to have many counselors (Proverbs 11:14 and Proverbs 15:22). The scripture that came to mind is (Galatians 1:8-12). It would appear that to teach a Gospel that goes against the bible is to be accursed. This is a harrowing thing to think.
     
    #4 Steven Yeadon, Oct 2, 2017
    Last edited: Oct 2, 2017
  5. Reynolds

    Reynolds Well-Known Member
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    Do Islamic Jihadists go to Heaven?
     
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  6. Billx

    Billx Member
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    I would Never take it upon myself to condemn anybody to the underworld. Although Mormonism is a heresy it's a pain in the drain I'm still not going to say they're all going to hell where there are markers are going to heaven . Just not my job. All I can say is there a heresy but God didn't call me to be the one to judge it. I hope that doesn't make me a liberal but I am not sure all Christian saints are in heaven nor are they making intercession for my sins.
     
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  7. annsni

    annsni Administrator
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    There is salvation only in Christ and since the Mormons do not believe in the true Christ, their faith is in false gods and as such, they will not go to heaven with their beliefs.
     
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  8. agedman

    agedman Well-Known Member
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    The “sermon on the mount” delivered to the Jews who did not need contextual living clues to fully appreciate what was being taught. Unlike the gentiles, the Jews were separatist, and condemned all others as unworthy mongrels.

    Immediately following instruction about anxiety and reliance, the Lord states that it is within the authority of God to condemn, and not a shared responsibility with the humankind.

    Therefore, when discussions like this take place, it is wise to refrain from blanket judgment that would assign eternity.

    However, that does not remove the responsibility of discernment concerning who is or is not a follower of Christ.

    To that end, the principle one must engage is that of what truth is based upon.

    Nearly all cults mentioned life up some writing or person in which to place more importance upon than that of the Word and Christ.

    If such is done, they indeed are already condemned, and believers are to publish the errors as a warning for others not to be deceived.
     
  9. David Kent

    David Kent Active Member
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    As I Understand Mormon teaching from one who had a lot of dealings with them, they believe that they will live on their own planet with their sons and their families.

    Some students at Kent university were invited to a Mormon lecture, they took the above brother with them. After the lecture they asked for questions. There were none, then the brother said, "I have one." "Yes" they said, "You said that you will live on your own plane t with your sons and their families, is that correct?" "Yes." "But won't your sons want their own planets?" He said he was then escorted from the building with a burly Mormon on each arm.
     
  10. Steven Yeadon

    Steven Yeadon Active Member
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    Galatians 3, Galatians 4, and Galatians 5 along with these responses have convinced me that strict adherence to false teaching is a reprobate sin and will prove a lack of heartfelt faith. There are plenty of dire warnings in the New Testament about avoiding false teaching and the dire eternal consequences of associating with false teachers, including 2 John. I will of course wait for more input, but the bible seems pretty clear to me at this point. This is personally devastating, as most people I have known in Christianity have been outside of churches that strictly obey the bible.

    -EDIT-

    Of course, I understand that people may be committing these sins in ignorance, which seems to mean a finite punishment (Luke 12:48). I suspect a number of people, including many who die for their faith overseas could be like this. Also, committing these sins can be repented of if someone knows it is sin.
     
    #10 Steven Yeadon, Oct 3, 2017
    Last edited: Oct 3, 2017
  11. rsr

    rsr <b> 7,000 posts club</b>
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    For someone who rejects champions of orthodoxy of the past, you seem to be quite willing to come to your own conclusions on who is saved and who is not. We are to contend to the faith, but we must realize that only God knows who are His and that there is a possibility we may not be among them no matter what orthodoxy we proclaim.
     
  12. Steven Yeadon

    Steven Yeadon Active Member
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    This was a separate but related issue to me. It was only after making up my mind over here, that I could make up my mind over in the other thread. This one made up my mind for me in many ways. I see that incorrect Gospels are that terrible, and I must really just process my emotions and think some more on where to go next with my cumulative beliefs.
     
  13. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
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    The question is very simple. It requires nor deserves any long term discussion. The answer is no. They are lost and the lost are separated from God regardless of why they died.
     
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  14. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    ONLY those who have received the Jesus of the Bible go to heaven, period!
     
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  15. agedman

    agedman Well-Known Member
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    But sometimes the reader needs to know the "why" or the Scripture principle involved in making such a determination.

    :)
     
  16. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
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    If a saved born again person does not already know why there is a problem.
     
  17. TCassidy

    TCassidy Administrator
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    Can a false Jesus save?

    In Mormonism, Jesus is a created being, the result of sexual relations between god and his goddess wife who used to be people from another planet who became gods.

    The Mormon Jesus has a brother, born from the same parents, who is the devil.

    Also, in Mormonism, their god has a body of flesh and bones (Doctrine & Covenants 130:22) as does his wife, and together they produce spirit babies in heaven who then inhabit human bodies on earth.

    Does that sound like the Jesus of the Bible to you?
     
  18. Baptist Believer

    Baptist Believer Well-Known Member
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    More than that, labels are essentially meaningless.

    The issue is whether or you not as an individual have entered into the Kingdom of God, not what organization you affiliate with. Some organizations, like disciple-making Christian churches, will be a great benefit to entering the Kingdom. Others will be much more of a hindrance, if not a huge obstance:

    Luke 13:24-29
    [Jesus said,] “Strive to enter through the narrow door; for many, I tell you, will seek to enter and will not be able. Once the head of the house gets up and shuts the door, and you begin to stand outside and knock on the door, saying, ‘Lord, open up to us!’ then He will answer and say to you, ‘I do not know where you are from.’ Then you will begin to say, ‘We ate and drank in Your presence, and You taught in our streets’; and He will say, ‘I tell you, I do not know where you are from; depart from Me, all you evildoers.’ In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth when you see Abraham and Isaac and Jacob and all the prophets in the kingdom of God, but yourselves being thrown out. And they will come from east and west and from north and south, and will recline at the table in the kingdom of God."

    There will be many who are quite religious who have never entered the Kingdom and will be shut out of it at the end of the age. At the same time, there will be those from the "...east and west and from north and south..." that will also take their place at the table.

    Fundamentally, we know that God will do what is right, merciful and just. The real question is what do you do about the claims of Jesus and the call to discipleship that He extends to you.
     
  19. TCassidy

    TCassidy Administrator
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    When you say "Kingdom" what Kingdom are you talking about?

    1. The Universal/Eternal Kingdom where God reigns over all of Creation.
    2. The spiritual Kingdom where Christ reigns in the hearts of His people.
    3. The Mediatorial Kingdom which Christ will establish on Earth at His coming.

    And how does one go about entering that Kingdom?
     
  20. Baptist Believer

    Baptist Believer Well-Known Member
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    I am speaking of the Kingdom of God (the reign of God - where God's will is done), that has been, is present now, and will always be.

    Yes.

    Yes, as long as we understand that "spiritual" is referring to a present reality and not just an intellectual construction.

    I'm unfamiliar with the concept of a future "mediatorial" kingdom, so I cannot properly respond.

    Jesus explained it a number of different ways that are fundamentally the same.

    "Repent (set aside our old way of thinking and living) for the Kingdom of Heaven (aka "Kingdom of God") is at hand (readily available)" (Matthew 4:17)


    “If anyone wishes to come after Me, he must deny himself, and take up his cross daily (set aside our old way of thinking and living) and follow Me (present reality). For whoever wishes to save his life will lose it, but whoever loses his life for My sake, he is the one who will save it. For what is a man profited if he gains the whole world, and loses or forfeits himself?" (Luke 9:23-25)

    ",,,One thing you still lack; sell all that you possess and distribute it to the poor (set aside your old way of thinking and living), and you shall have treasure in heaven; and come, follow Me (present reality).” (Luke 18:22b)
     
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